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AZ_Liberty

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I think you're also forgetting those who had multiple reservations. I would say the 200K+ reservation number isn't something we should base it off of either.
Ford had roughly 190k reservations by Feb of last year, with roughly 120k conversions. We know that because they announced that in their press releases. We are also reasonably certain that over half of those the reservations were in the first 72 hours.

But, the reservation lines stayed open for months afterward, and folks with earlier reservations also converted after Feb, once it started looking like Ford was actually going to start building them.

We don't know the actual numbers, but it's probably around 160-180k reservations converted to orders. But after they cut off reservations, they let people order directly. And they let some dealers order stock. Also remember that there were around 3500 mannequins which were built and sold (eventually) as dealer stock.

So, Ford has a long way to go to fill the reservations, and their transparency has been horrible.

And for what it's worth (Drink) my dealer claims they have received Zero stock Broncos. Given that they had around 500 orders, and in Phoenix a lot of folks were willing to downgrade to the squish top, I believe them.
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Arrowbear Rider

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Some dealers gouged the shit out of reservation holders, and Ford didn't care, many dealers sold to us non-reservation holders doing the price and build at MSRP. Whether or not your dealer is gouging prices has nothing to do with whether you are a reservation holder or not, and Ford has confirmed this.
First let me say: You are right some dealers are gouging reservation holders BUT there is nothing Ford can do about do it legally because of the state laws that protect those dealers monopolies/territories, you known the type of "fair business" laws that were passed under the guise that they needed protection from the big bad manufactures, so they could be autonomous from Ford are the same laws that allow them to do this; laws that those dealerships lobbied for.

I bet if you looked at all of the dealerships that are adding ADM to reservation holders, your going to see it happening more in certain areas, and a higher percentage in certain states where YOUR law makers have failed you. States where laws are passed to give the "small business owners" (up to 500 employees is NOT a small business!) more while they pay less in taxes because they are the job creators. States where the law makers care more about the rich guys that contribute to their campaigns (through dealership cartels... err I mean dealership groups) than they do about the voters.

Not one dealer that I used to audit ever took the Federal monies from the "Clunker buy back" or other stimulus and went out and hired more employees, the owners just took the money and put it in their pockets. But I know if Ford wasn't building those other units and sending them out even MORE dealers would be gouging. And the line needs to make those non-commodities constrained units to roll as fast as possible with the supply chain problems.

In my area, there are three local Ford dealership, Tuttle Click Ford, RSM Ford and Capistrano Ford and all three are respecting MSRP for reservation holders... because they have those other units to mark up, if your not a reservation holder your paying $15,000 ADM AND whatever other items they want to add for profit. Those 1 in 4 (25%) sales are making MSRP possible for the rest of us.

So, I ask you this, if there had been no reservation system and Broncos were just sent out as business as usual, would there be any Broncos out there NOT marked up? Very few dealers in today's supply chain problem world and with demand of over 200,000 wanting one would have even one Bronco on the lot for MSRP. If a dealer is getting 30-50 Broncos a month, but they have a wait list of 300 and more adding daily or weekly, are they going to charge MSRP?

Looking at the list of dealers (on this site) not charging ADM to reservation holders in my area and I can name another 6-8 (more the farther out you go) that are not charging ADM to reservation holders.

I'm sorry if you have a bad dealer or if you live where almost all of the dealer are charging ADM, but what does that tell you about them? Or your state laws?

I've seriously have only heard of a few in my area that are doing that, the rest are playing fair with us. That's probably 3 out of 15 that are shitty about it... And they were known to be shitty before all of this.
 
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RiotSquirrel

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Thought the order banks closed in March… how do they have Bronco sales numbers for April? (Am I missing something)
Vehicles don't count as "sold" when ordered (because you can still back out, its just an order), it only counts as "sold" once you (or someone else) has signed on the dotted line and actually bought it. or that's my understanding.
 

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I'd like to add, all of those dealers in my area have a waiting list of people that are willing to pay more than MSRP and those customers are NOT IN ORDER BY DATE, but in order of what they want and how much they are willing to pay. A customer that wants a base unit with no up grades that is willing to pay "only" $5,000 over is at the bottom of that list and will probably wait longer than most of us, while the "mall crawler" that will pay an ADM of $15,000 on a 4 doors soft top AND pay for the added lift, tires and wheels through the dealer (with more mark up) as well as "under coating" security etching on the glass are at the top of the wait list.

If sales and production is down due to commodities, then dealers are going to charge more when they can and those with bad timing (didn't reserve) but more monies will always win.
 
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Chippewa-Pin

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17% less produced in April compared to March. Not good. Unless they get back to producing 15k per month, there will be many that have to reorder for MY23. I just hope they will still honor price protection, but I doubt it.
 

