Traction control vs lockers

[johndeerefarmer]

How effective is traction control vs the front and rear lockers? Worthless? Better than nothing?

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[NoTestDrive]

I think traction control is for a slick road (sand/mud/but really snow and ice) while the lockers are for off roading at slow speeds. So it's on-road vs. off-road.

 

[L8apex]

Two entirely different things to be used at entirely different times.

Traction control runs in the background (unless switched off) and is meant to determine unexpected wheel slip. Say a rainy day on the road and you floor it. TCS may do any of the following:
1) Brake the slipping wheel to send power to the non-slipping wheel (pseudo-LSD)
2) Limit the power sent to the slipping wheel (pseudo-Torsen)
3) Cuts all engine power

Lockers do one thing. Make sure the wheels attached to the differential rotate at the EXACT same speeds. This should only be used in OFF-ROAD conditions when you expect a lot of slip. Mud/sand/maybe snow. As you can imagine going around a turn on pavement with good grip, the outside wheel needs to spin faster than the inside - this cannot happen with lockers engaged, you will break something.

Edit: Added the below video because 1) it's awesome 2) good example of the above.

 

[peta8368]

Disclaimer: I'm far from an expert on this

This is one of the questions I had early on. After some research (which consists mainly of watching YouTube videos),my summary is that a traction control system brakes spinning tires when spinning is detected, therefore sending power to the opposite wheel on the same axle.
This has several disadvantages,
1. reactive
2. brakes being applied by a computer algorithm (can be good or bad)
3. brake heat up
4. modulation causes very abrupt traction

A mechanical locking differential, on the other hand, locks the 2 tires on the same axle together, so they spin at the same rate. This holds true whether either tire have traction or not. So if one tire is lacking traction, the other tire on the same axle may still have traction, and will provide force in the direction of travel, thereby increasing your chance of moving.

On uneven surfaces, this works great, because if 1 tire is lifted, the other tire on the same axle is most likely weighted down and actually have increased traction. On sand/ice, this doesn't help as much

 

[Spooled]

It's unknown still how good the Bronco's traction control system will work off-road, but if it's as good as Toyota's A-TRAC it will help out those with open diffs a lot. A rear locker will get you through most things by itself. Extreme articulation and rock crawling is where the front locker will pay off. I've wheeled my ZR2 pretty hard and only needed the front locker a couple of times after intentionally picking a more difficult line.

 

[robepa]

Good summary by L8apex (nice user name).

I like traction control such as Toyotas ATRAC, I can leave it on and the truck still turns well while traction control can get me tru most situations were the vehicle is cross weighted. @Spooled From my experience at the Off-Rodeo this is one of the few areas that Toyota has an advantage, that is ATRAC works better than the Broncos traction control at controlling wheel spin when a tire is lifted, however the Broncos were pre production so that may change. I have not driven a Wrangler with working traction control...

Lockers I typically only use at points when I need them and then turn them back off so that the truck doesn't understeer and to minimize wear/potential damage to the vehicle. The combination of the placement of the Hero Switches and how fast the lockers work on the Bronco puts Bronco way ahead of Toyota or Wrangler.

 

[Beachin 74]

On my F-150 when traversing the beach/sand, traction control is the first thing you turn "off".
Rear locker being turned on, as needed.

 

[Jdc]

Two entirely different things to be used at entirely different times.

Traction control runs in the background (unless switched off) and is meant to determine unexpected wheel slip. Say a rainy day on the road and you floor it. TCS may do any of the following:
1) Brake the slipping wheel to send power to the non-slipping wheel (pseudo-LSD)
2) Limit the power sent to the slipping wheel (pseudo-Torsen)
3) Cuts all engine power

Lockers do one thing. Make sure the wheels attached to the differential rotate at the EXACT same speeds. This should only be used in OFF-ROAD conditions when you expect a lot of slip. Mud/sand/maybe snow. As you can imagine going around a turn on pavement with good grip, the outside wheel needs to spin faster than the inside - this cannot happen with lockers engaged, you will break something.

