New Build Advice: Locker vs V6

[mpeugeot]

There will be a lot of people suggesting that the 2.7 or the 2.3 is the right motor, but the reality is that the engine choice likely matters far less than other considerations.

That said, I was getting the 2.7 for myself. If you get the 2.3, sure, you will give up some power. If you get the 2.7, then you MIGHT give up some fuel economy and you will certainly give up some simplicity.

The bottom line is that you really can't pick a "wrong" motor in the Bronco. Both engines have more than ample power, fuel efficiency, and reliability in general. This goes double for a non-sasquatch 2 door Bronco that has much less weight to haul around.

As far as transmissions go, I have not driven the manual transmission, but the 10R60 has been brilliant in my ride, both on and off road. While I generally dislike slush-boxes, off-road the automatic transmission is a hero and gives exceptional control for an automatic while requiring far less skill. The automatic will make you look far more skilled than you actually are. If I was going to be on the street only and the 2.7 was available in a stick shift... no question, I would have taken the stick shift.

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[lemonslush]

if you want to go off road then you wouldnt want either option. You would want a base with SAS pkg. Gets you front and rear lockers with 4.7 gears for the 35" tires. Rear lockers alone are fine but if its actually going to be for off road you want both. Disconnecting sway would also be great, i expect they will come with a manual sway disconnect at some point if you cant afford a badlands. I would say the 4 bangers is perfectly fine for everyday driving especially on a non SAS bronco, for a SAS bronco its fine just gonna be a tad slower. If you need more power a ford performance tune gets it almost close to a v6 and its cheaper than the v6 and its all factory warranty covered. So for that reason I would say go BASE with SAS pkg, 4 and get a hardtop even if you dont want it. You can sell the hard top for 6-8k cash and then get someones takeoff soft top for $800-1000 and pay yourself back for the extra cost of the SAS PKG. Its not the suspensions honestly its the gearing and lockers thats what you care about. SAS take off coils are not alot but adding big wheels and tires then getting it all installed is gonna be thousands. Get the SAS and youll also be getting factory covered parts vs aftermarket stuff and a vehcile thats worth less over a stock on trade in.

 

[lemonslush]

You can always add a locker later, can’t change the engine...

true but the 4 is plenty adequate power and with a tune its even better. adding lockers front and rear aftermarket will cost more than the SAS Pkg let alone void yoru new cars warranty

 

[RagnarKon]

Well, damn. Now I'm starting to lean back toward Black Diamond. Haha

Not that this will help your decision in anyway... but I have a Badlands (manual trans, with Adv 4x4). I live in New England so we definitely get all four seasons, including plenty of snow. I have never once used 4-Auto. So I personally would consider Advanced 4x4 optional. And if you are getting a manual transmission, a Big Bend with locker and standard Black Diamond are identical mechanically.

So if you are avoiding a car payment (which is incredibly smart right now given interest rates), I personally don't see any reason to go Black Diamond unless you really feel like you want that Adv 4x4 transfer case upgrade.

The hardest part is knowing when to stop. I personally budgeted $40,000 for a Bronco, and that grew to $47,500. Granted a big reason why it grew is because my build was delayed for so long that I could continue saving money. But there was also a huge lack of will power on my part to tell myself "STOP ADDING STUFF".

 

[Nate Train]

Not that this will help your decision in anyway... but I have a Badlands (manual trans, with Adv 4x4). I live in New England so we definitely get all four seasons, including plenty of snow. I have never once used 4-Auto. So I personally would consider Advanced 4x4 optional. And if you are getting a manual transmission, a Big Bend with locker and standard Black Diamond are identical mechanically.

So if you are avoiding a car payment (which is incredibly smart right now given interest rates), I personally don't see any reason to go Black Diamond unless you really feel like you want that Adv 4x4 transfer case upgrade.

The hardest part is knowing when to stop. I personally budgeted $40,000 for a Bronco, and that grew to $47,500. Granted a big reason why it grew is because my build was delayed for so long that I could continue saving money. But there was also a huge lack of will power on my part to tell myself "STOP ADDING STUFF".

Oh, the urge is there. It would be a different build for sure if money wasn't an issue.

 

[mpeugeot]

With that 10 speed automatic and a torque coverter, the gears are never an issue unless you are running 37's or larger.

With the manual transmission, the gears really are not an issue either, because (unless I am mistaken) all manual transmission Broncos come with either 4.46:1 or 4.70:1 gears. My math says that is a 5% difference between the two.

