Advanced 4x4 automatic on demand engagement price?

[NCOBX]

I do agree that the “advanced” term is just marketing. It is essentially a more capable transfer case with one more “AWD” setting and lower gearing for 4L.

As for each brands proprietary systems to manage power transfer and brake control, I don’t know anything. What I do know, is I really like how Ford has “advanced” transfer cases with so many options. Add GOAT modes throttle control, trail assist, and all the other techno mumbo jumbo, you have so many different variations of control over all of the wheels.

Honestly all of those GOAT system settings, trail assist, etc - are designed to help novice off-roaders. People have been driving off-road in trucks for well over 100 years now and they have a all managed fine with a little common sense and experience.

They’re fun to talk about and show people but none of them are any match for common sense.

I can’t imagine ever using any more than the transfer case settings and locker switches in any real world conditions.

Ignore the software and focus on the hardware, the software can’t fix bad hardware.

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[madj613]

Honestly all of those GOAT system settings, trail assist, etc - are designed to help novice off-roaders. People have been driving off-road in trucks for well over 100 years now and they have a all managed fine with a little common sense and experience.

They’re fun to talk about and show people but none of them are any match for common sense.

I can’t imagine ever using any more than the transfer case settings and locker switches in any real world conditions.

Ignore the software and focus on the hardware, the software can’t fix bad hardware.

Agreed.

 

[NCOBX]

In normal driving on a dry paved road, if you have 4A, is there any benefit to every using 2H or is leaving it in 4A all the time ok? In rain & snow, is 4A better than 2H?

I want to be able to tell the wife to just leave it in 4A all the time and not worry about other options on the dial.

Thanks.

Auto 4wd is fine with really no downsides to leave engaged. No huge upside to it either in most cases unless the roads dictate the need.

AWD all the time means your using more fuel to constantly spin the front driveshaft and therefore axle. 2 High would definitely save fuel in this situation.

 

[Deleted member 3063]

One article described 4A as on demand 4 wheel drive with the traction control doing the demanding. Those traction control functions are confusing the discussion. Even when you're in 2H nanny is going to be braking spinning wheels as a regular part of it's duty unless you disable it. It will do the same thing in 4H and 4A.
4A is not AWD.

 

[bobby bunny time]

pretty sure the engagement" in "on demand" means one button push, little spikes coming out of your tires to help you climb mountains and tackle icy roads making it safe for others. that would explain the tax benefit from getting it.

 

[rtaylor]

AWD is proactive

Auto 4x4 is reactive

The two systems are very different.

There are very few transfer cases that offer both full time 4wd(AWD) and 2 wheel drive settings. Jeep offers them, I know Atlas builds some, but there aren’t many examples.

I don't think Bronco is going to get the dual-mode AWD system from Raptor, but I hope I am wrong.

One article described 4A as on demand 4 wheel drive with the traction control doing the demanding. Those traction control functions are confusing the discussion. Even when you're in 2H nanny is going to be braking spinning wheels as a regular part of it's duty unless you disable it. It will do the same thing in 4H and 4A.
4A is not AWD.

A problem is that Ford uses "4A" to describe its AWD systems as well as the auto-switch 2H/4H systems.

For example, the 2017-2020 Raptor's "4A" is a true dual-mode AWD system with computer-controlled torque split and mechanically locked 4H (best of both worlds). Whereas I think the pre-2017 Raptors "4A" was auto-switch from 2H to 4H after slip is detected (no front/rear torque split).

 

[AKBronc49]

All it is, is a newer better designed system that arrived in the new for 95 Explorer as "control-trac" 4x4 and the same system with beefier parts used on the 97 Expedition which also had a 2H/A4wd/4H/4L setting.

 

[madj613]

One article described 4A as on demand 4 wheel drive with the traction control doing the demanding. Those traction control functions are confusing the discussion. Even when you're in 2H nanny is going to be braking spinning wheels as a regular part of it's duty unless you disable it. It will do the same thing in 4H and 4A.
4A is not AWD.

I’m sorry, but I’m going to have to disagree with you there.

