New Ford Bronco Near St. Louis: Coming Soon!

Dave2002ti

Well-Known Member
First Name
Dave
Joined
Feb 16, 2020
Messages
64
Reaction score
54
Location
Clifton, VA
Vehicle(s)
2012 Grand Cherokee
So I like a simple setup for simple tasks too, but ... how do you know the Bronco's system isn't the one that will finally be "there"?
What other Ford vehicle has an active suspension? Raptor doesnt have one. GT500 doesn't Gt40 not really if at all. So Ford has no proven active suspensions. Again the Bronco is mass market vehicle and designing a decent suspension for on road and off road is tough enough. Going active is even tougher. Yeah you could have both a terrain response dial and suspension response dial but thats a lot of computer power on the suspension side and for off road use it needs to be integrated with the engine management and drive options. For instance you are off road and rock crawling and you need to lock the rear diff what suspension setting do you need? The settings are totally different than for running fast offroad on roads like they run in the Baja 1000. And we havent even talked about weather and simple things like wet grass or sand. Then there is the integration of throttle mapping with the suspension settings and the diffs. Ford doesn't have the R&D budget right now based on their reported earnings and financial outlook.

Dave Apker





Advertisement

 

Timsvtgen1

Badlands
Well-Known Member
First Name
Tim
Joined
Jan 13, 2020
Messages
473
Reaction score
1,110
Location
PA
Vehicle(s)
2014 F-150 Tremor, 1999 Mercury Grand Marquis
What other Ford vehicle has an active suspension? Raptor doesnt have one. GT500 doesn't Gt40 not really if at all. So Ford has no proven active suspensions. Again the Bronco is mass market vehicle and designing a decent suspension for on road and off road is tough enough. Going active is even tougher. Yeah you could have both a terrain response dial and suspension response dial but thats a lot of computer power on the suspension side and for off road use it needs to be integrated with the engine management and drive options. For instance you are off road and rock crawling and you need to lock the rear diff what suspension setting do you need? The settings are totally different than for running fast offroad on roads like they run in the Baja 1000. And we havent even talked about weather and simple things like wet grass or sand. Then there is the integration of throttle mapping with the suspension settings and the diffs. Ford doesn't have the R&D budget right now based on their reported earnings and financial outlook.

Dave Apker
The GT does in fact have an active - adjustable multi mode suspension for what its worth. Magneride in a Mustang is also an adaptive suspension, albeit not up to the capabilities at the GT, all proven.
 

rmc523

Wildtrak
Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2020
Messages
1,440
Reaction score
2,438
Location
South Florida
Vehicle(s)
2009 Ford Flex; 2018 Mustang GT
Vehicle Showcase
2
Clubs
 
What other Ford vehicle has an active suspension? Raptor doesnt have one. GT500 doesn't Gt40 not really if at all. So Ford has no proven active suspensions. Again the Bronco is mass market vehicle and designing a decent suspension for on road and off road is tough enough. Going active is even tougher. Yeah you could have both a terrain response dial and suspension response dial but thats a lot of computer power on the suspension side and for off road use it needs to be integrated with the engine management and drive options. For instance you are off road and rock crawling and you need to lock the rear diff what suspension setting do you need? The settings are totally different than for running fast offroad on roads like they run in the Baja 1000. And we havent even talked about weather and simple things like wet grass or sand. Then there is the integration of throttle mapping with the suspension settings and the diffs. Ford doesn't have the R&D budget right now based on their reported earnings and financial outlook.

Dave Apker
Uh, the GT definitely does have active suspension:


Aviator does as well. A few other products have the magneride stuff that reads the terrain to prep the suspension for what it sees.
 

LorenzeTorres

Badlands
Well-Known Member
First Name
Lo
Joined
Feb 11, 2020
Messages
122
Reaction score
326
Location
Oakland, CA
Vehicle(s)
2007 Toyota FJ Cruiser/ 2002 BMW M3/ 2016 BMW M2/ 2016 Triumph Thruxton R
Mr. Apker, I know you’re just trying to test us to make sure we’ve brushed up on our Ford knowledge.

As for the Raptor, I believe in 2019 Fox introduced the “Live Valve” shocks. I’m not quite sure what your definition of “active” is but in the videos I’ve seen the reviewers and engineers on this project mentioned that they “actively adjust” according to road conditions
 

JTL2017

Outer Banks
Active Member
Joined
May 18, 2020
Messages
39
Reaction score
135
Location
Earth
Vehicle(s)
Nissan Murano...sadly
Uh, the GT definitely does have active suspension:


Aviator does as well. A few other products have the magneride stuff that reads the terrain to prep the suspension for what it sees.
I'm willing to bet the active suspension (possibly named GOAT) is only available on higher trimmed models.
 

aman43

Badlands
Well-Known Member
Joined
May 14, 2020
Messages
199
Reaction score
483
Location
pa
Vehicle(s)
honda
Really??? Not for off road. Active suspension is great if you are looking for a mall rated truck but if you even down farm roads or across fields its just a problem waiting to happen. Jeep is in trouble? Dont think so. JLU has a diesel which isnt in the wet dreams of Ford yet. Active suspension for off road use just isnt there yet at a mass market price and the technology isn't reliable. Now if the vehicle is mall rated its easy just tune the suspension so Bradley's triple vanilla latte doesn't spill all over him as he tries to find a close in parking spot at his favroite store.

