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CarmeloS

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Again, right tool for the right job.

EVs are smoooooth quiet vehicles that are ungodly quick. They are a hoot to rip around urban areas. I call my Bronco a janky tractor. It's fun and I love it for beach/off-road trips... but brutally uncomfortable for long journeys.
https://www.dailyfetched.com/report...ecoming-sick-while-driving-electric-vehicles/

I also disagree with the janky tractor, I drove to florida and back twice with my Bronco and loved it, and she's got a bestop soft top plus a stick. No issues with her at all. Hell, I got 50k miles and no issues with how she drives, minus the random bouts of first gear jerkiness that gets fixed by clutching and reshifting
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Again, right tool for the right job.

EVs are smoooooth quiet vehicles that are ungodly quick. They are a hoot to rip around urban areas. I call my Bronco a janky tractor.
Do they really need to be ungodly quick though ? Just wait until they get EVs into the mainstream then the powers that be are going to tame that shit down. Mark my words , they will claim it waste battery power and range etc. They will control your top speed and power depending on what the speed limit in your current location is. Probably geofence your vehicle to how far away from home they think you should be able to travel ,lol.
 

voxel

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https://www.dailyfetched.com/report...ecoming-sick-while-driving-electric-vehicles/

I also disagree with the janky tractor, I drove to florida and back twice with my Bronco and loved it, and she's got a bestop soft top plus a stick. No issues with her at all. Hell, I got 50k miles and no issues with how she drives, minus the random bouts of first gear jerkiness that gets fixed by clutching and reshifting
You quote a site that also has articles like this:

https://www.dailyfetched.com/pope-francis-conservatism-is-a-suicidal-attitude/

The reason passengers (mentioned in the article) have motion sickness is drivers don't know how to control the incredible torque and basically drive like they are in a rollercoaster. Same with a V8 sports car when you first get it. Same feeling I get as a passenger in a manual transmission car. It's easy to drive smooth when you acquire experience.


Do they really need to be ungodly quick though ? Just wait until they get EVs into the mainstream then the powers that be are going to tame that shit down. Mark my words , they will claim it waste battery power and range etc. They will control your top speed and power depending on what the speed limit in your current location is. Probably geofence your vehicle to how far away from home they think you should be able to travel ,lol.
I'd say it's not specific to EVs. You could easily just geofence a gas car to not be able to drive in off-road areas like certain national/state parks. Too much FUD and not enough reality,

I do agree that EVs have far too much power. 0 to 60 in 3 seconds in my former Rivian R1S was just plain stupid. I took it to a drag strip and hit 11.8 seconds in the 1/4 mile consistently. A 7000lb SUV doing that is pretty dangerous. It's why when EVs get into accidents they basically destroy the other car due to the weight difference.
 

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I don't think so... the major issue with PHEVs (and hybrids) is the reliable ones use a planetary gear system instead of a transmission. They aren't even true AWDs as the rear is powered by an electric motor. Ford and Toyota share similar tech - no alternator, no starter, no transmission. There are co-patents owned by them I believe. It's just a brilliant design. It's why the Chevy Volt powertrain can easily last 300K miles.

The newer Toyota hybrids for off-roading have traditional transmissions and are basically German-engineered turbo messes IMO. Too complicated. Not going to be reliable like PHEVs + dumb hybrids.
So meaning you think a PHEV might be in the works for not too distant future and EVs are further off?

If so, I'm going to hold off for a hopeful PHEV next year or two. With right tool for the job, I only live about 5 minutes from where I work (can't work from home at this time) and I'd love to just make the trip using electric every day and use the gas (with better mileage) when I go on longer trips (which I do fairly often). And I need an suv to get up the hill/mountain I live on, so I'd like to stick with something like a Bronco.

I have a 392 already, so I'm not interested in a 4xe at this time. The 392 is a toy, but my bronco is a daily for me. A Bronco PHEV would be perfect.
 

voxel

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So meaning you think a PHEV might be in the works for not too distant future and EVs are further off?

If so, I'm going to hold off for a hopeful PHEV next year or two. With right tool for the job, I only live about 5 minutes from where I work (can't work from home at this time) and I'd love to just make the trip using electric every day and use the gas (with better mileage) when I go on longer trips (which I do fairly often). And I need an suv to get up the hill/mountain I live on, so I'd like to stick with something like a Bronco.

I have a 392 already, so I'm not interested in a 4xe at this time. The 392 is a toy, but my bronco is a daily for me. A Bronco PHEV would be perfect.
It's complicated. I suspect Ford is working on PHEVs/hybrids because not everybody can live with an EV. I hope not like the 4xe... while I borrowed one for a week from a friend and it was nice for a Jeep... it's not like the RAV4 Prime (PHEV) I had before which had oodles of power, could drive in EV mode up to 84mph, and had real world 48 miles of EV range.

The problem with a PHEV/hybrid is where do you put the battery. Look at the 4xe, new Sequoia, new LandCruiser, etc. The battery create a giant hump behind the second row. It vastly reduces cargo space and makes the space weirdly unusable sometimes.
 

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Dral97

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It's complicated. I suspect Ford is working on PHEVs/hybrids because not everybody can live with an EV. I hope not like the 4xe... while I borrowed one for a week from a friend and it was nice for a Jeep... it's not like the RAV4 Prime (PHEV) I had before which had oodles of power, could drive in EV mode up to 84mph, and had real world 48 miles of EV range.