Although the Bronco will normally be in 2H for normal operation on every model, those models with the advanced transfer cases and the “4A” option will have the ability to leave the setting on all the time and function like a crossover which has it on all the time no matter what (Grand Cherokee, Subaru’s, etc) It is essentially an AWD setting with open center diff and a traction control system that will send power to whatever wheels need it. What makes the Bronco’s system great is that you can go from 2H, to 4A, to 4H, to 4L. UNLIKE a crossover. It’s all selectable and “on-demand”

4A is distinctly different from 4H, which is center diff locked. You should never drive for long periods of time on dry pavement with 4H because cornering issues and tire chirping or skipping.

Yes, even 2H and 4H will also have traction control.

I understand there is confusion about terminology through this entire thread, but the key to understanding all this is the status of the center diff. If it is open (with traction control)...AWD. If it is locked...4H (traditional).

My 2007 4Runner 4wd system starts out in 4H open center diff. I can drive all day everyday this way. When I manually lock the center diff, it then becomes a classic 4wd “part-time” style system.

Can we lay this to bed?

 

[BoatBuilder88]

I’m sorry, but I’m going to have to disagree with you there.

Although the Bronco will normally be in 2H for normal operation on every model, those models with the advanced transfer cases and the “4A” option will have the ability to leave the setting on all the time and function like a crossover which has it on all the time no matter what (Grand Cherokee, Subaru’s, etc) It is essentially an AWD setting with open center diff and a traction control system that will send power to whatever wheels need it. What makes the Bronco’s system great is that you can go from 2H, to 4A, to 4H, to 4L. UNLIKE a crossover. It’s all selectable and “on-demand”

4A is distinctly different from 4H, which is center diff locked. You should never drive for long periods of time on dry pavement with 4H because cornering issues and tire chirping or skipping.

Yes, even 2H and 4H will also have traction control.

I understand there is confusion about terminology through this entire thread, but the key to understanding all this is the status of the center diff. If it is open (with traction control)...AWD. If it is locked...4H (traditional).

My 2007 4Runner 4wd system starts out in 4H open center diff. I can drive all day everyday this way. When I manually lock the center diff, it then becomes a classic 4wd “part-time” style system.

Can we lay this to bed?

For my simple mind... This is the best explanation.

 

[Rick Astley]

So this topic has been gathering importance for me as the Black Diamond appears to be the value purchase for light off-road duties and I have been trying to figure out what would possibly make the Badlands better for me considering the not-unsubstantial $6K price bump over Black Diamond.

Personal questions i've had are:

• How much does Badlands increase the off-road potential of the Bronco?
• Will I be SOL as a noob in off-roading without the advanced 4x4?
• Is the $6K upgrade to Badlands really a no-brainer but my limited understanding of off-road requirements and cheapness will get me stuck in Black Diamond watching everybody else drive up mountains?????

The best information I've found which CLEARLY describes the different 4x4 systems offered in Bronco is at the link below,

Understanding The 4WD In Your Ford

So as I take this article, the base "4x4 part time selectable engagement is technically called "Electronic Shift on the Fly 4WD System (ESOF)"

And the "Advanced 4x4 automatic on demand engagement" system is what Ford refers to as "Two Speed Automatic 4WD System"

And the real-world difference between the two is that the "advanced" system basically just runs in a semi-passive 4WD at all times where the "selectable" system runs in RWD on a daily basis.

There is also this video put out by ford regarding the systems;

Ford video about drive mode selection


Full disclosure: The Bronco i'm looking at currently is:
2-door
MT/2.3
Black Diamond
210 front axle

 

[NCOBX]

So this topic has been gathering importance for me as the Black Diamond appears to be the value purchase for light off-road duties and I have been trying to figure out what would possibly make the Badlands better for me considering the not-unsubstantial $6K price bump over Black Diamond.

Personal questions i've had are:

• How much does Badlands increase the off-road potential of the Bronco?
• Will I be SOL as a noob in off-roading without the advanced 4x4?
• Is the $6K upgrade to Badlands really a no-brainer but my limited understanding of off-road requirements and cheapness will get me stuck in Black Diamond watching everybody else drive up mountains?????