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Vehicles don't count as "sold" when ordered (because you can still back out, its just an order), it only counts as "sold" once you (or someone else) has signed on the dotted line and actually bought it. or that's my understanding.
Awesome thanks for clarifying - makes sense
 

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First let me say: You are right some dealers are gouging reservation holders BUT there is nothing Ford can do about do it legally because of the state laws that protect those dealers monopolies/territories, you known the type of "fair business" laws that were passed under the guise that they needed protection from the big bad manufactures, so they could be autonomous from Ford are the same laws that allow them to do this; laws that those dealerships lobbied for.

I bet if you looked at all of the dealerships that are adding ADM to reservation holders, your going to see it happening more in certain areas, and a higher percentage in certain states where YOUR law makers have failed you. States where laws are passed to give the "small business owners" (up to 500 employees is NOT a small business!) more while they pay less in taxes because they are the job creators. States where the law makers care more about the rich guys that contribute to their campaigns (through dealership cartels... err I mean dealership groups) than they do about the voters.

Not one dealer that I used to audit ever took the Federal monies from the "Clunker buy back" or other stimulus and went out and hired more employees, the owners just took the money and put it in their pockets. But I know if Ford wasn't building those other units and sending them out even MORE dealers would be gouging. And the line needs to make those non-commodities constrained units to roll as fast as possible with the supply chain problems.

In my area, there are three local Ford dealership, Tuttle Click Ford, RSM Ford and Capistrano Ford and all three are respecting MSRP for reservation holders... because they have those other units to mark up, if your not a reservation holder your paying $15,000 ADM AND whatever other items they want to add for profit. Those 1 in 4 (25%) sales are making MSRP possible for the rest of us.

So, I ask you this, if there had been no reservation system and Broncos were just sent out as business as usual, would there be any Broncos out there NOT marked up? Very few dealers in today's supply chain problem world and with demand of over 200,000 wanting one would have even one Bronco on the lot for MSRP. If a dealer is getting 30-50 Broncos a month, but they have a wait list of 300 and more adding daily or weekly, are they going to charge MSRP?

Looking at the list of dealers (on this site) not charging ADM to reservation holders in my area and I can name another 6-8 (more the farther out you go) that are not charging ADM to reservation holders.

I'm sorry if you have a bad dealer or if you live where almost all of the dealer are charging ADM, but what does that tell you about them? Or your state laws?

I've seriously have only heard of a few in my area that are doing that, the rest are playing fair with us. That's probably 3 out of 15 that are shitty about it... And they were known to be shitty before all of this.
You're arguing the strawman there, all I did was correct your inaccuracy. I did the Price and Build in October, walked in to my dealer as a non-reservation holder and made an agreement for MSRP, just like thousands of other non-reservation holders did. I don't know where you came up with "And those that did get B&P theirs paid even more than the average $15,000 ADM", I've heard nothing here to indicate that is true.
 

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You're arguing the strawman there, all I did was correct your inaccuracy. I did the Price and Build in October, walked in to my dealer as a non-reservation holder and made an agreement for MSRP, just like thousands of other non-reservation holders did. I don't know where you came up with "And those that did get B&P theirs paid even more than the average $15,000 ADM", I've heard nothing here to indicate that is true.
First of all your lucky, congratulations. I see the mark up every time I go in and there have been plenty of people posting about large ADM, just because you haven't seen it here doesn't mean it's not happening. Look at the Carvana offers on Broncos

This was straight out of the mouth of a well known and trusted dealer contact I know from my Flooring Auditor days, not the dealer I bought from, but he did confirm as much (in his non-denial and half agreement response, doesn't want to give too much away) after I shared the conversation.

I don't know what you mean by arguing the "strawman", I'm only pointing out how the system generally works, not what every dealer is doing. What is your relationship with that dealer that let you cut the line with no ADM? I don't care. That's not what a lot of them are doing and not everyone is doing the same, i.e. Granger Ford v. the ones I mentioned above at MSRP, but not at invoice like Granger. But who's customers are going to wait longer?

It's different every where and you can always find an example of numbers out side of the pool of the norm if the pool is large enough, it's simple statistics.

You're picking apart one line of what 8 paragraphs, because of YOUR one experience?

Where did you get that "thousands are walking in, skipping the line and paying MSRP"?
 
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Mr. Nice

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First of all your lucky, congratulations. I see the mark up every time I go in and there have been plenty of people posting about large ADM, just because you haven't seen it here doesn't mean it's not happening. Look at the Carvana offers on Broncos

This was straight out of the mouth of a well known and trusted dealer contact I know from my Flooring Auditor days, not the dealer I bought from, but he did confirm as much (in his non-denial and half agreement response, doesn't want to give too much away) after I shared the conversation.

I don't know what you mean by arguing the "strawman", I'm only pointing out how the system generally works, not what every dealer is doing. What is your relationship with that dealer that let you cut the line with no ADM? I don't care. That's not what a lot of them are doing and not everyone is doing the same, i.e. Granger Ford v. the ones I mentioned above at MSRP, but not at invoice like Granger. But who's customers are going to wait longer?

