Will Jeep switch to IFS in the Wrangler?

[NCOBX]

Lol @ SJWs. I agree that they won’t change it unless their sales start to tank which is unlikely. My point is just that their open air experience is what keeps them safe from competition, not their solid front axle. Bronco is their first real competition.

I don’t doubt that the Bronco will take at least 50k sales. But betting against the Wrangler has been a bad bet for longer than any of us have been alive.

Let me clarify I’m not a front solid axle aficionado but Jeep has kept them relevant while competition has came to market with big applause and later died off a quiet death.

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[NCOBX]

I don’t doubt that the Bronco will take at least 50k sales. But betting against the Wrangler has been a bad bet for longer than any of us have been alive.

Let me clarify I’m not a front solid axle aficionado but Jeep has kept them relevant while competition has came to market with big applause and later died off a quiet death.

And FWIW open air didn’t save the Scout, the original 4Runner, H1, original Defender, Bronco, K5, original Ram Charger, I think Nissan had something in there, Samurai, Daihatsu Rocky, probably others.

 

[EvlNvrDys]

Independent Front suspension has been common place on the market for 40 years on SUVs. Why do you think this is suddenly a big deal to consumers?

The market for IFS SUVs has come and gone to the point there was only one (non-Lux) IFS Midsize competitor to the Wrangler.

Not to mention the Wrangler outsells the 4Runner by about double.

Probably because the Wrangler and 4 Runner are 2 totally different vehicles, marketed completely.

Why don't you go outside and start stopping people in Jeeps on the road and ask them WHY they bought it. I bet you'd be lucky to find 2% of people saying I bought it for a solid front axle. It wasn't that long ago that Jeep almost made the Wrangler with IFS if I remember correctly, and I bet in a few years once Ford starts to cut into Wrangler sales that Jeep will once again consider IFS. Or maybe they'll consider IFS after the 1st V8 Wranglers experiences death wobble.

But that's just my opinion. So if you want to sit here and argue Jeep vs. Toyota vs. the little scooter you drive down at the shore, go right ahead. I could really care less.

 

[AcesandEights]

You're not going to be able to stop people and have more than 2% say they bought the Bronco for the IFS either. The suspension/drivetrain isn't why people buy vehicles, not overtly. They may buy it because it rides nice, but they won't know why.

Hell, I've heard many many more people say they're buying the Bronco because the top comes off, or they won't consider another vehicle because the top doesn't come off. No one is buying the Bronco for the IFS.

 

[NCOBX]

Probably because the Wrangler and 4 Runner are 2 totally different vehicles, marketed completely.

Why don't you go outside and start stopping people in Jeeps on the road and ask them WHY they bought it. I bet you'd be lucky to find 2% of people saying I bought it for a solid front axle. It wasn't that long ago that Jeep almost made the Wrangler with IFS if I remember correctly, and I bet in a few years once Ford starts to cut into Wrangler sales that Jeep will once again consider IFS. Or maybe they'll consider IFS after the 1st V8 Wranglers experiences death wobble.

But that's just my opinion. So if you want to sit here and argue Jeep vs. Toyota vs. the little scooter you drive down at the shore, go right ahead. I could really care less.

It would be one thing if Jeep was struggling to sell trucks. But if, as you claim, so few people understand the suspension design on their Jeep - why then would Jeep change the suspension to satisfy people that don’t care? The ones that do care clearly want the solid axle so it makes no sense to market to the consumers that don’t care.

 

[AcesandEights]

not a jeep guy, not even an off road guy yet...but outside looking in Jeep hasn't had much competition to be innovative
that has drastically changed

I don't think that's true at all. There have been, as noted by others, 4x4s, two-doors, 4-doors, convertibles, etc. made by all of the manufacturers of autos, foreign and domestic and the Wrangler keeps selling. Jeep has had competition for 70+ years.

A solid axle is more robust. It's better for most people, from a durability/maintenance stand-point. An IFS rides nicer, through the steering wheel, but it isn't a better system. Jeep has already improved the ride with the SFA, they don't need to go IFS.

