Mike Levine saying outright he does NOT care about Granger/Chapman/SAC

[Gamecock]

Maybe the 2023 4runner will change our mind's

Yeah, not unless it's a massive surprise and the top and doors come off.

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[rustedgoat]

This is the way i read things on THIS forum, hearsay and all, before I converted my reservation to an order.

Each dealer was going to receive a limited amount of Broncos.
You were placed in order at THAT dealer according to your timestamp.
If you switched dealers you could actually jump in line if your timestamp was earlier than others.
So Broncos should be delivered in timestamp order to each dealer if they can be built.
Once they run out, they run out for the year.
Does that mean that dealer will not have any in stock to sell before all their buildable orders are fulfilled? Will other dealers will receive stock to sell once they are caught up? I don't know

So knowing those discounted dealers had a lot of orders that would be in front of me I looked for a local dealer that showed MSRP on the list that was posted on this site. In person they said I had a good shot at getting it this year. I did get a printout of my MSRP order, don't think it's considered a contract, but its still something.

Being I have a 2 door, I was more concerned about the modified orders that become buildable that jump the line and bumping other orders back.

I do have a vin and build date

 

[treadlightly]

I keep trying to convince myself I want a wrangler or gladiator instead, but no matter how hard or gentle ford keeps trying to fuck me, I just can't beat the value and looks of a 2dr base mansquatch. Jeep's Xtreme Recon is still 4dr and auto only, and I am generally not a chrysler fan.

For real though, if I was a 4dr, 2.7, lux, BL, leather, hardtop type customer, i would have ordered a 392 over a month ago and never looked back. -6% under invoice is like 69K with the recon pack. Compared to a 62K badlands that I have to hunt for a dealer with allocation to find and BEG them to let me pay MSRP? please.

Willys 2dr manual xtreme recon shows up, and that will be the final nail in the Bronco coffin for me.

Yeah, for me it was a Defender as the potential candidate. Had the opportunity to see a Defender 110 next to a Bronco 4DR yesterday, and the Defender lost badly in my eyes. That Willys keeps catching my eye and I find the 4xe intriguing.

 

[PD63]

Just asked my local dealer who previously wanted to charge ADM about their allocations for next year and they do not have an answer yet. This allocation issue is going to go beyond Granger/SAC/Chapman

 

[treadlightly]

Maybe the 2023 4runner will change our mind's

I will definitely look. I was ready to go with a lifted Tacoma TRD Pro but my wife said she would be too scared to ever drive it. Maybe that should have been interpreted as a selling point.

 

[dingle87]

The big elephant in the room is the internet and social media. Technically, Granger isn't supposed to be targetting outside its sales area, and Granger would never break this rule by placing ads in California newspapers for example. Social media is much more grey because people can find and share Granger's deal and grant the dealer a national audience.

Big dealers in major metro areas have a lot to lose with this type of dealer capturing sales from what was once a captive market. Unfortunately, they also have the law on their side to pressure Ford into keeping them a small town dealership.

The fact is, any dealer (large or small) can do what Granger does. Their "deal" isn't isolated to Bronco. It's their business model on all mass produced vehicles. They work off volume based sales, not MSRP/ADMs. Big dealers can do the same damn thing, but choose not to hustle and wait for their prey to walk into their store. I see this as the internet finally impacting old school brick and mortar dealerships and none of them like new school. They would much prefer old school. They still have the same opportunity to capture sales in their market, they just aren't working hard to do it, because it's a new ballgame. They don't want the game to change.

This is the elephant in the room.

 

[Troy13]

What's worse is Mike keeps saying on twitter to simply change your dealer to another dealer, but if you've already converted your reservation to an order you can't switch. Ford literally has no idea what they're doing.

 

[treadlightly]

Yeah, not unless it's a massive surprise and the top and doors come off.

After this, I suspect every vehicle will have a removeable roof in 2023.

 

[deejay08]

Right, but here we are lining up like lemmings to be reamed by this company. This will need to be part of the narrative.

If the customers collectively said "f#<k off", these politician-like business leaders would change their ways. Myself included. I have been desperately trying to find an alternative vehicle and put this farce behind me, but every time I see a Bronco I somehow convince myself to stay.

I'm taking a hard look at recon package Jeep and 4 runners rn. I am just about at the point where i speak with my wallet on principle, not because i wouldn't want a Bronco more, but id be happy with any of those 3 choices.

 

[BroncoT]

If it really is just 2% of all orders then why would Ford take the black eye? This is about precedent and they chose dealer happiness over competition. This is why a class action lawsuit is inevitable.

