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Why do they have such a hard time deciding to put the 5.0 in?

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Wow.. twin turbo Coyote in an RCSB.. that thing must be an animal!

Hopefully you go the 4x4 because I don't see how else you could get 900HP to the ground in a 4x2.. I can't seem to keep mine from spinning and it is bone stock!
It's 4x2, but it has lived most of its life on 315 width drag radials :ROFLMAO:
Ford Bronco Why do they have such a hard time deciding to put the 5.0 in? 20190919_120813
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Maybe Ford could produce a smaller V8 in the future? Make it 3.02L to play for the nostalgia of the old 302. It would give you the sound of a V8 with a smaller size. Just an idea. A small Ecoboost V8 would certainly make headlines.
 

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My only experience with the coyote was my buddy’s 2014 F150 I drove a handful of times. It was totally adequate, but the problem with the coyote is the torque is all up high. 2.7 makes peak torque at 2750 RPM, coyote makes it at 4250. That is an enormous usability difference, since I’d imagine 90% of drivers rarely get above 3500rpm on a day to day.
The 2015+ drove a lot better with the 5.0 thanks to being lighter. Then once they went to the Gen 3 5.0 and 10R80 they drive awesome, but the Ecoboosts also evolved and got better... and still drive better in daily situations IMO.
 

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Maybe Ford could produce a smaller V8 in the future? Make it 3.02L to play for the nostalgia of the old 302. It would give you the sound of a V8 with a smaller size. Just an idea. A small Ecoboost V8 would certainly make headlines.
FoMoCo certainly could... There are several European automakers who have had success in the 4.0-4.4L range for V8's. I'm sure there are several people at Ford who would love to get the green light to design and manufacture one. Ford has just invested SOOOO much money in the Ecoboost line it seems like the future is Ecoboost + Electric power.
 

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I like the fact that with just a little cash outlay on a tune you can really wake up the Ecoboost motors. Or almost any setup with a turbo really.
 

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The reason why Ford is reluctant to put in a 5.0L V8 into many of their vehicles is fuel economy requirements and regulations. There are rules on corporate wide Fuel Economy requirements and more inefficient engines, such as the V8 make it more challenging to meet these benchmarks.

In addition, in many markets around the world, specifically China, there are taxes based on displacement. A naturally aspirated V8 with higher displacement is more heavily taxed than a smaller turbocharged engine, even if fuel economy is decent with the V8

So, because of both of these reasons, and the fact that the 2.3L and 2.7L are in many more vehicles (more manufacturing scale), the 5.0L V8 is fairly uncommon and growing more so in Ford vehicles.
 

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Test drive is what sold me on the 2.7 over the 5.0 when I bought my F-150. The 5.0 was pretty lethargic off the line. The 2.7 you punch it and you're gone. Even cruising at 60 on the highway and punch it the torque is plentiful. Feels like driving a sports car. I'm going to be plenty happy with the 2.7 in my Bronco.
 

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Maybe Ford could produce a smaller V8 in the future? Make it 3.02L to play for the nostalgia of the old 302. It would give you the sound of a V8 with a smaller size. Just an idea. A small Ecoboost V8 would certainly make headlines.
There's a reason automakers stopped making small V6s and are doing larger I4s or turbo I4s in their place. In the '90s Ford had a 2.5L V6, Mazda had a 1.8L V6. The 3.0 V6 reigned supreme on Fords and Toyotas and Hondas and more for quite a few years, then mid-00s everyone went 3.5 or 3.7 V6. Those small V6s that were putting out ~170-200hp were usurped by 2.5L I4s that could do the same horsepower but with way better mileage. And the turbo 4s are now easily making up to 300hp, pushing out the NA V6 altogether.

Note that the Mazda6 not only gets 10mpg better, but it's also faster than the Taurus.

Ford Bronco Why do they have such a hard time deciding to put the 5.0 in? taurus-6.PNG


If you can have:
- 1 head gasket instead of two
- 1 exhaust manifold instead of two
- 2 cats instead of 4
- a single bank of cylinders instead of the width of two
- 2 cams instead of 4
- 4 pistons instead of 6
- etc etc etc
...and make the same power? Wins all around.