 

[Big Boss]

Those 195k other people don't know the difference between SFA and IFS. Most don't know what's under the hood, they don't know what 2.3, or 2.7 or 3.6 even mean, let alone what suspension or axle configuration they have.

This is pretty much why I said I don't see it happening. People buy a jeep for the image/top off/doors off/ a multitude of other things. Unless people start suddenly complaining about the SFA, I think Jeep will stick with it

 

[Squatch]

From a pic on jlwranglerforums by DayJ, but I covered the license plates for them.

 

[PDiddy]

I keep seeing topics on how the bronco is just going to destroy the Wrangler market.

First, the wrangler was already competing with the bronco and out lasted it. It will share some market with the bronco but will be fine.

Second, the Wrangler is not ditching its solid axles. They have never ditched the windshield dropping down and that is pretty much never used at this point. But it’s heritage. It’s the wranglers DNA. Just like the axles.

Last, people may never take their Jeep or Bronco off road at all. That doesn’t matter. What sells is the baddest rig on the block. That’s why the Raptors sell like hot cakes. People are not heading out to the desert and jumping their raptors. It doesn’t matter. It’s a bad a$$ truck that can jump if you want it to. Even though it will never leave the ground. The Jeep is the best go anywhere vehicle there is. Even if that’s only to the mall.

It’s always interesting how people want a brand that is not their choice to fail. We hope deep down that the one we chose will destroy the rest. I want them all to succeed. I want Toyota to go “Oh crap! We need to bring back an FJ!” Or Nissan to bring back an updated XTerra. I’m down to have an era of bad a$$ off road SUVs. I would love one each!

Within a year I’m going to have a bronco on one side of my garage and gladiator on the other. It’s going to be like Romeo and Juliet. Of course the gladiator will be Romeo...

 

[VictoryLights]

And FWIW open air didn’t save the Scout, the original 4Runner, H1, original Defender, Bronco, K5, original Ram Charger, I think Nissan had something in there, Samurai, Daihatsu Rocky, probably others.

Good point. I’m not betting against Jeep.

 

[Evolkidbell]

Eventually the straight axle will be dropped. It’s getting harder and harder to make a vehicle like the Wrangler, from many angles.
If regulations change and push safety features like lane assist or adaptive steering as mandatory, that’ll drive FCA to IFS on the Wrangler.
I also remember a lot of chatter about the potential for the JL to be IFS.

 

[AcesandEights]

Why would they drop the SFA. For what benefit would they do that?

 

[NCOBX]

Eventually the straight axle will be dropped. It’s getting harder and harder to make a vehicle like the Wrangler, from many angles.
If regulations change and push safety features like lane assist or adaptive steering as mandatory, that’ll drive FCA to IFS on the Wrangler.
I also remember a lot of chatter about the potential for the JL to be IFS.

Doesnt the F250 have adaptive steering or lane keep available? I know they have a motor right in the steering column to make automated changes.

 

[Evolkidbell]

Doesnt the F250 have adaptive steering or lane keep available? I know they have a motor right in the steering column to make automated changes.

From what I’ve read, the SDs have a warning system, not a corrective system.
From some articles I’ve read, it gets very difficult the have a corrective system that works through a steering box. Too much backlash/error.
Going to IFS affords a rack with direct inputs to the system and direct corrections back into the steering.
It was actually one of the arguments that Ford Engineering gave for going IFS vs SFA

 

[NCOBX]

T

From what I’ve read, the SDs have a warning system, not a corrective system.
From some articles I’ve read, it gets very difficult the have a corrective system that works through a steering box. Too much backlash/error.
Going to IFS affords a rack with direct inputs to the system and direct corrections back into the steering.
It was actually one of the arguments that Ford Engineering gave for going IFS vs SFA

The 250s have the steering input in the steering wheel, if you start looking at steering wheel swaps for those trucks you’ll see what I mean.
There is a motor with a physical gear turning the steering shaft.

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