Ford Wants To Compete With Tesla, But Its Dealers Are Getting In The Way

[Raptor911]

I made the mistake of test driving a model 3 performance and I can't stop thinking about it.

0-60 is 3.1 secs. For comparison 0-60 for a 2021 Dodge Challenger SRT Hellcat Redeye is 3.4 seconds.

I have owned 3 BMW M-cars and the model 3 performance is just simply BETTER in every way.

I'll give my $.02 since I have a Tesla Model 3 with 105,000 miles in less than 3 years. It's by far the best vehicle I've ever owned. Soulless is far from how I would describe it. It's torque off the line and handling since the batteries are low make it an incredibly fun car to drive. I never worry about having to pass someone because the power to the wheels is instant. Since I've owned it they have added so many features with Over the Air updates like...
Video recoding when anyone gets near my car.
10 % increase torque and horsepower
UI improvements
While charging or parked they added Netflix, YouTube, Disney Plus and video games.
There are too many others to list. Fortunately I haven't need any major service to the car where I needed to take it in to the service center. I had a couple minor things like my rear trunk latch stopped working and my driver window wouldn't go up all the way. For both of those issues I scheduled it through the app and Tesla came to my house and took care of both issues. I think everyone can get onboard with that type of service. I have taken it on multiple road trips and it does add some time to the drive without question but you stop to take a leak and get something to eat so it's not too bad. I drive to Phoenix a lot from Cali. The Autopilot works great on highways for road trips. You could probably set up an iPad and watch movies if you wanted to-Not Recommended. I think they're a ways from Self driving on surface streets but highway driving works well. And like someone pointed out there are Tesla Superchargers everywhere and they're adding more all the time. Charging times are getting better also and will improve as the batteries get better. The best thing to do is set up a 220V-50A breaker at home to charge at night. I'm a Construction Superintendent so I also set up charging stations at my jobs so I don't have to pay for it. I got a lot of shit from co-workers because I got rid of my truck but once I take them for a drive their attitude changes quickly. I've only lost 2 races off the line so far by a McClaren and the new mid engine corvette. I had the Corvette for the first 60 ft. and then he pulled away. I haven't raced a whole lot of really fast cars either though so I'm sure a lot of them will beat me. I think my 0-60 is about 4.4 seconds or so with about 440 horsepower.

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[Raptor911]

cybertruck is 69K for the highest trim. The lightning highest trim is 90K.

I haven't looked into the Transit Electric, but the F-150 Lighting aka the BEV F-150 starts at 40K or so. The F-150 XL, which is "fleet" special, is around that price or more, going by the models listed at local dealerships.

I think Ford has a good handle on the truck market and catering to it. The Lighting looks like its going to be a success story without the Exotic price tag that the cybertruck or Riven is going to have.

 

[Danzer]

I made the mistake of test driving a model 3 performance and I can't stop thinking about it.

0-60 is 3.1 secs. For comparison 0-60 for a 2021 Dodge Challenger SRT Hellcat Redeye is 3.4 seconds.

I have owned 3 BMW M-cars and the model 3 performance is just simply BETTER in every way.

The test drive is what did it for me also. The wife set up an appointment for me and the sales guy let me go heavy on the pedal. A week later I had one on order. I agree with Rcarpen22 that changing the prices all the time makes them look like they don't know what they're doing sometimes. A few months after I got mine the price dropped by thousands and I could had the Performance version for the same price I paid. I'm glad I got the Dual Motor at least. And like he said Tesla is not perfect but they're doing things in a new way that I appreciate.

 

[MnLakeBum]

There are a lot of very differing views in this thread. As someone with a lot of experience with Tesla, I can say I have had nothing but great service experiences. Every time one of my Teslas (we've had two) needs service, they either come perform the service at my house or give a me a nice loaner while my car is in. I get text messages throughout the process to keep me informed, and the service is always done on time. Ford has not thus far compared favorably. My Bronco suffered an engine failure at 600 miles. The dealer couldn't diagnose the problem. After Ford engineers figured it out, they rushed a new long block to the dealer. The dealer has had the new engine for two weeks and has yet to start the swap. The Bronco has been at the dealer 8 weeks today with no end in sight. They never communicate, even when I call or email. They won't even call Ford back to tell the customer reps what's going on. And there's apparently nothing Ford can do about it. Yes, Tesla changes the price all the time and that has pissed me off. They also have made changes to the cars that they shouldn't have (supercharger throttling). Tesla is not a perfect company by any means, but I still prefer their model to traditional car dealers.

