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Bronco R in action, BAJA 1000

BONESTOCK

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My God.....sounds horrible.
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aplm7

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Anyone who knows more about the race than I do,

why did Ford choose the class they did?

What separates a trophy truck from a 4x4 and why aren’t there more vehicles in Fords class for this kind of race?

Is the class at a physical disadvantage somehow?

Is it better to be in 2 wheel drive somehow for desert racing?

another interesting thing I read somewhere was that Ford was actually helping other racers get unstuck and it was the only one able to do that as a 4x4 lol. Good Samaritan

another question that sticks in my mind with all of this, everyone seems much older than me. No millennials in the Ford race team. Is Bronco going to be aimed more at Baby Boom generation? You don’t really see Ford pushing marketing into channels that millennials like such as Instagram glamour shots and stuff, places where 4Runner and wranglers shine at making people jealous and buy buy buy. Like the stream above, did Ford even post that to try to build some hype?
 

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Holy shit that course is in rough shape. They were clearly hoofing it too. Sad that they had the issues they did looks like they should’ve had a good time.
 

Uncle Gump

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My God.....sounds horrible.
I get the fact you like the rumble.. the rev... the sound of power. Lots of people do... including myself.

But I still say it wasn't breaking a sweat... nothing wrong with that in my book.
 

Stampede.Offroad

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...
why did Ford choose the class they did?
...
Is it better to be in 2 wheel drive somehow for desert racing?
...
Is Bronco going to be aimed more at Baby Boom generation? You don’t really see Ford pushing marketing into channels that millennials like. . .
Plenty of people have been asking why Ford chose that racing class. Like most of what is going on with Bronco they haven't bothered to explain it. Some easy guesses would be that the production parts weren't finalized or available, or that because the vehicle is still so far from sales that it couldn't qualify for one of the more 'stock' classes like the '79 Bronco was in.

Most desert racing doesn't benefit from all/4 wheel drive. It's about goin fast over terrain you could probably drive a sedan over slowly. 4x4 parts are just extra weight and stuff to break in that type of event. The Baja series of races have been dominated by light weighting rear drive vehicles since inception. That's a big part of what made Hall's win in '69 so noteworthy.

In general, SUVs and performance vehicles sell primarily to over 50's (>50%). Bronco is by all accounts going to tap into that even more with some retro design cues.
 

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SpursFan

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That course is rough as hell, I'm surprised more things don't break!
 

BroncoMike

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Man, doing a finish line interview and photo-op just seems disingenuous. And a checkered flag spread out on the hood ain't right for a DNF. There's no way to spin this into a publicity coup, just get back to work and make a better showing as soon as possible.
 

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Anyone who knows more about the race than I do,

why did Ford choose the class they did?
Not sure. As Stampede mentioned, it may have been because the stock parts weren't available or suitable, but they wanted to test the production drivetrain with 4x4.

What separates a trophy truck from a 4x4 and why aren’t there more vehicles in Fords class for this kind of race?
Class 2 is a fully unlimited class that seems to be aimed at this sort of special exhibition vehicle (the Bronco R and the Baja Boot) - most of the vehicles at Baja fit into the regs for other classes

Is the class at a physical disadvantage somehow?
Not at any disadvantage due to restrictions. As far as I can tell it's a fully unlimited class, they can do whatever they want. Note, don't go by the wikipedia entry for SCORE Class 2, it's outdated with rules from 2015.

Is it better to be in 2 wheel drive somehow for desert racing?
Generally in high speed desert racing, the advantages you can get in terms of front suspension design and simplicity with 2WD outweigh the traction disadvantage on the trickier sections. You couldn't actually drive a sedan over the Baja 1000 course like Stampede (I think jokingly) mentioned, but certainly any average SUV could make it through slowly with reasonable tires.

another interesting thing I read somewhere was that Ford was actually helping other racers get unstuck and it was the only one able to do that as a 4x4 lol. Good Samaritan
I saw that mentioned too, pretty funny.
 

Stampede.Offroad

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Man, doing a finish line interview and photo-op just seems disingenuous. And a checkered flag spread out on the hood ain't right for a DNF. There's no way to spin this into a publicity coup, just get back to work and make a better showing as soon as possible.
The photo shoot at the finish line seemed forced and inappropriate, considering their DNF. Like some marketing goon insisted it happen despite the actual outcome. One of the clips/shots has people raising their arms on victory, but you can see the facial expressions on some of them don't really seem enthused about the situation.