The best information I've found which CLEARLY describes the different 4x4 systems offered in Bronco is at the link below,

Understanding The 4WD In Your Ford

So as I take this article, the base "4x4 part time selectable engagement is technically called "Electronic Shift on the Fly 4WD System (ESOF)"

And the "Advanced 4x4 automatic on demand engagement" system is what Ford refers to as "Two Speed Automatic 4WD System"

And the real-world difference between the two is that the "advanced" system basically just runs in a semi-passive 4WD at all times where the "selectable" system runs in RWD on a daily basis.

There is also this video put out by ford regarding the systems;

Ford video about drive mode selection


Full disclosure: The Bronco i'm looking at currently is:
2-door
MT/2.3
Black Diamond
210 front axle

The drive selection modes will made zero difference off-road, it’s 90% sales material, 10% electronic throttle adjustments for individuals that are too heavy on the throttle.

“Advanced 4wd” wasn't advanced 20 yeaRS ago when GM introduced it into the market. It’s simply marketing hype. Passive 4wd really isn’t anything special or worth extra cost. I’m saying that as someone that has a lot of experience with it.

If you want ultimate offroadability just buy a base with Sasquatch package.

Shift on the fly has been available since the 1980s.

 

[FourHorses]

Its just like a Lariat or above F-150. You have 2H 4A 4H and 4L. You can use 4A at any speed on any surface. 4H/4L work exactly the same as the regular 2 speed case.

4A detects slip in the rear tires and kicks the front tires in very quickly and seamlessly. Works awesome in my F150 and it stays in that mode from October to April every year.

Had it on my old 97 explorer... I have mixed feelings. One time in the snow as I'm doing about 50 on an overpass, as I hit the transition strip from asphalt to concrete... I fishtailed slightly and had it corrected as the system engaged to the front, when it engaged it spun me into a donut the other direction. I rotated two full times and somehow stayed on all four wheels as I slid off into the grass. I slid so far down I had to use 4L to get out.

I've had it on other Explorers and F-150's since, and have always hesitated turning it out of 2H to 4A, I still feel my experience of driving RWD is superior and quicker than that system can ever be. Now going to 4H is a different story.

 

[Rick Astley]

The drive selection modes will made zero difference off-road, it’s 90% sales material, 10% electronic throttle adjustments for individuals that are too heavy on the throttle.

“Advanced 4wd” wasn't advanced 20 yeaRS ago when GM introduced it into the market. It’s simply marketing hype. Passive 4wd really isn’t anything special or worth extra cost. I’m saying that as someone that has a lot of experience with it.

If you want ultimate offroadability just buy a base with Sasquatch package.

Shift on the fly has been available since the 1980s.

I'm just providing the technical details as they are available for the question asked which may help others. My cars don't have seatbelts, power steering or disk brakes (Huck brakes in the '51), so most of these technologies are fairly new to me and their jargon seems duplicative.

The fact that people on here have tried to verbalize questions about what the difference is indicates that there is a question out there for folks less knowledgeable on the topic than your right foot.

 

[NCOBX]

I'm just providing the technical details as they are available for the question asked which may help others. My cars don't have seatbelts, power steering or disk brakes (Huck brakes in the '51), so most of these technologies are fairly new to me and their jargon seems duplicative.

The fact that people on here have tried to verbalize questions about what the difference is indicates that there is a question out there for folks less knowledgeable on the topic than your right foot.

“jargon seems duplicative.”

Exactly this, most of the technology is not new it’s just rebranded for a new generation.

The GOAT modes are little more than modulating throttle input and changing the transmission to hold gears longer. Experience will put an off-roader at a great advantage over these minute changes.

 

[rkj__]

I see this topic continues to be one of the most widely misunderstood topics in driving.

As has been mentioned, many other vehicles from both Ford and other manufacturers have offered "auto 4 wheel drive" on part time 4x4 systems. Selec-Trac in the Wrangler is just one comparable example.

I have "4A" on the dial in my GMC Sierra. I use it in the winter, when the road conditions are intermittently snow covered. Driving through farm country is a great example. The wind blows (sometimes deep) snow over the road in the more open spaces, while the more sheltered spaces have tracks worn to the pavement.

I also tell my wife to keep it in 4A anytime she drives my truck in the winter. In the summer though, it's always in 2H when on road, rain or shine.

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