 

[rugbysecondrow]

Mike Levine just said that for 2% of us, the sky IS falling.... that's the whole rub bub

Is it though? In case you haven't noticed, we are all waiting in line, just at a different stage. I don't have a Bronco, you don't, 95% of order holders don't. Should the sky be falling for all of us?

You don't even have any real facts or information, just some misc tweets and snippets from a few well-intentioned, but obviously biased dealerships.

Your situation will be worked out the same way all the other issues and constraints are being worked out.

We are all waiting in line...but y'all are making it way more unpleasant with the constant complaining about the exact same issue. How many threads have to be created to complain about the same stuff?

If it really is just 2% of all orders then why would Ford take the black eye? This is about precedent and they chose dealer happiness over competition. This is why a class action lawsuit is inevitable.

There won't be a class action lawsuit...that is a ridiculous idea.

 

[Rick Astley]

Bronco is a mass produced vehicle, the GT350 (R or Not) is an actual limited edition. That's difference #1

Ford didn't ask for reservations for GT350s promising people a place in line. That's difference #2.

Reservations are retail orders with customer names attached. If they are making it to the customers who actually ordered them, personally I don't care if one dealership sells 1000/2800. Allowing one dealer to buy 30% of the country's supply for dealer stock is stupid, but that's not even in the same ballpark as what we're talking about here. That's difference #3

Ford was a member of the Granger did nothing wrong crowd right up until they changed the rules. Zach got his planned cleared by his rep prior to offering it.

That's not what anyone is asking for. Granger customers don't deserve theirs first. They deserve theirs in the place in line they reserved them with concessions made for constraints like hard tops.

If you were trying to set a world record for false equivalencies in one post, I don't know if you won, but you're surely a competitor.

Bronco is a resource-constrained vehicle at this time, like GT350R is a volume-constrained vehicle. Once MAP fires up at 100% capacity (in 2023?) then this whole thing is a non-issue.

GT350R's were plenty constrained at the floorplan level by dealership allocations (due to, among other things, volume) as to who could possibly get one.

But if you really want to ground-pound a point home, lets say Granger submits customer orders for 3,000 Sports, or 3,000 of any single model. Are they getting them all? No. They will have to play with their allocation set by volume.

Granger customers are and continue to be in line, what's the issue? Their line just happens to be the one at the very far side of the stadium that a TON of people think is the secret fast line of awesomeness, but only has 2 employees taking tickets so it ends up being a slow line.

FWIW, this entire process from reservation to delivery is following exactly how Ranger pre-orders went, except the volume is higher and it's not possible to be at 100% manufacturing capacity. Customers had their reservation number in line and also had to wait until dealerships got their allocations. It's not simply a customer ID centric system and never has been.

Granger chose to set themselves out as the discount player and got exactly what it wanted. Everyone wins, eventually, regardless if you like the argument or not.

 

[phocion]

The bottom line is that Ford told customers that Broncos would be produced in approximately the order in which they were reserved, subject to availability of parts. They changed their tune later (and realistically many customers did not observe the change in the fine print), but this was the deal when many people reserved, and Ford has reiterated it several times since.

All of this discussion about allocation, big dealer, small dealer, is beside the point. That's internal Ford politics that no customer should reasonably have to concern himself with. Ford has never talked allocation formula to us, the consumer. Once we're having to talk about that stuff, Ford has already messed up massively.

I'm not saying Ford has a legal obligation to get people their Broncos when they said they would. I'm just saying it's good business, and anything less is a colossal failure, a PR problem, and a breach of trust. By Ford, not by any dealer.

 

[BroncoT]

Is it though? In case you haven't noticed, we are all waiting in line, just at a different stage. I don't have a Bronco, you don't, 95% of order holders don't. Should the sky be falling for all of us?

You don't even have any real facts or information, just some misc tweets and snippets from a few well-intentioned, but obviously biased dealerships.

Your situation will be worked out the same way all the other issues and constraints are being worked out.

We are all waiting in line...but y'all are making it way more unpleasant with the constant complaining about the exact same issue. How many threads have to be created to complain about the same stuff?



There won't be a class action lawsuit...that is a ridiculous idea.

Not for the Bronco, but reservations systems in general. Inevitable. Mark my words

 

[hemiblas]

I find it hilarious the sheer amount of people trying to claim dealers would commit to pricing.

This was what the first dealer told me…

After I read they didn’t know what pricing would be and wanted to add $1,600 in add-ons I was out. I switched to Granger in mid-August before the other 1,000+ people followed me, they only had like 100-150 when I switched. How was I to know my experience would be the same as everyone else and everyone else would follow suit? Now everyone is being punished simply for looking out for themselves. The apologists on this website are unreal.

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