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Ducati1098

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Ducati1098

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@mcinfantry Yeah the tie rods are the same, so that article is wrong. The rack does have a different part number, but I’m assuming it’s just the ratio and not the physical size of it.
 

Rusty Sheckelford

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1) it’s not known knowledge. Ford hasn’t released a calibration/strategy for a 1.0 built vehicle subbed for 3.0 - because they haven’t tested or certified it
2) Ford isn’t advising to replace 1.0 for 3.0 - if I went in to replace my steering rack the service manual would call for a specific 1.0 part

So yes a dealer trying to do this is acting on their own outside of the purview of Ford Motor Company - why would they stand by that?

Think speed shops back in the day, or Roush today - they heavily modify cars, but they come with their own warranty not backed by Ford. When a dealer replaces a part with a non-oem spec part they’ve entered the tuning/manufacturing space.
I don't know why you're stuck on certifications, testing, or warranties, when I already said in my previous post ford doesn't need to warranty any of this.

I also don't care that ford hasn't tested this upgrade, all i'm asking is why they can't simply release the baseline specs so BigMeat and his dealer can test the upgrade for Ford and see if it works.


I think your problem is you're stuck thinking like a company man whose afraid of being sued, and that ain't no way to live my friend.
 

mj63

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I don't know why you're stuck on certifications, testing, or warranties, when I already said in my previous post ford doesn't need to warranty any of this.

I also don't care that ford hasn't tested this upgrade, all i'm asking is why they can't simply release the baseline specs so BigMeat and his dealer can test the upgrade for Ford and see if it works.


I think your problem is you're stuck thinking like a company man whose afraid of being sued, and that ain't no way to live my friend.
'Tis the only way that the Company Man is allowed to act... while employed by said company in a severely litigious society. Your unhappiness at that fact will not change the fact.

(speaking as one)
 

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Rusty Sheckelford

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'Tis the only way that the Company Man is allowed to act... while employed by said company in a severely litigious society. Your unhappiness at that fact will not change the fact.

(speaking as one)
"You've got to fight for your right to party"
 

L8apex

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I also don't care that ford hasn't tested this upgrade, all i'm asking is why they can't simply release the baseline specs so BigMeat and his dealer can test the upgrade for Ford and see if it works.
Because I’m trying to educate you on how a calibration release works. So what “baseline specs” would you like Ford to release?

There’s not just a single drop in EPAS calibration. The EPAS calibration is among ~50 other features packaged into one file, that gets flashed onto one module.

You just seem to have a fundamental lack of knowledge on how car software actually functions.
 

Evolkidbell

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The tie rod is only 2mm bigger? Does that add much strength even though the rest of the rack seems much beefier?
If were looking at Shear load, the diameter gets you about a 15% increase in cross section area. So not a lot there.
But, If you run the bending load numbers, you get about a 50% increase in bending strength. So pretty good there.
 

Bmadda

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Because I’m trying to educate you on how a calibration release works. So what “baseline specs” would you like Ford to release?

There’s not just a single drop in EPAS calibration. The EPAS calibration is among ~50 other features packaged into one file, that gets flashed onto one module.

You just seem to have a fundamental lack of knowledge on how car software actually functions.
What features does it need added? The point of this mod is to add durability (by installing a physically stronger part), but keep all functions the same. So long as its the same amount of turns lock to lock, why would any software need to be changed?
 
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BigMeatsBronco

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Im just curious, have any of you guys used the upgrade kit from Bronc Buster? This seems like it would be a fix for existing steering racks without having to go through the trouble of replacing to the Hoss 3.0 ? The guy has been testing and upgrading since he runs 40" tires.

https://broncbustertx.com/products/ultimate-steering-upgrade-package
This whole idea and thread and upgrade is to completely eliminate the need for a broncobuster band-aid.
I'll be running 40s AFTER I upgrade the tie rods, rack, and CVs, and FDU and rear axle ...not trying to see what I can break on the Bronco like BB, quite the opposite, I'm building it so it won't break with 40s. Not putting 40s on and seeing what breaks first....there is a difference. Some of us have 30+yrs of off road experience, and build 4x4s, that experience tells us what will most likely break and what won't. The first day I picked up my Bronco I climbed underneath and looked at the obviously weak areas. The steering was the first thing I noticed that is the same sized weak parts I've already broken on other IFS rigs, so this is a target point for me and a few others. BBs stunt didn't surprise me at all, when there was catastrophic failure on an OEM machine. It was predictable.
 
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BachBuiltOffRoad

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This whole idea and thread and upgrade is to completely eliminate the need for a broncobuster band-aid.
I'll be running 40s AFTER I upgrade the tie rods, rack, and CVs, and FDU and rear axle ...not trying to see what I can break on the Bronco like BB, quite the opposite, I'm building it so it won't break with 40s. Not putting 40s on and seeing what breaks first....there is a difference.

