Lite Brite Bronco Crawls Fawlty Towers

[Hossfire]

I enjoy watching their videos. And Brittany is easy on the eyes

The Bilsteen factory video was really cool.

I don't plan to go rock crawling in my rig. East Coast offroading is mostly mud and trails that my current ride ('06 Commander) can handle. I have found that my current ride's breakover angles can limit access to rough camp sites.

Bronco gives me boxy looks, more capability than I need, and is a nice daily driver. Also, so many Toyotas have me looking through the blue part of the windshield --- they seem to be made for folks that don't sit as tall as me.

I didn't spec the sway bar disconnect, but would have gone for beefier components than the 'Squatch spec, if they were available. I might spend the extra wait/ money for Raptor but so few will be available and the ADMs will be even worse than what we are seeing on the standard models.

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[Cable Guy]

Aren't these the tires he has. Seem to work pretty good here.
Check out 11:07

Also, would love to see the rig that "crawls" through trail @ 3:48
(locals who've gone through "Crawl Daddy" when the stream is running hard know
what I speak of).

Not sure but I’ve watched them slip and slide through a number of videos now. They react terribly to the slick rock terrain. Embarrassingly bad actually.

 

[Rex21c]

These are stock, except for...... but their stock.

Well if you've added spacers on the bronco, and 35s and spacers on the jeep, they are no longer stock! I know it was in an attempt to keep it apples to apples, just sayin, not stock.

Edit: Just got to the end of the video and he said the "upgrades" we did, so.....

 

[vrtical]

In for being able to handle hardcore with a stock BL and come out better then a modded Bronco with heavy ass tires on it another great video on OEM capabilities. Weight kills at the corners period. Coming from a racing background, you always look for potential week links and maybe try to make them less prone to failure.

 

[Aaonter]

Another great video, thanks @LiteBrite! I've been doing something similar but at the other end of the spectrum, seeing how far and hard I can wheel the bone stock Cheapest Bronco You Can Buy (no lockers, no nothing LOL). While I've been impressed with the stripper model, those Badlands/Sasquatch rigs are truly amazing, and I love seeing you guys wring everything you can out of them.

My favorite thing about these videos is that it pretty much debunks the whole "IFS can't rock crawl" argument. Yeah, it doesn't flex quite as well as the straight-axle Jeep, but Ford has done enough with the suspension and drivetrain tuning that it still seems relatively stable and controllable when a tire is lifted, so that you can still work your way through most of the same obstacles as the stock Rubicon. And for the other 90% of the time, it simply outshines the Jeep (I also have a JK Rubicon so I'm not just fan-boy talking).

Keep the content coming!

Oh, I wanted to ask if you guys will be at the United By Bronco event at Sand Hollow in March?

Sweet Video for sure! This video really shows why I prefer the Solid axle for a trail rig. I am not as good of a driver as Kevin and do not have a Britney to spot me but the Axle is just planted better and more forgiving. I have said this before in my wheeling days I have seen so many IFS rigs show they can make it on trail and they can but it is always a battle and does not seem like being able to play. Also it is just more expensive to lift and you will be repairing it more. You have to be super careful. This is a great tutorial on driving the bronco. Watch him and Healy wheel. Never turn the wheels under load. Unlock the front unless you really need it. Even on a solid axle it is important so you can actually turn but on a IFS it will save your components as well. Also IFS need to make obstacles in a one take. The IFS is great on absorbing a hit on a ledge to cruise over it then push through with the rear axle. I cannot wait to see what they do to there Bronco. One huge advantage the IFS Bronco seems to have over IFS in the past is there seems to be more aftermarket support from the get go. Hopefully the cost should be better than historically because you will need to do less custom work which is always more expensive. Thank you Kevin and Britney!

 

[ezapar]

I sure like seeing vids of the vehicles in stock form and what they can do. I plan to do those trails in my Badlands.