V6 vs. V8 suffer some of the same problems (though not all since you still have two banks). The total linear length of piston to wall contact affects your engine's mechanical losses. It's more frictional area, more heat, more loss, less efficiency - it's worth 5% of the total engine losses on its own.

Look at Ford's 3.5 NA V6 vs. their 3.4 NA V8 from the '96-99 SHO. If you look at the circumference of each cylinder's bore on the V6, you get a total piston-ring-contact-length of 68". On the V8, it's 81". So for the same displacement, you have a 19% increase in piston ring contact length, adding to heat and frictional loss, hurting your mpgs.

When you keep the displacement the same but add cylinders, you usually end up with a smaller bore and shorter stroke. If you have a shorter stroke, you can rev the engine higher before you run into troublesome piston speeds. So in general, a 3.0L V12 can rev higher than a 3.0 V8, which can rev higher than a 3.0 V6, which can rev higher than a 3.0 I4, all other things equal. Revving higher means making more power up at the tippy top of the powerband. Awesome for race cars, terrible for trucks. For the same displacement, a V8 will likely be heavier, get worse mpg, and make worse power low in the powerband than an equivalent V6.

I get it, I4s and V6s generally sound like garbage, but there's no good argument for installing a V8 that makes less than 450hp when turbos exist.
 

Toccoa

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There's a reason automakers stopped making small V6s and are doing larger I4s or turbo I4s in their place.

...
I agree. I was just saying for nostalgia (and sound), Ford could shrink down a V8, to at least get some more efficiency out of it.

I was a big fan of V6 power in the 90s (still am). It’s amazing what kind of power can be made with a smaller engine now.
 

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Maybe because it’s about 32 inches wide

Ford Bronco Why do they have such a hard time deciding to put the 5.0 in? taurus-6.PNG
Mine is 29", outside of header to outside of header (which are just a hair each wider than upper edge of head/ "valve cover"). Mine's transverse, but 2.7 in my Fusion, including turbos and all other piping related to intake, is 27" wide.
 

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My only experience with the coyote was my buddy’s 2014 F150 I drove a handful of times. It was totally adequate, but the problem with the coyote is the torque is all up high. 2.7 makes peak torque at 2750 RPM, coyote makes it at 4250. That is an enormous usability difference, since I’d imagine 90% of drivers rarely get above 3500rpm on a day to day.
yeah my 5.0 mustang is pretty sleepy at low RPMs, but it still slurps gas at a worrisome rate. I don’t think this engine would be that great for crawling or basically anything where you’ll need a lot of low end torque.
 

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It's 4x2, but it has lived most of its life on 315 width drag radials :ROFLMAO:
Ford Bronco Why do they have such a hard time deciding to put the 5.0 in? taurus-6.PNG
Ahh, yeah that makes sense. I bet that thing pulls hard, would love to see it in action.

I will say a bronco with the 2.7 with base skinny tires will have lots of one wheel burnouts in 2H.

Wish they offered the rear e-locker as a standalone option on the base..
 

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The customer is king and has shown for the last several years that they prefer EcoBoost engines over the V8 in the F-150.
When you undersize a V-8 for 20 odd years (4.6??, what was the point), and then come out with your "BIG" motor, that is still only 5.0, of course. GM and FCA got it, Ford never did (not even back in the 80's when GM put an underachieving 5.7 in the Camaro, but it put out way more torque than even the long runner 5.0, HO). All this time we could have had bigger V-8's from Ford, but as mentioned, no way they come out with one now.

It does get tiring over and over having to explain why linear power is important to some of us and that the torque of a NA motor, even if less than an ECO, will come on instantly. Won't matter much on the street, overlanding, or even in the desert. But some of us don't care about any of that, we'd like the control and response that we are used too, for hard core technical wheeling.

What I don't get is if the ECO's are so much better than V-8's, and there is so many available, why is the LS still king of swaps?? (even as small as 350Z's or Miatas).
 

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What I don't get is if the ECO's are so much better than V-8's, and there is so many available, why is the LS still king of swaps?? (even as small as 350Z's or Miatas).
Cheap, cheap, cheap, and TONS of aftermarket support. LS/LT engine architecture goes back to the 60's...

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