... You couldn't actually drive a sedan over the Baja 1000 course like Stampede (I think jokingly) mentioned, but certainly any average SUV could make it through slowly with reasonable tires.
Class 11 is literally stock VW Beetles ("Vehicles must be a stock VW Type 1 Sedan"). One of them finished the race in less time than the SCG Boot did (Dennis Hollenbeck). So ... yeah, its a race course that a sedan could drive.

If you watch the videos of the race, you will see all kinds of places with spectators in RVs and sedans parked along side the race course with no other way in but to have driven on the "track" to get there. They just did it more slowly. Its a race made challenging by the time limit -- as the vast majority of the miles are on roads, albeit ****** ones the average American wouldn't choose to drive on.
 

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Jalisurr

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Class 11 is literally stock VW Beetles ("Vehicles must be a stock VW Type 1 Sedan"). One of them finished the race in less time than the SCG Boot did (Dennis Hollenbeck). So ... yeah, its a race course that a sedan could drive.

If you watch the videos of the race, you will see all kinds of places with spectators in RVs and sedans parked along side the race course with no other way in but to have driven on the "track" to get there. They just did it more slowly. Its a race made challenging by the time limit -- as the vast majority of the miles are on roads, albeit ****** ones the average American wouldn't choose to drive on.
Yeah. 'Stock beetles'. This was the winning class 11 car, car 1111:
=8&oh=c6c85b5769e0d23168bd753f9994c965&oe=5E016D58&ig_cache_key=MTg3NjMyNjI2NzU0OTIyNjA4Mw%3D%3D.jpg


Just a weee bit better approach/departure angle and ground clearance than your average sedan. Beetles in particular are also known for being quite durable off-road with their swing axle suspension.

There are certainly large sections of the Baja 1000 course that any car could traverse. Not the entire thing though.
 

Stampede.Offroad

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Yeah. 'Stock beetles'. This was the winning class 11 car... Just a weee bit better approach/departure angle and ground clearance than your average sedan...There are certainly large sections of the Baja 1000 course that any car could traverse. Not the entire thing though.
Now it's "any car" for the threshold of difficulty instead of "certainly not a sedan, that was a joke right?"

How low does the bar need to be set for the Bronco R to get there? Does a Smart Car have to be able to do it?

02-smart-dakar.jpg
 

Jalisurr

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Now it's "any car" for the threshold of difficulty instead of "certainly not a sedan, that was a joke right?"

How low does the bar need to be set for the Bronco R to get there? Does a Smart Car have to be able to do it?

02-smart-dakar.jpg
Man, you really hate the Bronco R, huh?

Let me be clear. You said a sedan could drive the whole course. I gave the benefit of the doubt that you were using hyperbole, I guess that wasn't the case. When I say a sedan can't do it, I mean something like this:
1200px-2018_Toyota_Camry_%28ASV70R%29_Ascent_sedan_%282018-08-27%29_01.jpg


If you actually spent any time watching the Baja 1000 you'll see that there are sections of the track that a vehicle like that would not be able to get through just based on geometry alone. Now yeah, if you go and turn that camry into something like this, or your smart car above, that's a different discussion:
latest?cb=20130629013247.jpg


And then yes, I said 'any car'. My bad for using a generalization instead of saying that 'yes, there are many sections that an average modern mid sized sedan at stock ride height on passenger car tires could traverse, but not the whole course'.
 

Stampede.Offroad

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Man, you really hate the Bronco R, huh? ...
I would say that I'm disappointed by what it represents.

In return I would suggest that you're threatened by the idea that that type of race course really isn't that difficult to traverse, and are stretching for excuses. I suspect that Camry could in fact traverse the race course with far fewer modifications than you would propose (Plus or minus some stop signs ;)) -- but the failing would be that it could not do so at a speed that would complete it in less than 34 hours.

Check out some towing videos. People manage to get cars in some pretty ridiculous places.
 

Jake_zx2

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In return I would suggest that you're threatened by the idea that that type of race course really isn't that difficult to traverse, and are stretching for excuses. I suspect that Camry could in fact traverse the race course with far fewer modifications than you would propose (Plus or minus some stop signs ;)) -- but the failing would be that it could not do so at a speed that would complete it in less than 34 hours.
If this is REALLY the stance you want to take...

I'd guarantee that the same Camry could take on MOAB with ease with about the same amount of modification
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