Re-gear of rear differential for base + 33" tire upgrade

[Rocketeer Rick]

This may just be a terminology thing but there's no way the ring gear is welded to the differential. It may be welded to the CARRIER which keeps the ring gear and spider gears lined up inside the diff. But that entire assembly could be removed and replaced. Hell, looks like ARB already has an air locker (replaces the carrier) for the m210 and m220. May just need to wait for them to develop an install kit for the Bronco.

Edit: Doesn't look like there's an air locker for the m190 ... yet ....

Yeah, see, that's the issue here. There are a lot of terms thrown around in this business. "Carrier" is used for the entire pumpkin assembly, the differential assembly and also for the differential casing depending on who you talk to.

Even within Ford, the terms are mixed around. "Differential", however, usually refers to the assembly of carrier (casing), the internal gearing, washers, pin, etc. So it is the part that goes into the carrier (axle assembly), to which the ring gear attaches, and the axle shafts plug into. This part is called the differential because it is the component of the carrier (axle assy.) that actually allows differentiation to occur.

So, it gets confusing. I say all this as someone that actually designs, tests and sells limited slip differential assemblies to Ford. I've had to learn to listen closely to how the person I'm talking to uses the terms and respond in kind. Because, yeah, it can be confusing...

So in this case, the ring gears are welded to the open differentials instead of the traditional bolted connection. But the lockers keep their bolts. So, regearing an open diff axle is a good excuse to install an LSD or a locker, should they become available aftermarket. Because you'll have to replace the open assembly regardless.

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[mC.242]

Yeah, see, that's the issue here. There are a lot of terms thrown around in this business. "Carrier" is used for the entire pumpkin assembly, the differential assembly and also for the differential casing depending on who you talk to.

Even within Ford, the terms are mixed around. "Differential", however, usually refers to the assembly of carrier (casing), the internal gearing, washers, pin, etc. So it is the part that goes into the carrier (axle assembly), to which the ring gear attaches, and the axle shafts plug into. This part is called the differential because it is the component of the carrier (axle assy.) that actually allows differentiation to occur.

So, it gets confusing. I say all this as someone that actually designs, tests and sells limited slip differential assemblies to Ford. I've had to learn to listen closely to how the person I'm talking to uses the terms and respond in kind. Because, yeah, it can be confusing...

So in this case, the ring gears are welded to the open differentials instead of the traditional bolted connection. But the lockers keep their bolts. So, regearing an open diff axle is a good excuse to install an LSD or a locker, should they become available aftermarket. Because you'll have to replace the open assembly regardless.

Is the 4.46 used in the MT models also open? Why not make a LSD standard?

 

[Apples]

Is the 4.46 used in the MT models also open? Why not make a LSD standard?

They're relying on the traction control system rather than a mechanical LSD.

 

[Rocketeer Rick]

Is the 4.46 used in the MT models also open? Why not make a LSD standard?

Anything not locking is open. Ford seems to have given up on LSDs in trucks, going back to the introduction of P552. My '13 F150 offered both LSD (which I have) or locker as options, but when the generation changed over, the LSD option disappeared. Ranger was introduced with the same choices, and Bronco follows suit. Ford only uses an LSD in Mustang anymore.

That's kind of too bad, because while the locker is pretty marketable (off road cred), the LSD is a better choice for 90% of buyers. The locker is essentially an open diff most of the time, certainly during daily driving. Traction control definitely helps, but its still reactive. It would work even better over an LSD...

 

[Razorback]

The new Advantek D30 and D44 should of been given new designations.
Comparing them to the older axles is like directly comparing a G6 Bronco to a EB, because they share a name too.

That said, the M190's center differential is actually rated by Dana as being stronger than the new Jeep D44.
The M210 is significantly stronger.
The pinion teeth of the M190 and M210 engage the ring gear closer to the center of the gear.
The D44 and D30 have the pinion closer to the top, for driveshaft clearance.
This puts more deflection stress on the D30/44 pinion.

Also, the ring gears use an new convex curved tooth shape, that increases the % of ring gear and pinion tooth contact, while reducing friction.

As @Apples has said, the CV joints are going to be the weak link in the front axle.

The good news is that the Ford engineers made the Sasquatch CV size the default half shaft for all Broncos.
Also, there is only one half shaft.
It is interchangeable L/R, Base to Wildtrack.

Finally, Ford has stated that the Bronco is easily lifted. Just like the Wrangler.
Ford Dealers have watched Jeep Dealers get fat and happy putting MOPAR warrenty approved 2" lifts and 37" tires on Wranglers.
Either straight off the showroom floor, or as a used sale still under warranty.

Ford has directly stated that Bronco dealers will be able to get in on this action.
Big money is at stake.

All of this means that the Bronco hard parts will handle 37" tires.
Just add lift and rubber.

M190 Broncos will be like D30 Wranglers. 35" if you are lightfooted on the trail. 37" if it's a mall crawler.

M210 +37" will be gtg for the lightfooted.
We don't know yet if the 40" tires will be usable as a mall crawler without heavy modifications to things like the ball joints and steering.
Probably not. The 40" donuts are very heavy.

So if you know someday you would go 37's and slight more lift, is it still beneficial to go Sasquatch? Is axle different than BadLands?

 

[Incognito]

So if you know someday you would go 37's and slight more lift, is it still beneficial to go Sasquatch? Is axle different than BadLands?

35" tired Sasquatch and 33" Badlands use the same hard parts.
The BL has a sway bar disconnect.

The only real differences are the springs ( taller ride height on the SQ) and the SQ has 10mm bigger bump stops to limit up travel.

Since you will need to replace the springs and bump stops to fit 37" tires anyway, no real difference between the two outside trim level packages.

Many 37" tire (2.5"-3.5" lift) Jeep kits use shock extensions to make up the increased height.
Others use new shocks.

Considering how expensive the SQ/BL shocks are, I'd say that most people will opt for shock extensions over new.

 

[Rocketeer Rick]

Agreed. I'd say that the Badlands manual trans axles and 'Squatch axles are exactly the same. Both are using the locking diffs and 4.7:1 gears. There really isn't going to be anything else within the axle assembly that they would likely make different. For what you're talking about, the extra $2500 for Sasquatch (over m/t BL) only buys you the wider flares and "high clearance" suspension. If you're putting on other wheels and tires and a possible lift, then I don't see any reason to order the package.