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An open letter to Mike Levine et al.

BAUS67

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Is her shirt tucked into her pants just in one tiny spot in the front? So that her nether regions are on display??

;) Gotta' show off the "peep" sight. (y)
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lobbs611

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The biggest difference between the Ranger and the Bronco is the switch to a link suspension with coilovers out back. Stiffer rear springs would go a long ways towards bumping up tow capacity but it's going to suffer out on the trail once it's unhitched. Not sure if they make an air spring/coilover layout but that would be the ideal solution, I think, if you're really worried about getting more out of the Bronco.
 
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Lakelife36

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Here's some explanation of the certification process that it must pass.
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a29339668/how-truck-tow-rating-is-calculated/

One of the biggest issues with a vehicle like this is wheelbase and rear suspension not being able to prevent the tail from wagging the dog enough to satisfy legal.
This is great info! I'm still holding onto a glimmer of hope that a max tow package just isn't approved enough for a higher number to be revealed yet, because:
A) I can't see the two-door passing most of those tests actually towing the same load as the four-door
B) The Dixon Dam run has to be done in summer temperatures, meaning that it may not have been completed (or approved) on time for the launch.

Remember the original launch was planned for sometime this spring so the decision could have been made a while ago to stick with a safe number that they know even the two-door will reach (limited by the sway tests that may have already been done at the time) and then release the final numbers after the dam run is completed in the summer.

I can still hope, right? Right?
 
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Lakelife36

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Well, first of all, you are a fine writer. Second, I set it up.

Be kind, it's my first poll.

Nate
Nate that poll looks great IMO. Captures a good cross-section of responses without getting too wordy or having too many options. Thanks for setting it up!
 

2Jeeps&PatriotX1

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Iā€™m trying to understand what you are doing with 40 gallons of water. Our trailer holds 30 in the fresh and for a 5-day trip, for 5 people, weā€™ll typically go through around 45 gallons. Thatā€™s WITH and gray tanks and black tank. I donā€™t know if your trailer has those type of tanks but thatā€™s a lot of water. When we had our teardrop, we could do a week, with 5 people with 20 gallons because we were conservative.

If you ever towed 7k with the FSBā€™s, it was an exciting experience. I towed an FJ40 behind my 89 FSB from Michigan to KS in the early 2000ā€™s. It was on a heavy steel car trailer. It was a 60mph white knuckle ride the whole way.

I see people all the time pushing the tow capacity of the mid-size trucks. The front ends are up in the air and it looks like a crazy ride. Also, rear coil sprung vehicles definitely act different from their leaf spring counterparts when it comes to towing.

I agree, the aftermarket will have things to get the tow capacity up. Air bags, weight distribution, heavier coils etc.
Its dual tanks for a total of 40gallons fresh water to be used for washing dishes and showers. Wife and I are able to work remotely so sometimes we head out for a week, other times could be few weeks at a time, moving to a different area every 4-5 days. Majority of the time, weā€™re a good hour away from any town.
 

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Flourman

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Its dual tanks for a total of 40gallons fresh water to be used for washing dishes and showers. Wife and I are able to work remotely so sometimes we head out for a week, other times could be few weeks at a time, moving to a different area every 4-5 days. Majority of the time, weā€™re a good hour away from any town.
We dry camp almost exclusively. 40 gallons for two people just seems like a lot.
 

2Jeeps&PatriotX1

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Last trip out (Tetons area), used 19 gallons in 4 days. That included me taking a shower 1 night. Ive since replaced the shower head so hope to its more efficient.
 

ATLBronco75

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So much this. Short wheelbase towing is insane regardless of engine/transmission.
 
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Lakelife36

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So much this. Short wheelbase towing is insane regardless of engine/transmission.
We tow our trailer with an SUV that doesn't have sway control and has 2" shorter wheelbase than the four-door will and we've never felt like it was swinging us around. It all depends on what you tow at what speeds and whether it has brakes or not. No one here is asking this thing to haul like a Super Duty or even a half ton, and if they are then they're out to lunch. But 3500lbs is soccer-mom crossover range, not rugged body-on-frame SUV-style.
 

The Pope

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My 2007 Mercury Mariner (uni-body) has a factory tow rating of 3500.... , so why can't a Body On Frame (even with soft suspension) have more towing capacity than my 13 year old Uni-Body?

FoMoCo... Please offer a Tow Package that will allow a 5000lbs tow rating for those of us who want to safely tow more than the current 3500lbs rating. We know (and you can put a disclaimer within the package) that Off Road Articulation Will Be Less With Tow Package Installed and maybe some other things as well.

You (FoMoCo) already (well most likely) already have the components. Seems like it would be a Win/Win for all parties if such a package was offered.
 

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futzin'

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There sure is a lot of of Sheldon Cooper's "You're having fun wrong" mentality in these towing threads (unfortunately, without his emotional detachment).

I guess I won't ask what folks think will happen to Jeep's tow ratings when/if they put a V8 in the Wrangler/Gladiator. Prime opportunity for them to increase the 4dr Wrangler's 3500.

A good discussion, overall.

For the record, I'm in the camp of: The 2.7 4dr Bronco can/should have a significantly higher rating than 3500. If not, then yes I realize it's not the vehicle for me.
 

timhood

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The point is the Bronco is built to compete with the Wrangler and has the exact same row rating.
I thought the Bronco was built to beat the Wrangler at its own game. Merely matching the Wrangler today means the Bronco will fall behind when Jeep makes updates to complete. Plus, there's marketing value in outdoing the competition in as many ways as possible.

On my team, we never set out to make something "as good as". Why bother? We might as well buy the other thing rather than waste our time reinventing the same thing.
 

timhood

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I can still hope, right? Right?
I, too, am hoping that 3,500 lbs is a placeholder amount while final testing is completed. There's a huge amount of time between now and ordering (December), let alone delivery. I'm hoping for 5,000 so that a boat could be included in our future plans. It wouldn't need to be towed far or fast, but it would be nice to have the option.
 

Gamecock

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I thought the Bronco was built to beat the Wrangler at its own game. Merely matching the Wrangler today means the Bronco will fall behind when Jeep makes updates to complete. Plus, there's marketing value in outdoing the competition in as many ways as possible.

On my team, we never set out to make something "as good as". Why bother? We might as well buy the other thing rather than waste our time reinventing the same thing.
Well congrats on your team, very, very, very impressive. That said, the Bronco needs to beat Wrangler on the things that people most often buy that type vehicle for...not on ā€œeverythingā€....most people arenā€™t buying a Bronco or a Wrangler for their towing prowess...that would be way down the list.
 

timhood

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Well congrats on your team, very, very, very impressive. That said, the Bronco needs to beat Wrangler on the things that people most often buy that type vehicle for...not on ā€œeverythingā€....most people arenā€™t buying a Bronco or a Wrangler for their towing prowess...that would be way down the list.
I think you missed my point.

Is that good engineering to start any project and say, "let's see if we can do as good as what's already available"? Clearly, Ford spoke to a ton of Wrangler owners and said, "Tell us everything you like, love, hate, have to have and don't care about". Then they took that list and made the Bronco. Yes, towing was not at the top of the list, but that doesn't mean there still wasn't/isn't opportunity to improve on the Jeep. Personally, I'm holding out that the 3,500 lbs is a safe, placeholder number until final testing is done. Much the way Ford has under-reported horsepower in upcoming Mustangs and the GT, or tow and payload ratings in F-series or mileage in the Mach-E. Throw out a safe number first and please even more people if you can improve on it (or upstage the competition when they try to meet your numbers).
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