So at 2000 RPM in 4L with the adv 4x4 with the 4.70 gear on 33's, you will be going 2.01 MPH. At 2000 RPM in 4L with the adv 4x4 with the 4.46 gear on 33's, you will be going 2.12 MPH. If you are running 35's at 2000 rpm with the 4.70 gears, you will be screaming at 2.13 mph and if you have 4.46 gears, you will be ripping away at 2.25 MPH.

The difference between the 4.46 and the 4.70 is nothing but marketing. I mean seriously, can you tell the difference at idle between 0.50 MPH (33"/4.70) and 0.56 MPH (35"/4.46)?

 

[Mattwings]

I will weigh in one more time. New to Off Road, looking for bang for your buck 2.3 rear locker is the best bang for your buck. 4A transfer case is th next best option. After that, go Badlands for front 210 axle and stay bar disconnect. Everything else, other than SQ (depending on model) is window dressing ( nothing wrong with that I am high package, 2.7 Badlands non-squatch).

 

[BigBendBW]

Hi Everyone,

I will be ordering my Bronco when the banks reopen in March, and I'm waffling back and forth between a few different options. I'm trying to keep my price on the lower end, so I'm somewhat limited in what I can do.

Basically, this is where I'm sitting. I can either order a Base with a V6 and no lockers or a Big Bend with an I4 and lockers. The price difference is relatively small for me.

I'm not currently a big off roader, but the point of buying a Bronco is to do some off roading. Since I'm an amateur, I'll start small and build my way up to more difficult stuff. I've always wanted to get into it. I don't know if I'll ever get to the point where I'm doing serious rock crawling, but I want to be able to get myself out of trouble if I run into problems.

I've read a bunch about lockers on the threads here and they really seem desirable. It also seems, based on what I've read, that the V6 is really nice to have. I haven't seen a post yet asking this exact question, though: If have a choice between getting a V6 OR the rear locking differential, which is preferable?

Apologies if this has been done to death, but I just haven't seen it in all my reading.

The 2.3 is a great engine and I have the Ford Performance tune and it’s fantastic. I agree with others, the Basesquatch is an awesome way to go and most bang for your buck. That’s what I need up with and it’s great, I don’t need the extra stuff that some higher trims come with interior wise.

 

[orion]

Dude, Base Manual Sasquatch! It doesn't get any better than that at that price point!

 

[Broncobama]

Lots of people suggesting Base w/ Sasquatch but I’m under the impression that you won’t be able to order Sasquatch if/when the banks open up. Might have a chance if you already had an order that wasn’t built in 22, but even those people are being pressured by ford to drop sas. Am I missing something? If OP orders a base sas in March and gets delivered this year there will be a lot of angry people here.

 

[indio22]

if you want to go off road then you wouldnt want either option. You would want a base with SAS pkg. Gets you front and rear lockers with 4.7 gears for the 35" tires. Rear lockers alone are fine but if its actually going to be for off road you want both. Disconnecting sway would also be great, i expect they will come with a manual sway disconnect at some point if you cant afford a badlands. I would say the 4 bangers is perfectly fine for everyday driving especially on a non SAS bronco, for a SAS bronco its fine just gonna be a tad slower. If you need more power a ford performance tune gets it almost close to a v6 and its cheaper than the v6 and its all factory warranty covered. So for that reason I would say go BASE with SAS pkg, 4 and get a hardtop even if you dont want it. You can sell the hard top for 6-8k cash and then get someones takeoff soft top for $800-1000 and pay yourself back for the extra cost of the SAS PKG. Its not the suspensions honestly its the gearing and lockers thats what you care about. SAS take off coils are not alot but adding big wheels and tires then getting it all installed is gonna be thousands. Get the SAS and youll also be getting factory covered parts vs aftermarket stuff and a vehcile thats worth less over a stock on trade in.

You don't need lockers to go off-road though. And certainly not a front locker for many people. Nor are huge tires necessarily needed, depends on the terrain. Probably a Base swapped to 32/33 inch tires is plenty for a decent number of folks off-road. Might want to also add some skid plate protection, depending on how the vehicle is equipped.

Maybe the ease these days of ordering all the goodies stock with a vehicle, has changed perception of what is actually needed for off-road? For years people have been wheeling without all that stuff.

Consider before front e-lockers, putting a locker in the front end was typically not a common thing due to the negative consequences, and yet people were still off-roading all over the place.

 

[NVCowboy]

I'm confused. Are we still discussing Sasquatch like it's a thing? I thought it was on the list of things not to order . . . or else never see a Bronco till '24.

Big Bend locker is a good choice with better tires. Black Diamond 2.3 is a good choice (because skid plates, but they can be added) What interior do you like; i actually like my BIg Bend interior. Steelies are badass, so we're back to BD. Money is a thing though, so get nicer tires on a base base and go have some fun. Big Bend 'll probably get built sooner. I'm sure 2.3 on a 2D is plenty.