Dave Apker
Define "off road".

How many people , as a percentage of jeep wrangler owners , take their vehicles to areas where they need solid front and rear axles , a lift , and disconnected sway bars? Talking real hardcore rock crawling.

I would have to say maybe less than 10%.

The reality is the jeep drives like total shit on road and on the highway. And if ford sacrificed a front axle for a better ride. It already has jeep beat in the marketplace. Since jeeps dont sell because they are "serious rock crawling machines" but because they are the ONLY "fun outdoors open air" vehicle you can buy.

If the bronco has active suspension that gives it an even BETTER ride. Then jeep is in serious trouble because this car will offer a superior on road and depending on WHERE and HOW you are offroading , a better offroad experience.

All ford needs to announce is that there are front axle kits from third parties day one and jeep is done. They will eventually have to redesign the wrangler from the ground up including the engine to be able to compete with the bronco.

sales matter. The jeep sucks for the people who buy it , aka mall crawlers.
 

Bronc-O

Outer Banks
Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2020
Messages
3,335
Reaction score
4,070
Location
Phoenix
Vehicle(s)
2019 Edge ST
Mr. Apker, I know you’re just trying to test us to make sure we’ve brushed up on our Ford knowledge.

As for the Raptor, I believe in 2019 Fox introduced the “Live Valve” shocks. I’m not quite sure what your definition of “active” is but in the videos I’ve seen the reviewers and engineers on this project mentioned that they “actively adjust” according to road conditions
Even the 17 Fusion had an early version.
https://media.ford.com/content/ford...-v6-sport-helps-protect-against-potholes.html
 

Paint

Well-Known Member
First Name
Jack
Joined
Nov 5, 2019
Messages
1,779
Reaction score
6,165
Location
Oklahoma
Vehicle(s)
Tundra
Vehicle Showcase
1
GM has been using adaptive magnetic suspension for more than a decade on many vehicles. No idea if it would translate to off road though.
 

Dave2002ti

Well-Known Member
First Name
Dave
Joined
Feb 16, 2020
Messages
64
Reaction score
54
Location
Clifton, VA
Vehicle(s)
2012 Grand Cherokee
Define "off road".

How many people , as a percentage of jeep wrangler owners , take their vehicles to areas where they need solid front and rear axles , a lift , and disconnected sway bars? Talking real hardcore rock crawling.

I would have to say maybe less than 10%.

The reality is the jeep drives like total shit on road and on the highway. And if ford sacrificed a front axle for a better ride. It already has jeep beat in the marketplace. Since jeeps dont sell because they are "serious rock crawling machines" but because they are the ONLY "fun outdoors open air" vehicle you can buy.

If the bronco has active suspension that gives it an even BETTER ride. Then jeep is in serious trouble because this car will offer a superior on road and depending on WHERE and HOW you are offroading , a better offroad experience.

All ford needs to announce is that there are front axle kits from third parties day one and jeep is done. They will eventually have to redesign the wrangler from the ground up including the engine to be able to compete with the bronco.

sales matter. The jeep sucks for the people who buy it , aka mall crawlers.
Son ever owned one? Jepp gives folks options on the Wrangler and even the Grand Cherokee. Options are good. How may folks buy Civic Type Rs with manual trannies to chase apexes? Hell I used to have a 156hp Oettinger 16v head on my 78 Rabbit with a 5spd and 4 wheel discs back into 1980 for chasing apexes. Or M2CSs? I have hundreds of hours of track time. Active suspension means the shocks, springs, and anti roll bars are all computer controlled and adjust to the road and how the vehicle is being driven in milli seconds. They also dont get confused by suddden changes in the amount of traction. Yeah I dont rock crawl or autox but prefer tun run fast down barely improved roads or across fields. I hate ABS with a passion and miss having an off switch for like on my E30 325i track day car. There are times when ABS is not your friend and spinning a vehicle with ABS is no fun and ABS in deep snow ie more than 6 inches is no fun.

Really redesign the Wrangler to compete with the Bronco when Ford has no history of building a similar vehicle. Does Ford have a diesel engine to power the Bronco? Jeep turbo 4 is better engine than turbo 4 that will go into Bronco. Naturally aspirated V6 in the Jeep does the job and is reliable something that cant be said about Ford's turbo V6s. Might want to put down the bong son. That would be like Lada coming out with a M2CS competitor with no prior experience or Fiat coming out with a badge engineered Alfa to compete with M3/M4. That didnt work out well for Alfa. Alfa tried and failed despite great write ups in the buff mags. Ever go off road son??? No I dont mean parking out in a field to get high. How many pick ups with 6 inch lifts and 40inch mud terrains actually go off road??? I bet you havent taken your current ride to its redline. Ford has no history. Prior success is damn good predictor of future success. Last time the Bronco had any real success was at Baja way before your were a twinkle in your daddy's eye. If Carrol Shelby was still around farting and making chile maybe Bronco could kick Wrangler butt but he aint so Ford has no chance. They have a better chance of putting out a vehicle that will be recalled multiple times in its first year and the dealers wont be able to fix the problem.