It's different every where and you can always find an example of numbers out side of the pool of the norm if the pool is large enough, it's simple statistics.

You're picking apart one line of what 8 paragraphs, because of YOUR one experience?

Where did you get that "thousands are walking in, skipping the line and paying MSRP"?
You make a lot of valid points in your posts. I am certainly not in any position to challenge most all of what you say, and why would I? Very articulate.
Great job!
 

indio22

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First of all your lucky, congratulations. I see the mark up every time I go in and there have been plenty of people posting about large ADM, just because you haven't seen it here doesn't mean it's not happening. Look at the Carvana offers on Broncos

This was straight out of the mouth of a well known and trusted dealer contact I know from my Flooring Auditor days, not the dealer I bought from, but he did confirm as much (in his non-denial and half agreement response, doesn't want to give too much away) after I shared the conversation.

I don't know what you mean by arguing the "strawman", I'm only pointing out how the system generally works, not what every dealer is doing. What is your relationship with that dealer that let you cut the line with no ADM? I don't care. That's not what a lot of them are doing and not everyone is doing the same, i.e. Granger Ford v. the ones I mentioned above at MSRP, but not at invoice like Granger. But who's customers are going to wait longer?

It's different every where and you can always find an example of numbers out side of the pool of the norm if the pool is large enough, it's simple statistics.

You're picking apart one line of what 8 paragraphs, because of YOUR one experience?

Where did you get that "thousands are walking in, skipping the line and paying MSRP"?
Some guys who talk like it's nothing to show up and buy for MSRP, turns out they have a relationship with the dealer, having bought vehicles there in the past or whatever. Money talks in various ways. Not saying that is the case with this guy, but often that's "the rest of the story" (to riff on Andy Rooney).

I see G6 threads with people paying ADMs, other's egging them on to pay ADMs, and how 5k is reasonable "jump on it". With people buying multiple Broncos for use, or for resale to make a buck. The scene basically sucks as far as I'm concerned at this point.

Looking forward down the road, when Ford is spitting out Broncos, and any guy can easily buy a Bronco at a decent price and hit the trails. Flush all the other nonsense down the toilet.
 

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Is there
Bronco April 2022 Sales & Production Highlights
  • Bronco Sales: 13,113 vehicles. Sales (YTD): 36,686 vehicles.
    • April 2022 sales represent a 34.4% increase from March 2022.
  • Bronco Production: 12,237 vehicles. Production (YTD): 48,590 vehicles.
    • April 2022 production represents a -17.5% decrease from March 2022.
  • Ford brand SUVs achieved a new April monthly sales record. Bronco and Bronco family (including Bronco Sport) hit their best sales results since launch. Ford’s newest vehicles continue to conquest at the high rate of 70 percent.
  • Buyers of Ford’s newest vehicles are customizing them at unprecedented rates; for the first-quarter, winches and off-road lighting kits continue to be among the most popular for Bronco customers, while Maverick owners are choosing Ford lighting kits for their truck beds.



Screen Shot 2022-05-04 at 9.34.17 AM.jpg




Screen Shot 2022-05-04 at 9.34.37 AM.jpg




Screen Shot 2022-05-04 at 12.06.33 PM.jpg




Screen Shot 2022-05-04 at 12.06.51 PM.jpg
 

BrentL

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Bronco April 2022 Sales & Production Highlights
  • Bronco Sales: 13,113 vehicles. Sales (YTD): 36,686 vehicles.
    • April 2022 sales represent a 34.4% increase from March 2022.
  • Bronco Production: 12,237 vehicles. Production (YTD): 48,590 vehicles.
    • April 2022 production represents a -17.5% decrease from March 2022.
  • Ford brand SUVs achieved a new April monthly sales record. Bronco and Bronco family (including Bronco Sport) hit their best sales results since launch. Ford’s newest vehicles continue to conquest at the high rate of 70 percent.
  • Buyers of Ford’s newest vehicles are customizing them at unprecedented rates; for the first-quarter, winches and off-road lighting kits continue to be among the most popular for Bronco customers, while Maverick owners are choosing Ford lighting kits for their truck beds.



Screen Shot 2022-05-04 at 9.34.17 AM.jpg




Screen Shot 2022-05-04 at 9.34.37 AM.jpg




Screen Shot 2022-05-04 at 12.06.33 PM.jpg




Screen Shot 2022-05-04 at 12.06.51 PM.jpg
Is there any report, by config, of how many reservations were converted to orders and how many of those orders have been fulfilled. Originally it was something like 190K reservations. So how many converted and how have been delivered?
 

modshiva

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Bronco and Bronco sport in a dead heat in sales, I would've never guessed that.
People waiting on their Broncos are buying Sports in the mean time. haha
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