Trail Militia is going there: 74Weld vs Werewolf Portals

[SierraBronco]

Yep, you've definitely been the exception.

Has the manufacturer collected all of this data and implemented it into a v2.0 portal design?

They did redesign the brackets. Deleted the shoulder and they now accommodate the dowel pin. @ScLeCo was told they have changed the drain plug so the magnets don’t fall off. (So far my glue has held up) They did change the fill plug as well but based on what Jorge said in that video they can still leak. I didn’t even put the new fill plugs in. They look chincey and the crush washer fix I put on them isn’t leaking in the slightest.

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[5GENIDN]

Yep, you've definitely been the exception.

Has the manufacturer collected all of this data and implemented it into a v2.0 portal design?

I would hope so...

 

[Lcubed]

The reason I say that is it seems like portals are not without their issues, but were marketed as being virtually bullet-proof. From the threads here, there's been a lot of diagnosing, trouble-shooting, disassembly, modifications, shaking down more problems, engineering oversights, inquiries to the manufacturer, etc.

this entire suspension sub-forum has 74 pages of thread titles of all kinds of suspension issues and trouble shooting AKA issues

 

[mpeugeot]

I mentioned having some wheels made to my wife. She muttered something about castration and then a divorce.

You wouldn't have that problem with a stock non-sas open diff 2.3 OBX mid package...

LOL.

Then again, you might get stuck on a curb at the mall.

 

[SierraBronco]

So…is this a point for Werewolf? Not sure how the scoring works.

 

[ScLeCo]

It's -1000 points for 74 weld that's for sure. At this point I have zero confidence in any of their shit.

 

[userdude]

So…is this a point for Werewolf? Not sure how the scoring works.

That's a bummer. I guess Quinn can't say he's never had a billet part fail yet. He was referring to the race portals, which I assume are heavier duty. But still. Wonder if we'll get a post mortem explaining what happened.

My thoughts on why he didn't think he was wheeling hard at the time is that they were probably already cracked.

Here's the comment and photo in case the entry gets lost:

As you know we’ve been featuring a series of video between @74weld and @werewolf4x4 Portals on Broncos and giving you our input. Here’s one of the big reason I was pro Steel vs having an all Billet setup (which I got a lot of slack for) one of our friends broke on a trail at Hammers. These few pics show you where the case broke making the bronco immobile for obvious reasons. This is unfixable and a whole case will have to be replaced. Rig is still stuck on Trail and waiting of @74weld to bring a new piece. ( they have been communicating ) we also got word of another case that has a crack in that same exact spot. So as promised we will continue to keep you updated. Driver said he was not going hard and didn’t realize it broke till people started yelling to stop.

Now nothing is unbreakable but this happens somewhere other than literally the busiest event in the world it might do for a very big headache. 20k and this happens to them what would you think?

More to come…. ( He’s on 39 inch tires )

 

[userdude]

@SierraBronco He mentions the case, but I can't make heads or tails of those photos. Is this the gear box and NOT the riser? Isn't the gear box shared among all the other makes/models (Jeep, Tacoma, Ranger Raptor, etc)? I guess he doesn't specify what make/model of the other one that's cracked, but it seems like we should also see some Jeeps, unless it's a max vehicle weight problem. Not even IFS generally (Tacoma).

I wonder if we will see others fail, too. I can't see how they can replace a whole bunch of cases. If this is a design/engineering defect, that could be a real mess.

 

[SierraBronco]

That's a bummer. I guess Quinn can't say he's never had a billet part fail yet. He was referring to the race portals, which I assume are heavier duty. But still. Wonder if we'll get a post mortem explaining what happened.

My thoughts on why he didn't think he was wheeling hard at the time is that they were probably already cracked.

Here's the comment and photo in case the entry gets lost:

Sounds like there are two other guys that had the same failure. Goddammit. Bronco is at the shop but it looks like I’ll be pulling the portals off. Again. And taking them to a machine shop to see how we can reinforce the area.

 

[5GENIDN]

@SierraBronco He mentions the case, but I can't make heads or tails of those photos. Is this the gear box and NOT the riser? Isn't the gear box shared among all the other makes/models (Jeep, Tacoma, Ranger Raptor, etc)? I guess he doesn't specify what make/model of the other one that's cracked, but it seems like we should also see some Jeeps, unless it's a max vehicle weight problem. Not even IFS generally (Tacoma).

I wonder if we will see others fail, too. I can't see how they can replace a whole bunch of cases. If this is a design/engineering defect, that could be a real mess.