Edit: Added the below video because 1) it's awesome 2) good example of the above.

I've seen this video and it's one of the best explanations I've ever seen for a mechanical part

 

[dgorsett]

One issue with the Bronco traction control (per Owners manual): Traction control shuts off when in low range. So if you don't have lockers and get stuck in low range you might try 4H the TC may help you out. Also the manual suggests trying Sand mode if stuck, they say it might extricate you. I'm guessing maybe Sand has some kind of TC enhancement.

 

[chaseshort24]

They are pretty different in how they work, and best practices to use them.

I use lockers when I am approaching an obstacle that I know will cross the vehicle up. (lift tires). As soon as that obstacle is over, the lockers are off and stay off until needed.

Traction control if used correctly, and understanding how it works is very capable. They typically require smooth throttle application, and once you get used to the vehicle, you can modulate it really well.

A bronco on All Terrain tires, and traction control is going to be an extremely capable vehicle, and I assume a large portion of sasquatch owners will rarely ever use the lockers.

 

[chaseshort24]

One issue with the Bronco traction control (per Owners manual): Traction control shuts off when in low range. So if you don't have lockers and get stuck in low range you might try 4H the TC may help you out. Also the manual suggests trying Sand mode if stuck, they say it might extricate you. I'm guessing maybe Sand has some kind of TC enhancement.

I wonder if stability control turns off, but break lock traction control stays on, I assume that is what happens

 

[MadMan4BamaNATL]

Two entirely different things to be used at entirely different times.

Traction control runs in the background (unless switched off) and is meant to determine unexpected wheel slip. Say a rainy day on the road and you floor it. TCS may do any of the following:
1) Brake the slipping wheel to send power to the non-slipping wheel (pseudo-LSD)
2) Limit the power sent to the slipping wheel (pseudo-Torsen)
3) Cuts all engine power

Lockers do one thing. Make sure the wheels attached to the differential rotate at the EXACT same speeds. This should only be used in OFF-ROAD conditions when you expect a lot of slip. Mud/sand/maybe snow. As you can imagine going around a turn on pavement with good grip, the outside wheel needs to spin faster than the inside - this cannot happen with lockers engaged, you will break something.

Edit: Added the below video because 1) it's awesome 2) good example of the above.

Exactly right. What you can break is your axle and a few other bits if using a front locker in a turn.

Your Rear locker engaged is something you can get away with, but wouldn't do it. I've seen guys who lock at the hub, just roll or forget when getting on highway. I've never mistakenly left my rear locker engaged when hitting highway.

if you are otherwise trail running, but need to hit pavement for a short time and not doing switchbacks, you may be ok leaving even the front engaged, but I'm not sure.

Modern LR use traction control off road as a sort of torque vectoring system when one wheel is in the air. I have no idea how they get that to work.

 

[johndeerefarmer]

I think traction control is for a slick road (sand/mud/but really snow and ice) while the lockers are for off roading at slow speeds. So it's on-road vs. off-road.

What's the difference? If a rock is slick then how's that different from a slick muddy road? You still don't have traction

 

[johndeerefarmer]

I have rear lockers on both trucks, my SxS's and tractors so I know how that works.
If the traction control and ABS can simulate lockers to some extent I can get a OBX with 4.27 or 3.73 and get better fuel economy on our 600 mile runs to our summer place in CO. I would like a Badlands but think the 4.7 is gonna hurt fuel economy a lot.
If I get a OBX I would add skid plates, front bumper with winch and run 33" with beadlocks when offroad and 33" AT's driving up there. The difference between 33"'s and 35's is so small I see no reason for those (.85" of added ground clearance).

 

[Razorback]

What's the difference? If a rock is slick then how's that different from a slick muddy road? You still don't have traction

In this case, you still want that tire to keep trying to get a grip. If it transferred torque to only the tire with traction, then you've reduced your climbing capability.

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