How comfortable are you in directly negotiating with dealers?

[Wanted33]

I hated walking on to the Jeep lot. Right away they swarm you like sharks. The three easiest ways to get screwed is the price of the car, the car trade in and financing.
It's the first time I don't need to worry about price. I paid my car off early and gave it to my daughter so no trade in. And the money part is handled.

Luckily, and strangely buying my Wrangler JL was EZPZ. I saw the price on their web page, called and ask if the price (best discount in my area at the time) I see is the price I pay with no add-ons or BS fees. He said yes, what you see is what you pay. Walked in, haggled on my trade-in price, we got close enough to make both of us happy, and I drove the Jeep home. Sadly many dealers in my area have add-ons, and dealer fees that are anywhere from $500 to $1200. Then they pop you with some outrageous doc fee. I feel for folks that shop by monthly payment. They get the royal high hard one, and don't even realize what just happened.

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[Inventor]

Luckily, and strangely buying my Wrangler JL was EZPZ. I saw the price on their web page, called and ask if the price (best discount in my area at the time) I see is the price I pay with no add-ons or BS fees. He said yes, what you see is what you pay. Walked in, haggled on my trade-in price, we got close enough to make both of us happy, and I drove the Jeep home. Sadly many dealers in my area have add-ons, and dealer fees that are anywhere from $500 to $1200. Then they pop you with some outrageous doc fee. I feel for folks that shop by monthly payment. They get the royal high hard one, and don't even realize what just happened.

Never talk about financing or monthly payments until you negotiated the price of the car first.

 

[Judge Rufus]

Why would a dealership purposely push a reservation holder away, rather than try to compete with a better deal in another state?

Yes, by selling even at invoice, they get to add that sale to their annual volume rebate from Ford and more importantly, they get to count that sale as a converted reservation towards their allocation for the next model year. Now if every dealer held strong at MSRP, this wouldn't work, but as it has been shown there are dealers out there that are negotiating, and that is our leverage to get our local dealers to move down. Your dealer just needs to know that you understand that you have alternatives, because that's where the price should fall to, your next best alternative.

 

[CapeCodCash]

You should of seen me negotiating for my 2015 Ford Taurus SEL. What puts you in the best position is not having a vehicle to trade in.

Why do you say that about a trade in putting you in a bad position?

 

[xusarmy]

Why do you say that about a trade in putting you in a bad position?

I feel like dealership's like to play around with the numbers when you have a trade in. I dont know if I have ever had a time where its like, we will give you $10,000 for your trade in, oh by the way the cost of the car is now this. Just games people play.

 

[Judge Rufus]

I feel like dealership's like to play around with the numbers when you have a trade in. I dont know if I have ever had a time where its like, we will give you $10,000 for your trade in, oh by the way the cost of the car is now this. Just games people play.

It can play to your advantage. Kind of depends on what the market conditions for used cars is.

Let's say you have the price for your new car set at $40,000, and you believe your trade in is worth $15,000. You and the dealer are close, but they aren't showing you that yet. They may have room to go up on your trade in, but not lower on the price of the new car.

You can say, look, the net price to have me walking out of here with this new car is $25,000 after the trade-in. You don't care how they do the math. They can write it up as new car price $41,000 and trade-in at $16,000. Or even new car price $39,000 and trade in at $14,000. You get the net price you're after. You are only going to pay sales tax on the net amount, so it shouldn't matter how they do accounting at the dealership.

 

[Tortuga353]

Yeah I just used Stealership as a play on the language found on this forum.

I believe you are right on no new information from Ford but waiting for the dealer to just confirm it for themselves.

I feel pretty good with at least x plan in my pocket and my local dealership whom I’ve never worked with but were locally advertising and at least conscious prior to the event.

I have given them the opportunity to step up and match. I think since I have an earlier reservation around #3000 based on our guesstimate reservation number range and I’m using this as a bit of a carrot as well. Earlier delivery and some minor publicity for the dealer.

I am also very close to solidifying a deal with a well known big brake kit manufacturer to use my rig for test fit and publicity.

