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Zeebo390

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Jesus how is an unoptioned 4 door BD 3-400 lbs heavier than every other trim besides the Badlands? Do a rear locker, steel bumpers, and rock rails really throw that much meat on it?
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jeep364

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Jesus how is an unoptioned 4 door BD 3-400 lbs heavier than every other trim besides the Badlands? Do a rear locker, steel bumpers, and rock rails really throw that much meat on it?
That does seem heavy...the Mopar steel front bumper on a rubicon JL is like 70# max. (its a very light steel bumper). The stock plastic is 33#.
 
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da_jokker

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So what is a 4 door wildtrack. Black Diamond is listed 2x so I figured the 2nd one might be a WT but the payload is the same so I think it may actually be the BD 2x.
 

OvrLnd99

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So what is a 4 door wildtrack. Black Diamond is listed 2x so I figured the 2nd one might be a WT but the payload is the same so I think it may actually be the BD 2x.
Several of us have asked this question in a few different threads, still waiting for a response. Hopefully we will get some info soon.
 

da_jokker

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Sever

Several of us have asked this question in a few different threads, still waiting for a response. Hopefully we will get some info soon.
Thanks... trying to keep up with all the threads and pages is impossible... i just don't get why the ONE time we actually get official Ford info on this and they Flub up the proof reading.... oh wait... never mind :sneaky:
 

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GVWR QA.png


View attachment 78360




Accompanying article:


Today Ford released the highly anticipated gross vehicle weight ratings for the upcoming 2021 Bronco. The data table provided by Ford (link) addresses some of the questions posed by reservation holders and enthusiasts over the last several weeks.

It is important to note that Ford derives these calculations for Bronco using an SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers) standard which provides a level playing field. The SAE standard, “Performance Requirements for Determining Tow-Vehicle Gross Combination Weight Rating and Trailer Weight Rating,” is known as J2807.

For example, SAE J2807 requires the manufacturer to use a vehicle equipped with options found on at least 33 percent of the vehicles produced for that model. It also factors in the equivalent of a 150-pound driver and passenger and a full tank of fuel.

When looking at the 2021 Jeep Wrangler Product Information available from FCA, you will see in the fine print, that Wrangler’s towing capacities are not derived using J2807. One obvious example is the use of one 150-pound passenger instead of two underscoring the difference in approach.



screen-shot-2021-01-13-at-4-10-45-pm-jpg.jpg




Let’s look at a real–life example to further illustrate. You and your family are going camping in your 4-Door Black Diamond Bronco. Assuming you are a 200 lb. driver, with a 130 lb. spouse, and two kids with a combined weight of 170 lbs, that’s a total of 500 lbs. Lets add in another 150 lbs. of luggage and gear along with a trendy 50 lbs, Yeti cooler you are now at 700 of your 1,161 leaving you a margin of 461 lbs.

Keep in mind that each modification like a light bar, bike rack, or roof top carrier, or added cargo eats away at your payload margin if it falls below the threshold of being a popular option on 33% or more of the models. If you are pulling a trailer, the tongue weight of the trailer is also added to this calculation. Typically, a good rule of thumb is 10% of the trailer weight is the approximate tongue (e.g. trailer hitch) weight. When properly equipped, a Bronco can two up to 3500 lbs, or 350 lbs of tongue weight reducing your 461 lbs to 111 lbs.

While these calculations done at home before your adventure are not particularly challenging, the math for manufactures is far more complex which ignited the debate online when Ford gave customers access to Build and Price.

It is important to keep in mind that when Ford calculates max payload, they have to account for the full capacity of the vehicle. This includes up to 4 passengers at 150 lbs for a 2 door and five passengers and their cargo (77 lbs), plus factory options. Unfortunately, most build and price sites lack the dynamic ability to account for each of these variables in real-time. For instance in the build and price tool Ford does not know how many passengers you’ll be carrying so it assumes the maximum and subtracts this from the GVWR.

BRONCO VS. WRANGLER

For comparison, the 2021 Jeep Wrangler max payload for 4-door models ranges from 1,136 (Sport 3.0L Diesel) -1,351 lbs (3.6L Manual) – depending on configuration – while the Bronco ranges from 924 lbs (First Edition) – 1,452 lbs (Big Bend 2.3L Manual). Please keep in mind that these numbers are driven by how the vehicle is equipped. More standard equipment, the higher the curb weight.