I’ll echo this with 131,000 miles on my 2015 Tesla Model S and give you the performance and service perspective since this is main reason why me and a lot of other Tesla owners bought one.

Service has been super easy(all but twice they came to my home and fixed the car in my garage within an hour or two). Performance wise, the only similar size sports sedans that can hang with a Model S would be an AMG GT 63S($162k), BMW M5($113k), or Audi RS7($115k). All are much more costly to buy/own/maintain than a base Model S($91k) and all would get destroyed at the track by a Model S Plaid($130k) which runs the 1/4 mile in 9.08 seconds at 154 mph. I’ve spent a total of $2,000 in service in 6.5 years of ownership and more than half of that was for brakes and rotors. I have a buddy with 165,000 on his ‘14 Model S and he has not needed new brakes yet but he doesn’t drive anywhere near as aggressively as I do.

Since it was new we’ve saved about $15,000 in fuel costs over a similar ICE sedan and the hassle of having to go to a gas station to refuel. No we don’t take trips with it farther than 200 miles or tow with it but that’s why we own a Range Rover diesel with a 620 mile highway range and 7800 lb towing capacity.

All the Tesla naysayers remind of all the “experts” and tech sector/phone company CEO’s laughing off Apple 14 years ago when they released the first iPhone. How’d that work out for BlackBerry and Nokia?? Microsoft’s CEO Steve Balmer at the time said it was a fools errand to try to compete with Blackberry, lol.

Or how about Michael Dell’s comments about Apple 10 years before the iPhone:

Back in 1997, Dell famously said that if he were put in charge of Apple, "I'd shut it down and give the money back to the shareholders." Nowadays, given all of Apple's success, it's easy to laugh at Dell's thinking.

Just like Apple, Tesla has disrupted an entire industry and IMO, it’s about damn time.

 

[Bronco cat]

I made the mistake of test driving a model 3 performance and I can't stop thinking about it.

0-60 is 3.1 secs. For comparison 0-60 for a 2021 Dodge Challenger SRT Hellcat Redeye is 3.4 seconds.

I have owned 3 BMW M-cars and the model 3 performance is just simply BETTER in every way.

Too bad the material and fit and finish is sub-par. Also how many runs can you make before you deplete the battery???? Tesla value is extremely overrated. They barely make a profit selling cars they survive off of carbon credits.

 

[Raptor911]

time will reveal everything.

Too bad the material and fit and finish is sub-par. Also how many runs can you make before you deplete the battery???? Tesla value is extremely overrated. They barely make a profit selling cars they survive off of carbon credits.

 

[MnLakeBum]

Too bad the material and fit and finish is sub-par. Also how many runs can you make before you deplete the battery???? Tesla value is extremely overrated. They barely make a profit selling cars they survive off of carbon credits.

You might want to brush up on your Tesla revenue and carbon credit facts.
Their carbon credits were 3% of their revenue last quarter(Q2 2021) in which they made $1.6B in profit on $11.96B in revenue, up 100% YOY, lol. With Tesla’s sales forecasted to grow another 80% in 2022, their carbon credit will shrink to about 1.7% of their annual revenue. All the other car companies are scrambling to go electric with dozens of new models coming out in the next 2–3 years. They have ignored Tesla at their own peril and are now trying to play catch up while Tesla’s sales revenue will be over $100B a year by 2023. Last year only 33 US companies had over $100B in revenue.

Also, my Tesla with 131,000 miles on it drives newer with fewer rattles than 3 of our other ICE vehicles that all have less than 60,000 miles. Our ‘18 Range Rover is still pretty much rattle free but it’s much newer, has 70,000 fewer miles on it, and the Rover maintenance costs have already more than doubled what we’ve spent on the Tesla.