The problem with a PHEV/hybrid is where do you put the battery. Look at the 4xe, new Sequoia, new LandCruiser, etc. The battery create a giant hump behind the second row. It vastly reduces cargo space and makes the space weirdly unusable sometimes.
Hmm, interesting. The reason I have a moar door is because I use that space for hauling and what not. I'll have to get a good look at the inside of a 4xe to get an idea of how much space it takes up.
 

cr117

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Meanwhile where it's not mild, you get stories like this. And forget about Road trips.

I don't wanna plan my days around charging stations and shit, I just wanna get up and go, and an EV robs you of that luxury. Again, for big cities and all that bullshit, EV's are fine, but not all of us live there, and we don't wanna be stuck holding our dicks in our hands on the off chance we forget to charge it due to life happening
Seriously, no one is forcing you to buy an EV. If you want to drive in the extreme cold and go on extended road trips all the time, then yes, having an EV as your only vehicle probably isn't the smartest move.

All is I can say is it's really nice not having to worry about stopping for gas every week. Whenever I leave in the morning, the car is ready to go, fully charged and I know I can drive 200+ miles every day of the year. That sounds like luxury to me.
 

CarmeloS

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Seriously, no one is forcing you to buy an EV. If you want to drive in the extreme cold and go on extended road trips all the time, then yes, having an EV as your only vehicle probably isn't the smartest move.

All is I can say is it's really nice not having to worry about stopping for gas every week. Whenever I leave in the morning, the car is ready to go, fully charged and I know I can drive 200+ miles every day of the year. That sounds like luxury to me.

My Dad's diesel range rover is the same way, on a slow week he doesn't have to fill up, only we're not limited by the range, and can be up and on the road after a few mins of filling up.

Had Dieselgate not happened, or been a few years later, would still have Diesels competing with these PHEV/EV's and proving how much of a waste they are. Here in Jersey, Diesel is cheaper than premium, ymmv depending on the state, but considering we sometimes take couple hour trips to upstate NY for work, its nice not needing to fill up all the time, drive normal and still have plenty of juice left in the tank
 

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Had Dieselgate not happened, or been a few years later, would still have Diesels competing with these PHEV/EV's and proving how much of a waste they are.
LOL. That's like saying if Russia hadn't ever been caught doping their Olympic athletes, the would've been crushing the competition the last 4 years.
 

CarmeloS

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LOL. That's like saying if Russia hadn't ever been caught doping their Olympic athletes, the would've been crushing the competition the last 4 years.
One can buy a LJ70/73 and modernize it/daily it

can’t really say the same about the old GM ev from the 90s
 

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One can buy a LJ70/73 and modernize it/daily it
Your just moving the goal posts now.

You never meet emissions standards with it either. But hey isn't that the whole point of moving to EVs? To remove millions of little engines that spew out shit and move that up the chain where it is more easily/effectively controlled?
 

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I do agree that EVs have far too much power
People are forgetting the basics here-a Electric motor is far more efficient in delivering power then an ICE is. An EV motor only loses about 10-15% of its power from rotational force, where as an ICE loses 40-60%. The real issue is that gas is far more energy dense then batteries are, so it has the advantage there, but with the negatives of the emissions they give off.

So getting back on point, EV motors develop all their torque at 1 RPM and often generate much more then an ICE can, which normally doesn't hit max torque til it hits 3-4K RPM or higher, depending on how the engine is made.

That is why EVs are so quick and "dropping" the power to them will show no appreciable increase in range. Just take a look at the Mach E models with same battery pack and AWD-the more powerful models only lose about 10 miles or so of range. Look at the Mustang between the Ecoboost and V8 and its a difference of 5-6 MPG combined or a difference of roughly 24%.
 

CarmeloS

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Your just moving the goal posts now.

You never meet emissions standards with it either. But hey isn't that the whole point of moving to EVs? To remove millions of little engines that spew out shit and move that up the chain where it is more easily/effectively controlled?
25yr rule means old diesels and foreign vehicles should be exempt from emissions and stuff

yeah, I aint a sheep, won’t be controlled
 

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25yr rule means old diesels and foreign vehicles should be exempt from emissions and stuff
And you make up like .01% of the car buying public too. Just because you think you can do something, doesn't mean that corporation can do it.

yeah, I aint a sheep, won’t be controlled
But yet you live in NJ, so your being controlled...seriously and you drive a vehicle that basically is a freaking cell phone that reports everything back to the manufacture. You don't need to impress me...if anything I laugh at you.
 

lapazleo

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People are forgetting the basics here-a Electric motor is far more efficient in delivering power then an ICE is. An EV motor only loses about 10-15% of its power from rotational force, where as an ICE loses 40-60%. The real issue is that gas is far more energy dense then batteries are, so it has the advantage there, but with the negatives of the emissions they give off.

So getting back on point, EV motors develop all their torque at 1 RPM and often generate much more then an ICE can, which normally doesn't hit max torque til it hits 3-4K RPM or higher, depending on how the engine is made.

That is why EVs are so quick and "dropping" the power to them will show no appreciable increase in range. Just take a look at the Mach E models with same battery pack and AWD-the more powerful models only lose about 10 miles or so of range. Look at the Mustang between the Ecoboost and V8 and its a difference of 5-6 MPG combined or a difference of roughly 24%.
Steam makes max torque at o rpm and is more powerful and efficient than electric but yet it's no longer used. Ev's are not as enviromentally friendly as some would have us believe. The fact is even with government mandates ev's will not be mainstream in our lifetime. If ev's were better then ice power people would switch voluntarily. Not to get political but one national election and the whole ev thing could go out the window. The bean counters at Ford who are backing off ev's are smarter than people think.
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