- I doubt you are going to see any further "plan" announcements from Ford. They made that announcement a few weeks ago.
- The fact that you refer to your dealer as a "stealer" says to me that you don't trust them, are at best incompetent, considering their claim of lack of knowledge.
- Dealers clearly know what the invoice pricing is for any particular trim. Individual invoice pricing of options is probably not out yet, but will be once the order guides are pushed out. I highly doubt you or your dealer will be negotiating individual prices on options, etc.

Most negotiations will either be at:

- MSRP + what fee
- MSRP and no ADM
- MSRP less an amount
- At invoice + fee
- At invoice
- At invoice less an amount

I would think you could get to that level of negotiation without knowing the specific MSRP or invoice amount to the penny. With the B&P and other info here on 6G, you should be fairly close to determine your affordability.

 

[Jpeyer]

Serious question
I'm curious how some of you plan to "walk away from the dealership" if you had your car ordered and delivered there

Or are you saying you're doing the negotiating in December prior to ordering?

If you are not getting an order/contract in writing .. signed.. you are in for upset possibly when it arrives. CYA

 

[Vigor]

If you are not getting an order/contract in writing .. signed.. you are in for upset possibly when it arrives. CYA

Agreed
First thing I asked for from the dealership im talking to

 

[john houseman]

I keep seeing people say that the dealers are the ones in control. That there are more people in line who will step in to our place if we switch dealerships. I'm willing to consider that I may have this all wrong, but after contemplating it for a while, I don't think I do.

Everything we've been told is that Ford expects to only fill reservations for the 21 MY. There will supposedly be no dealer stock in 2021 - except for the few orders that get backed out on. This tells me that dealers have no limited inventory of Broncos to work from. They need reservation holders to choose them in order to get Broncos delivered to their dealership. Further, for every Bronco they have delivered to reservation holders in 2021 at their dealership, they increase their allotment for dealer stock, when it gets built.

I said in another thread that this isn't a zero sum game. Dealers don't have a fixed number of units to sell to whomever they select. The smart dealers know that the more reservations they can convert to orders, the more dealer stock they can expect down the road. They lose more than a few dollars if a reservation switches away from them, and they gain more than just dollars if a reservation switches to them.

Why would a dealership purposely push a reservation holder away, rather than try to compete with a better deal in another state?

They shouldn't. You have the vehicle reserved (not them). If you don't buy from them, they make $0, because they won't get that vehicle or a future one. They should be happy making any profit at all. That's what puts you in control.

 

[Orf]

They shouldn't. You have the vehicle reserved (not them). If you don't buy from them, they make $0, because they won't get that vehicle or a future one. They should be happy making any profit at all. That's what puts you in control.

Dealers here in SW PA don't see it that way. They all act like they can sell that same Bronco to anyone. Guess I'm buying out of state...

 

[Vigor]

Dealers here in SW PA don't see it that way. They all act like they can sell that same Bronco to anyone. Guess I'm buying out of state...

The ones in PA don't have one competitive bone in their bodies
Looking at two dealerships from 2 different neighboring states

 

[Orf]

The ones in PA don't have one competitive bone in their bodies
Looking at two dealerships from 2 different neighboring states

I don't think it's a competitive thing. They all think they dictate who will get a Bronco and who won't. Half of them are charging over MSRP.

The sales guy at the dealership that was assigned my reservation told me - "You know, there's only $700 between MSRP and Invoice." That's when I laughed, stood up, and walked out.

 

[john houseman]

The dealer doesn't hold the reservation, you do. If you don't order, they have nothing to make a profit on and won't get an allotment for a future Bronco. Get the price you want (invoice should actually make them smile, but you can go lower) or threaten to cancel "your" reservation and walk. It's their choice to make $0 on no deal, or a profit of any kind, don't be bullied.
As for financing; get pre approved with your bank or local credit union before taking delivery, If they can beat that rate, let them finance you. If not, finance with your bank. It's easy, no room for them to screw you if you know all the variables going in.

 

[john houseman]

The ones in PA don't have one competitive bone in their bodies
Looking at two dealerships from 2 different neighboring states

If they have that attitude, they won't be selling many in the future. They won't get any allotments from Ford. Sucks that they won't deal, but walking is what you should do. Transfer your reservation.

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