From Yahoo finance July 27th 2021 -

“For many years, Tesla made good money from selling carbon credits. But as other companies also shift to renewable sources, they need to buy fewer of those credits from companies like Tesla.

The share of revenue from carbon credit sales in Tesla’s total revenue more than halved to 3% in the June quarter from 7% a year ago.”

 

[Sherminiator]

cybertruck is 69K for the highest trim. The lightning highest trim is 90K.

F-150 lighting starts at $40K and has started production already....where is the CyberTruck? Still have another year or so if your lucky. The top end Lighting will have a much better interior then the Cybertruck, which is vaporware.

https://electrek.co/2021/09/16/ford...f150-lightning-electric-pickup-race-heats-up/

 

[Boxer4]

cybertruck is 69K for the highest trim.

I would hope so. Take about a dozen sheets of 18 gauge 304 Type 4 stainless, a shear, 225 ton brake with knife dies, case of Rolling Rock and about 4 hours into a Friday night and I would have a “ CyberTruck “ too.

 

[MnLakeBum]

F-150 lighting starts at $40K and has started production already....where is the CyberTruck? Still have another year or so if your lucky. The top end Lighting will have a much better interior then the Cybertruck, which is vaporware.

https://electrek.co/2021/09/16/ford...f150-lightning-electric-pickup-race-heats-up/

The article states they have reservations for 150,00 F150 Lightnings and their production will be 15,000 in 2022 and 55,000 in 2023. It’s a bit comforting knowing that the existing reservations holders will be waiting longer for their electric F150 than us Bronco reservations holders. If everything at Ford goes as planned(lol) half of existing lightning reservation holders won’t get delivery until 2024. Misery loves company.

“Last month, we reported on Ford accelerating its production plans for the F-150 electric, with a ramp to 15,000 vehicles in 2022, 55,000 in 2023, and 80,000 in 2024. Higher volumes would need to come in the next generation of the electric pickup truck coming in 2025.

Ford also said that it has “taken more than 150,000 reservations” for the F-150 Lightning to date. That’s up from 130,000 reservations a few weeks ago.”

 

[Sherminiator]

They have ignored Tesla at their own peril and are now trying to play catch up while Tesla’s sales revenue will be over $100B a year by 2023. Last year only 33 US companies had over $100B in revenue.

That is alot of assumptions-The market place will be far more completive in 2023 to expect a 80% increase in sales and a 10x jump in revenue-the only did 11 billion back in June.

 

[Beachin 74]

I hear you folks talking about Teslas on this forum a lot. The part about service techs making house calls sounds real interesting.
But I don't think they compare to the Bronco. Here's one on our dune crossings.

 

[MnLakeBum]

That is a lot of assumptions-The market place will be far more completive in 2023 to expect a 80% increase in sales and a 10x jump in revenue-the only did 11 billion back in June.

11.96B was the quarterly Tesla number, and it was up 100% from a year ago. It's not a stretch to predict they will more than double their sales again by the end of FY2023. Last year they sold just shy of 500,000 cars, and this year, it looks like that number will be about 800,000 even with all the chip shortages and other supply chain constraints.

The competition will certainly ramp up their electric production, which will be good for the consumer. How fast companies like Ford can ramp up is a bigger question mark than how fast Tesla can ramp up as they have dominated the EV market in the US for almost a decade. Ford is forecasted to deliver about 15,000 F150 Lightnings in 2022 and about 40,000 Mustang Mach E's for about $3B in revenue. Tesla is forecasted to sell 1.3M vehicles in 2022 for about $60B in revenue. If companies like Ford and GM can get their act together, they will chip away at Tesla's dominant BEV market share(67% in the US), and I'd love to see it as I'm addicted to the instant acceleration and low maintenance of my Tesla. I'd love to have a Bronco or Truck that had 600+ hp and 600 ft/lbs of torque on tap at 0 RPMs. Or 1,000 of each would be even better but the styling of the Cybertruck is a bridge too far for me.

 

[MnLakeBum]

I hear you folks talking about Teslas on this forum a lot. The part about service techs making house calls sounds real interesting.
But I don't think they compare to the Bronco. Here's one on our dune crossings.

Your forgot to order the optional 4" lift kit.

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