Dave Apker
 

Paint

Well-Known Member
First Name
Jack
Joined
Nov 5, 2019
Messages
1,779
Reaction score
6,165
Location
Oklahoma
Vehicle(s)
Tundra
Vehicle Showcase
1
Son ever owned one? Jepp gives folks options on the Wrangler and even the Grand Cherokee. Options are good. How may folks buy Civic Type Rs with manual trannies to chase apexes? Hell I used to have a 156hp Oettinger 16v head on my 78 Rabbit with a 5spd and 4 wheel discs back into 1980 for chasing apexes. Or M2CSs? I have hundreds of hours of track time. Active suspension means the shocks, springs, and anti roll bars are all computer controlled and adjust to the road and how the vehicle is being driven in milli seconds. They also dont get confused by suddden changes in the amount of traction. Yeah I dont rock crawl or autox but prefer tun run fast down barely improved roads or across fields. I hate ABS with a passion and miss having an off switch for like on my E30 325i track day car. There are times when ABS is not your friend and spinning a vehicle with ABS is no fun and ABS in deep snow ie more than 6 inches is no fun.

Really redesign the Wrangler to compete with the Bronco when Ford has no history of building a similar vehicle. Does Ford have a diesel engine to power the Bronco? Jeep turbo 4 is better engine than turbo 4 that will go into Bronco. Naturally aspirated V6 in the Jeep does the job and is reliable something that cant be said about Ford's turbo V6s. Might want to put down the bong son. That would be like Lada coming out with a M2CS competitor with no prior experience or Fiat coming out with a badge engineered Alfa to compete with M3/M4. That didnt work out well for Alfa. Alfa tried and failed despite great write ups in the buff mags. Ever go off road son??? No I dont mean parking out in a field to get high. How many pick ups with 6 inch lifts and 40inch mud terrains actually go off road??? I bet you havent taken your current ride to its redline. Ford has no history. Prior success is damn good predictor of future success. Last time the Bronco had any real success was at Baja way before your were a twinkle in your daddy's eye. If Carrol Shelby was still around farting and making chile maybe Bronco could kick Wrangler butt but he aint so Ford has no chance. They have a better chance of putting out a vehicle that will be recalled multiple times in its first year and the dealers wont be able to fix the problem.

Dave Apker
Damn. Boomer is big mad.
 

tacowolf

Wildtrak
Well-Known Member
Joined
May 19, 2020
Messages
71
Reaction score
259
Location
Connecticut
Vehicle(s)
2017 Hennessey Velociraptor 2018 Jeep Wrangler JLU
Damn. Boomer is big mad.
Jeep (Alfa Romeo/Fiat) 2.0l 4cyl is in no way better than the 2.3l ford makes. The pentastar is the only Jeep engine that’s remotely good but it’s underpowered and the 2.7 should beat it in that regard
 

MaverickMan

Black Diamond
Well-Known Member
First Name
Shane
Joined
Mar 13, 2020
Messages
1,843
Reaction score
3,317
Location
96708
Vehicle(s)
96 bronco sport 91 comanche eliminator 93 v8 zj
Yeah that jeep turbo motor is kinda lame. Fords 2.3 is way beefier and has been proved so. I will give ya that their v6 is alright but really its just a minivan motor. No jeepers liked it as much as the old 4.0 if the 4.0 had been updated with the times it would be their benchmark. Im a jeep guy %85 as much as im a Ford guy for sure. I think most people buy wranglers because they like the idea that if the want to go have fun in it. They wont have to tow it.

As far as history, well the raptor has been widely used offroad in the types of terrain you seem to like. Before that big fords were kings of mud pits in the south. Before that again I-beam fords were flying and jumping around deserts. Broncos were taking families down roads and over obstacles their full size trucks all got hung up on. Rangers have always been great tight trail rig. Damn near keeping up with CJs and yjs. Monster trucks were born out of Ford. And before that the EBs and the highboys ruled the farm roads and trails and deserts. The only history Jeep has over Ford is military, but ford built plenty of those "jeeps" to fill the militaries orders.

Also everytime i drive without my wife in our 96 bronco I run it up to redline and before I get to any real road I hop through the dips and jumps of our washout road that we use to get to the "highway". Its hard to convince her that the quad shock front works better with a little speed than it does slowy lumbering through the ruts and roughs. But it does and Ford had the experience back then to design it. When the TTB and I-beam came about they were a revolutionary leap in design and capability.

If Ford has done their homework and come up with something applies the right mix of ideas to the way the old wooden carriage wheel rolls then we should happily await the chance to beat on it.
 

Advertisement





 


Advertisement
Top