 

[Broncotrax]

Thanks and great job you two. I'm happy to see your rocker panels are still straight!
Keep up the cool videos. I'll be in Moab the second full week of May. It would be cool if you guys were there as well. stay safe!!!!

 

[Natai]

I am in no way knowledgeable or experienced in such matters, but seems to me that everyone reporting steering and tie rod issues have been running with lifts, larger tires, etc.

I was under the impression it was understood that with IFS, any substantial lift was going to require other modifications to correct the geometry. To my inexperienced mind, that would involve adjusting the angles and lengths of components. Instead it seems like many are just deciding components need to be strengthened or reinforced, and then pushing them until something else breaks.

In other words, they are trying to upgrade an IFS vehicles as if it was SFA.

Am I way off base and confused?

 

[PWillette]

I am in no way knowledgeable or experienced in such matters, but seems to me that everyone reporting steering and tie rod issues have been running with lifts, larger tires, etc.

I was under the impression it was understood that with IFS, any substantial lift was going to require other modifications to correct the geometry. To my inexperienced mind, that would involve adjusting the angles and lengths of components. Instead it seems like many are just deciding components need to be strengthened or reinforced, and then pushing them until something else breaks.

In other words, they are trying to upgrade an IFS vehicles as if it was SFA.

Am I way off base and confused?

No you are not.
There is always a trade-off when substantial modifications are made and you end up chasing newly created issues/weak spots caused by a previous mod. I suppose not a big deal if you have unlimited cash on hand.

 

[Dusty]

I am in no way knowledgeable or experienced in such matters, but seems to me that everyone reporting steering and tie rod issues have been running with lifts, larger tires, etc.

I was under the impression it was understood that with IFS, any substantial lift was going to require other modifications to correct the geometry. To my inexperienced mind, that would involve adjusting the angles and lengths of components. Instead it seems like many are just deciding components need to be strengthened or reinforced, and then pushing them until something else breaks.

In other words, they are trying to upgrade an IFS vehicles as if it was SFA.

Am I way off base and confused?

You're right, according to the conventional wisdom of the past. However, Ford has gone to great lengths to try to convince us that THIS implementation of IFS is above and beyond what we've seen in the past, as regards it's intended use, and what we should be able to expect as far as performance and robustness of the components. They have squarely placed it against the Wrangler in the market, and while they've officially conceded that it may not be *quite* as good as the Wrangler in suspension articulation, that it would make up for it in other ways. For the most part they have proven that out, with the exception of the ability of the components to withstand a commensurate level of use/abuse. Adding a lift and bigger tires is not a big ask. It's normal, and expected, in any vehicle expected to compete against the Wrangler.

Remember, this isn't a Toyota pickup, or an FJ Cruiser, or any other half-assed attempt at a multi-use vehicle that just happens to have 4 wheel drive variant. This is the BRONCO, and Ford has bent over backwards to convince us that it will be worthy of that name, even though it has IFS. They've gone out of their way to encourage us to modify it in any way reasonable, as they know that is one of the things that made the Wrangler wildly popular. And yes, that does extend to suspension and tire size. Hell they even molded "Lift Me, Baby!" into the wheel well liners:

The weakness of the steering components is something that Ford probably failed to discover in their durability testing, as those who are breaking them are NOT using the vehicle's beyond what Ford implies they should be capable of. I'm not talking about Broncbuster and those 40's, I'm talking about the many folks who are breaking the steering racks and tie rods on 37's, on trails that are, yes, challenging, but not necessarily extreme. These are weak components, pure and simple. To give Ford a pass for that because those people are actually wheeling their Broncos and putting them to the test, is letting them off easy.

I'm guessing Ford did actually discover that weakness in their own testing, and that's why there's an upgraded rack and pinion available soon, which will presumably be used in the new Raptor Bronco. I'm guessing they discovered the weaknesses of the original components after it was already too late to change everything over before the 2021's went into production. But I would expect to see the beefier components become standard equipment on the higher trim levels, and anything with Sasquatch, at some point.