"gear box" and "riser/knuckle" are one piece. the part that broke is the lower control arm ball mount (where the ball joint mounts to the portal box). I think there are two possible scenarios for the failure. Potentially more but two that I can think of at this moment... 1) design failure - this "flange" on the back of the portal box is receiving more stress than it was designed for therefore design was inadequate. 2) Material failure - the Alco Select plate these were milled from are not meeting the advertised strength. If all the failures were manufactured in a close time ratio I would assume it is a material issue. If the failing/cracking portals were manufactured at significantly different times then I think that suggests a design failure.

 

[userdude]

"gear box" and "riser/knuckle" are one piece. the part that broke is the lower control arm ball mount (where the ball joint mounts to the portal box). I think there are two possible scenarios for the failure. Potentially more but two that I can think of at this moment... 1) design failure - this "flange" on the back of the portal box is receiving more stress than it was designed for therefore design was inadequate. 2) Material failure - the Alco Select plate these were milled from are not meeting the advertised strength. If all the failures were manufactured in a close time ratio I would assume it is a material issue. If the failing/cracking portals were manufactured at significantly different times then I think that suggests a design failure.

Oh ok, I thought the riser was separate from the knuckle (gear box). I thought Quinn being able to roll out new model support was based on this, but I guess they could start from a base model design in the software, too. We'll have to wait and see, hopefully we get more info and it can be worked out if it was material failure and/or design fault. Let's hope it's not widespread.

 

[ScLeCo]

"gear box" and "riser/knuckle" are one piece. the part that broke is the lower control arm ball mount (where the ball joint mounts to the portal box). I think there are two possible scenarios for the failure. Potentially more but two that I can think of at this moment... 1) design failure - this "flange" on the back of the portal box is receiving more stress than it was designed for therefore design was inadequate. 2) Material failure - the Alco Select plate these were milled from are not meeting the advertised strength. If all the failures were manufactured in a close time ratio I would assume it is a material issue. If the failing/cracking portals were manufactured at significantly different times then I think that suggests a design failure.

Sigh...Time to get out the SKL-SP2

 

[SierraBronco]

Something just seems peculiar with these failures. The owner said this was really the first official wheeling he’s done with the portals, and he was maybe 200 yards or something into the trail. No bouncing, no jumping, nothing crazy. And the shakedown run before it was hardly anything. I’m talking to the guy that was part of the same failure on the Toyota and asked if they made certain the big washer was properly aligned into the recess for the ball joint. (Bronco owner said it was) He said that it was aligned, but the washer didn’t fit into the recess. As a result, the washer was concave when the nut was torqued down. That is a red flag to me and I question if they used the correct washer or if maybe the wrong washers were sent out as ours fit in to the recess nicely. I have a theory that possibly these failures aren’t due to anything that 74w did incorrectly with building the portals, but maybe the balljoints weren’t properly aligned during installation, causing excessive tension and stress on that section. Assuming it’s not a material issue these failures don’t make sense with the abuse ours have gone through compared to two of the other failures. (Haven’t talked to the third guy yet)

 

[Razorback]

I went over a Costco speed bump today with no issue... Those SOBs are aggressive.

 

[5GENIDN]

Something just seems peculiar with these failures. The owner said this was really the first official wheeling he’s done with the portals, and he was maybe 200 yards or something into the trail. No bouncing, no jumping, nothing crazy. And the shakedown run before it was hardly anything. I’m talking to the guy that was part of the same failure on the Toyota and asked if they made certain the big washer was properly aligned into the recess for the ball joint. (Bronco owner said it was) He said that it was aligned, but the washer didn’t fit into the recess. As a result, the washer was concave when the nut was torqued down. That is a red flag to me and I question if they used the correct washer or if maybe the wrong washers were sent out as ours fit in to the recess nicely. I have a theory that possibly these failures aren’t due to anything that 74w did incorrectly with building the portals, but maybe the balljoints weren’t properly aligned during installation, causing excessive tension and stress on that section. Assuming it’s not a material issue these failures don’t make sense with the abuse ours have gone through compared to two of the other failures. (Haven’t talked to the third guy yet)

Washer? are you talking the whole brass sleeve? That is an entire sleeve that slides down in there. If it did not fit and it "bulged" the "washer" Then the ball joint post should not have fit. Maybe I am not understanding.I guess there was a washer at the bottom though.... But the top that drops in is an entire sleeve with a "washer" like flange at the top....

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