DETAILED DESCRIPTIONS:
Below are definitions and descriptions for some of these important calculations. We’ve also provided a link to all the data by series and will be providing towing details in an upcoming article.​
Gross Vehicle Weight (GVW) is the Base Curb Weight plus actual Cargo Weight plus passengers. It is important to remember that GVW is not a limit or specification – it is the actual weight that is obtained when the fully-loaded vehicle is driven onto a scale.​
Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) is the maximum allowable weight of the fully-loaded vehicle (including passengers and cargo). This number – along with other weight limits, as well as tire, rim size and inflation pressure data – is shown on the vehicle’s Safety Compliance Certification Label, located on the left front door lock facing or the door latch post pillar. The GVW must never exceed the GVWR.​
Gross Axle Weight (GAW) is the total weight placed on each axle (front and rear). To determine the Gross Axle Weights for your vehicle and trailer combination, take your loaded vehicle and trailer to a scale. With the trailer attached, place the front wheels of the vehicle on the scale to get the front GAW. For rear GAW, weigh the towing vehicle with trailer attached, but with just the four wheels of the vehicle on the scale. Subtracting front GAW from that amount gives you rear GAW.​
Gross Axle Weight Rating (GAWR) is the maximum weight to be carried by a single axle (front or rear). These numbers are also shown on the Safety Compliance Certification Label. The total load on each axle must never exceed its GAWR.​
Maybe I missed it, but what is the GVWR if you opt for a Sasqutch? Is it the same? Thanks
 

Used2jeep

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Not just Sasquatch that cannot get roof rails, e.g., Adding the 2.7 to the Badlands (no SAS) also drops the roof rails. I’m really confused too and pissed off that I have to spend time thinking about this. BL - Most capable version can’t get a roof rack or headliner. I know everyone says add it later, but Ford clearly doesn’t want us to and I have not seen a Ford official reason as to why.
Did the "garage" video with Esteban specifically say it was GVWR related? Pretty solid on that thought.
 

Brad Fx

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Did the "garage" video with Esteban specifically say it was GVWR related? Pretty solid on that thought.
What stood out the most was how he recommended Sasquatch reservation holders to wait for 22MY, not order it at the part desk, but to get the next year model. Absurd. I’m just going to get a each and install it.
 

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da_jokker

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If only they asked that simple question.

What is changing in 2022 to allow for roof racks? Is it Structural or just red-tape?
 

Unit91

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Homolagation related is a guess. It takes time to approve those things. Just like the seat back change from carpet to rubberized that we've questioned on BD and BL trims. Esteban covered that in a video as well.
Their goal is to get the product out asap and to as as many buyers as possible. 21MY is going to be constrained by covid, parts, and deferring of certain items.
 

Lakelife36

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If only they asked that simple question.

What is changing in 2022 to allow for roof racks? Is it Structural or just red-tape?
I feel like that's the issue with many of these Q&As. It's mostly softballs about information you can find if you read the documents they've put out instead of digging for the root issues.
Are you currently planning for X?
What is the engineering reason for Y?
 

Lakelife36

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I'm a geek and the max tow cap numbers still don't look right to me, so I did a little basic arithmetic in the table below. When you subtract the no-option curb weight and 300lbs for driver and passenger from each GCWR, there are only two cases where the resulting TWR (as per SAE J2807) is less than 3500lbs, and those are the 4-Door 2.7L BL and 4-Door FE. In every other case they are over 3500, with ~1/3 of them near or above 4000lbs.

Also of interest (to this guy anyways) is that:
-In all cases the TWR of the 2.7 is actually lower than the TWR of the same trim with the 2.3, regardless of transmission (in the 2.3)
-In all cases the TWR of the 4-Door is actually lower than the TWR of the 2-Door with the same trim, engine, and transmission

Given that the 2.3 tows 7500lbs in the Ranger and it will be other factors that govern the tow cap in this vehicle, it's not surprising that the 2.7 doesn't tow more than the 2.3 but it looks odd that it ends up towing less. It's only ~90lbs out of 3500 to 4200lbs so statistically insignificant and just the way the numbers work out I guess.

The 2-Door being able to tow more than the 4-Door by the numbers flies in the face of all logic though, and the 2-Door's numbers themselves are shockingly high - close to 4,200lbs for a Base and BB! Given that the GCWR is the same for both the 2-Door and 4-Door models I wonder if they only tested one and then used the same number for the other. I would assume that they would have to test the one assumed to be less capable, which should be the 2-Door, impying that the GCWR numbers for the 4-Door may actually end up higher with further testing.

2-Door4-Door
TrimEngineTransGCWRBase Curb WeightGCWR-BCW-300lbsBase Curb WeightGCWR-BCW-300lbs
Base2.37M878042864194N/AN/A
BB2.37M87804297418344674013
BD2.37M87804587389348253655
BL2.37M87804705377549453535
Base2.310A87804306417444764004
BB2.310A87804317416344873993
BD2.310A87804607387348453635
OBX2.310A87804406407445803900
BL2.310A87804725375549653515
Base2.710A88404458408246283912
BB2.710A88404469407146393901
BD2.710A88404781375949973543
OBX2.710A88404558398247313809
BL2.710A88404877366351173423
WT2.710A88404749379150003540
FE2.710A88404997354352563284
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