 

[PWillette]

You're right, according to the conventional wisdom of the past. However, Ford has gone to great lengths to try to convince us that THIS implementation of IFS is above and beyond what we've seen in the past, as regards it's intended use, and what we should be able to expect as far as performance and robustness of the components. They have squarely placed it against the Wrangler in the market, and while they've officially conceded that it may not be *quite* as good as the Wrangler in suspension articulation, that it would make up for it in other ways. For the most part they have proven that out, with the exception of the ability of the components to withstand a commensurate level of use/abuse. Adding a lift and bigger tires is not a big ask. It's normal, and expected, in any vehicle expected to compete against the Wrangler.

Remember, this isn't a Toyota pickup, or an FJ Cruiser, or any other half-assed attempt at a multi-use vehicle that just happens to have 4 wheel drive variant. This is the BRONCO, and Ford has bent over backwards to convince us that it will be worthy of that name, even though it has IFS. They've gone out of their way to encourage us to modify it in any way reasonable, as they know that is one of the things that made the Wrangler wildly popular. And yes, that does extend to suspension and tire size. Hell they even molded "Lift Me, Baby!" into the wheel well liners:

The weakness of the steering components is something that Ford probably failed to discover in their durability testing, as those who are breaking them are NOT using the vehicle's beyond what Ford implies they should be capable of. I'm not talking about Broncbuster and those 40's, I'm talking about the many folks who are breaking the steering racks and tie rods on 37's, on trails that are, yes, challenging, but not necessarily extreme. These are weak components, pure and simple. To give Ford a pass for that because those people are actually wheeling their Broncos and putting them to the test, is letting them off easy.

I'm guessing Ford did actually discover that weakness in their own testing, and that's why there's an upgraded rack and pinion available soon, which will presumably be used in the new Raptor Bronco. I'm guessing they discovered the weaknesses of the original components after it was already too late to change everything over before the 2021's went into production. But I would expect to see the beefier components become standard equipment on the higher trim levels, and anything with Sasquatch, at some point.

Agree with your synopsis 100% w/ the caveat that a proper lift be installed. 37" tires w/ 2.5" spacer lift while utilizing factory coil overs and UCAs is a recipe for disaster IMO.

 

[Dusty]

Agree with your synopsis 100% w/ the caveat that a proper lift be installed. 37" tires w/ 2.5" spacer lift while utilizing factory coil overs and UCAs is a recipe for disaster IMO.

I think it comes down to what you think is a reasonable expectation. I think it's reasonable to expect the components to hold up to 37's and moderate use, even with a 2.5-3" spacer lift. You don't. But apparently Ford agrees with me, as it seems like they're shipping the Raptor Bronco (which will have 37's according to reports) with beefier steering components. By the way, it's not that the steering geometry is flexed beyond it's intended range of motion when the steering rack breaks. It's that the larger tires are pushing against it with increased force, at an angle that is slightly out of phase with the factory operating angle. But suspensions are designed to move, it's reasonable for us to expect that they will hold up to a reasonable amount of use, even when we take Ford's advice and "Lift Me, Baby." I think that's a reasonable expectation. That you don't is fine. We're just going to have to disagree on that.

 

[Dimitar]

God, that was excruciating to watch.

The BroncBuster guy is out to prove no one can break a Bronco faster.

 

[M Redwood]

very entertaining and informative video.... found myself asking how a 2 door would do on some of this ? maybe next video should add a 2 door in the mix with the 4 doors ... also i can see a extended front bumper not so good and 35s almost seem better than 37s... way beyond my comfort zone though ....great job!

 

[Parker]

Great that the least modified vehicle drove the lead. The two least modified vehicles do not need repairs. It probably helped that they were driven with a lighter touch.
Tire weight is a huge, constant parts killer - even cruising the Mall.

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