Lots of considerations, but having a Bronco is half the battle.

 

[JerryC]

With that 10 speed automatic and a torque coverter, the gears are never an issue unless you are running 37's or larger.

With the manual transmission, the gears really are not an issue either, because (unless I am mistaken) all manual transmission Broncos come with either 4.46:1 or 4.70:1 gears. My math says that is a 5% difference between the two.

So at 2000 RPM in 4L with the adv 4x4 with the 4.70 gear on 33's, you will be going 2.01 MPH. At 2000 RPM in 4L with the adv 4x4 with the 4.46 gear on 33's, you will be going 2.12 MPH. If you are running 35's at 2000 rpm with the 4.70 gears, you will be screaming at 2.13 mph and if you have 4.46 gears, you will be ripping away at 2.25 MPH.

The difference between the 4.46 and the 4.70 is nothing but marketing. I mean seriously, can you tell the difference at idle between 0.50 MPH (33"/4.70) and 0.56 MPH (35"/4.46)?

All good points.

Lower gears do three other things I can think of off the top.
Increase acelleration especially from a stop or low speed.
Increase vehicle control through the throttle. Again noticeably at low speed.
Decrease stress on the engine and trans under certain types of load.

IMHO, as long as I have enough gearing in the Trans to allow highway cruising at low rpms, I'll take the lower gears.

For the OP, not an easy choice but for me 4cyl and locker.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Having only read page 1, I really like these replys :

If you have a heavy foot, then V6 might be the way to go. In that case you will get a real benefit, every time you drive the vehicle and hit the throttle.

I like Indios reasoning and similar was mentioned earlier also .... but that being said, my preference was for the lockers ... UNTIL ...
you mentioned winter driving.

Then mpeugeot wrote this beauty...

I respect your choice, but given what you are saying and especially when you are looking at a winter vehicle, think carefully about forgoing the advanced 4x4 transfer case.

From initial reports, the advanced 4x4 transfer case is stronger and more durable than the standard transfer case. It also allows full time 4A which is a big deal in the winter.

Now I'll spend even more of your money.
Depending on your winter weather needs, this would be my priority (now that I have driven a part time 4x4 through two winters)

1. dedicated winter tires like Blizzaks
2. full time 4A
3. lockers

Tires --- Dedicated winters if your area justifies them. 1st priority.
Not the happiest with my Toyo OC AT3 tires performance in winter hard pack snow and ice or even just wet roads on colder days. The rubber simply does not engage the road surface. They do roll out very smoothly , even at speed.
NO AT (or worse Mud T) are even comparable to winters for your daily winter driving.

full time 4A --- I've been spoiled by the sheer competence of our Subarus on Blizzaks or X-ices. Best performing winter vehicles I've had yet.
I feel like trying to achieve that level of AWD would be the second step after good winter tire set up.

Lockers --- would be a nice option to have especially with my shit tires. The bitch is, the factory lockers disengage at 25mph. I'm not sure if any of the computer nannies will re-engage them at speeds over 25???
... and really, having one do that at the wrong moment could be disastrous.
So last priority, lockers, factory or aftermarket.

So, my next Bronco wll be a Badlands so that 2 and 3 are taken care of at the factory.
I have been buying aftermarket winter wheels/tires for years now, so that is an expected expense for me for just about any vehicle I would buy. Actually, I buy cool summer wheels and mount the factory tires and run the factory wheels with the winter tires.
win win with quality wheels/tires year 'round.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

All good points.

Lower gears do three other things I can think of of the top.
Increase acelleration especially from a stop or low speed.
Increase vehicle control through the throttle. Again noticeably at low speed.
Decrease stress on the engine and trans under certain types of load.

IMHO, as long as I have enough gearing in the Trans to allow highway cruising at low rpms, I'll take the lower gears.

For the OP, not an easy choice but for me 4cyl and locker.

I have the 4.46 manual and 35's ... driveable, but not "ideal".
6th gear is completely useless, it drives the boost numbers way up and fuel mileage goes straight into the shitter.
I now run 78/80 mph in 5th gear @2700rpm and it likes it there. As far as I can tell, I may have actually improved my fuel mileage, which even I cannot believe.
I, and others that have done it, TYPICALLY agree that 33" tires would probably be the best/tallest size for the 4.46. The Base 30" was too small for the 4.46 ... IN MY OPINION.
It drove almost like a manual Super Duty with a granny gear... not even talking about the Crawler gear!

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