Don't be offended, I was only posting to see if others had used BB kit. I agree with you, eliminating the issue altogether with this HOSS 3.0 rack is a better solution! To be able to off-road with confidence and not having to carry an extra rack or TRE would be nice.
 

Happy

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There will be a Bronco and driver combo that will claim the new rack is a band aid for their set up.
There's a person somewhere likes to dismantle bowling balls.
 

L8apex

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What features does it need added? The point of this mod is to add durability (by installing a physically stronger part), but keep all functions the same. So long as its the same amount of turns lock to lock, why would any software need to be changed?
Well a simple feature that could need to recalibrated is idle engine speed control calibration. Because it’s an electrical power steering it puts an accessory load on the engine.

That interacts with fuel / spark which effect emissions and fuel economy.

And that’s the first one off the top of my head.

EDIT:

Also it may be plug and play - but who knows internally the gear ratio may be different, so it wouldn’t be the same lock to lock. It may require different gain or integral controllers from1.0 to 2.0, that could also change lock to lock. Who knows maybe 3.0 adds an internal temp sensor to make sure it can take the beating in the desert.
 
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Bmadda

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One question I can put to bed right now: both racks are 3.5 turns lock to lock. I checked my Bronco w/tie rods removed from knuckles (in order to eliminate steering stops from being a factor...which they werent...its 3.5 turns even in the driveway), and checked the 3.0 rack on the bench...3.5 turns. Mine is 2dr Bl w/sas. Not sure if non sas is different, hopefully somebody can check...but sasquatch to 3.0 rack WILL NOT change steering ratio...so we got that going for us!

20220814_130626.jpg


20220814_130603.jpg
 

jeff in ohio

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Well here it is folks it showed up and she sure is sexy in a beefy way!!!!

Ford wants $1700 to do the install but can't seem to get the programming or calibration for it🤔🤪🫣🫢🤭

Anyway I'll devise a solution very soon since Ford's programming team is slow and well just plain dumb. ( Maybe this is why some folks have got their new WT yet....their built but the programming is way behind....

I'll keep the community informed and up to date on this awesome upgrade as it progresses.

Ford Bronco HOSS 3.0 severe duty STEERING RACK and TIE RODS ...Ford Performance M-3200-WT 20220814_130603


Ford Bronco HOSS 3.0 severe duty STEERING RACK and TIE RODS ...Ford Performance M-3200-WT 20220814_130603




Updated with Hoss 3.0 steering rack wiring diagram from @flip

Ford Bronco HOSS 3.0 severe duty STEERING RACK and TIE RODS ...Ford Performance M-3200-WT 20220814_130603

So, here is what you do. Ford makes availale the stock module configurations for every vehicle thru here:

https://www.motorcraftservice.com/AsBuilt


Next up...you need a VIN... yours and one for a Bronco with this fancy new steering rack. Turns out, you can find such VIN numbhers on cars.com. Here is what I used...

Wildtrack VIN 1FMEE5DP4NLB05301 not sure if this has the fancy new steering gear. I am guessing not.

Raptor which has this fancy steering rack. VIN 1FMEE5JR9NLA51127.

First Edition 2 door (what you have, right?) 1FMDE5FP0MLA20480

You can now donwload the files and compare. Realizing that Ford does not re-invent the wheel when programming items across platforms,you explore such things as Ranger and F150 sites to get info. It is known that the first 3 digits are thye module as follows:

poertrain controlPCM7E0
image processingIPMA706
gateway moduleGWM716
instrument controlIPC720
battery energy controlBECM723
steering column controlSCCM724
body controlBCM726
audio controlACIM727
power steering controlPSCM730
parking aidPAM736
restraint controlRCM737
voltage qualityDCDC746
radio transceiverRTM751
transmission controlTCU754
anti lockABS760
cruise controlCCM764
occupant classification systemOCSM765
digital signal processing radioDSP783
trailerTRM791
all terrain controlATCM792
front controls interfaceFCIM7A7
heads up displayHUD7B2
side obstacle detection leftSODL7C4
side obstacle detection rightSODR7C6
accesory protocal interfaceAPIM7D0

In addtion, the F-150 guys broke down a lot of stuff here:



Some of the more common features will have the same parameters across platforms, where others will be spcific to the F-150 in that document. A lot of paramter descriptions in the 730 (PSCM) for the F-150 should be same as the Bronco.

So, what you are looking for in teh data from the Ford Service site is anything that starts with 730 that is different in your module vas a Raptor module (it has the rack you want). I have done this for you. You will see that a Wild track is missing 730-05-01 paramters vs the First Edition and Raptor. I do beleive this value is related to a parking distance sensor.

The only difference between a Raptor and a First Edition 2 door is the 023A at then end of paramter 730-03-01. What would I do? I would use forscan to take the original configuration out of your old PSCM and load it into your new rack. Then change the value that is different for the Raptor configuration

wildtrackraptorfirst edition
730-01-01FF010100023C730-01-01FF010100023C730-01-01FF010100023C
730-01-0200020000003C730-01-0200020000003C730-01-0200020000003C
730-01-0300000000003B730-01-0300000000003B730-01-0300000000003B
730-01-0400000000003C730-01-0400000000003C730-01-0400000000003C
730-01-05000000003D730-01-05000000003D730-01-05000000003D
730-02-01FFFFFF000037730-02-01FFFFFF000037730-02-01FFFFFF000037
730-02-02FFFF00000039730-02-02FFFF00000039730-02-02FFFF00000039
730-02-03FF000000003B730-02-03FF000000003B730-02-03FF000000003B
730-02-0400000000003D730-02-0400000000003D730-02-0400000000003D
730-02-05000000003E730-02-05000000003E730-02-05000000003E
730-03-01FF00FFFF0139730-03-01FF00FFFF023A730-03-01FF00FFFF0139
730-03-0200FF0000003B730-03-0200FF0000003B730-03-0200FF0000003B
730-03-0300000000003D730-03-0300000000003D730-03-0300000000003D
730-03-0400000000003E730-03-0400000000003E730-03-0400000000003E
730-03-05000000003F730-03-05000000003F730-03-05000000003F
730-04-01FFFFFFFFFF37730-04-01FFFFFFFFFF37730-04-01FFFFFFFFFF37
730-04-02FFFFFFFFFF38730-04-02FFFFFFFFFF38730-04-02FFFFFFFFFF38
730-04-03FFFFFFFFFF39730-04-03FFFFFFFFFF39730-04-03FFFFFFFFFF39
730-04-04FFFFFFFFFF3A730-04-04FFFFFFFFFF3A730-04-04FFFFFFFFFF3A
730-04-05FFFFFFFFFF3B730-04-05FFFFFFFFFF3B730-04-05FFFFFFFFFF3B
730-04-06FFFFFFFFFF3C730-04-06FFFFFFFFFF3C730-04-06FFFFFFFFFF3C
730-04-07FFFFFFFFFF3D730-04-07FFFFFFFFFF3D730-04-07FFFFFFFFFF3D
730-04-08FFFFFFFFFF3E730-04-08FFFFFFFFFF3E730-04-08FFFFFFFFFF3E
730-04-09FFFFFFFFFF3F730-04-09FFFFFFFFFF3F730-04-09FFFFFFFFFF3F
730-04-10FFFFFFFFFF46730-04-10FFFFFFFFFF46730-04-10FFFFFFFFFF46
730-04-11FFFFFFFFFF47730-04-11FFFFFFFFFF47730-04-11FFFFFFFFFF47
730-04-12FFFFFFFFFF48730-04-12FFFFFFFFFF48730-04-12FFFFFFFFFF48
730-04-13FFFFFFFF4A730-04-13FFFFFFFF4A730-04-13FFFFFFFF4A
730-05-01FFFF3B730-05-01FFFF3B
730-06-0100000000003E730-06-0100000000003E730-06-0100000000003E
730-06-0200000000003F730-06-0200000000003F730-06-0200000000003F
730-06-03000000000040730-06-03000000000040730-06-03000000000040
730-06-04000000000041730-06-04000000000041730-06-04000000000041
730-06-050000000042730-06-050000000042730-06-050000000042



Also, realizing that the Ranger uses the same rack control methodology, that shop manual (which I have) can be used to read how the system works. In short, over CAN, the rack gets vehicle speed info. It then uses info from the torque sensor built into the ste steering colum input to the rack along with the speed data to determine how much assist for the rack motor to give. If you have Lane Keeping System (LKS)and Pull Drift Compensation (PDC), the rack can "move itself". The angle sensor is just that...used to determine how far you have turned the wheel for such things as the lines on the backup camera and to determine if the vehicle is going straight (for the PDC system) etc. As far as "calibrating" the rack, there is NOTHING in the shop manual about that. It just tells the technician to go to the ford service website, enter the vehicle vin, download the file for the module, then uplaod it into the new rack....nothing else needed. Becasue of the links above, you now have a method to pull the paramters you need to put in the rack, just like what a Ford technician would do.

For others watching at home....the racks that were failing where not "stripping the gears" Look at pics of failed racks....the casting where the lash adjuster resides is breaking and popping off. Essentially, during high force conditions, the rack is pressing against the lash adjuster and popping it out of the housing. Once the lash adjuster breaks out, the rack can now flop around inside the housing and loose contact with the pinion gear which would lead one to beleive the gears are "stripped"...which they are not. BroncBuster installed a bushing to relieve load from the lash adjuster, but IMHO, he defeated the function of the lash adjuster. If that bushing is a tight fit, it could effect the lash adjustnment on the rack causing other issues over time. From the photos of the new rack, it is very obvious that the area around the lash adjuster has been re-inforced significantly.

Good luck
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