[Video Added] 2023 Ranger Raptor Spied Testing With Bronco Warthog!

[NCOBX]

By that logic, you could tune the 3.0 (not sure where this number comes from as no one has the information outside of Ford) to make even more power. That is why you have to compare factory to factory or tuned to tuned.

I know you don't like turbos, but I'm wondering if you are still planning to buy a Bronco and doing an V8 swap.

How much more power are you going to get though? Aren’t the 2.7L and 3.0L the same block - basically you end up doing a bore and stroke and both blocks are going to max out at the same displacement making it a moot point in the end. Again why would someone pay $5-10-15K more for essentially the same engine with a different tune?

Why do I want to pay $60K to have an engine that is near no different than the engine in the tuned $38k Bronco that just dusted my ass with its Honda Civic exhaust note? There will always be someone more powerful but I don’t want to pay more and still be on the bottom of the totem pole.

Right now I’m heavily leaning towards a 7.3L Tremor with 4.30 gearing, and playing the waiting game on the Bronco to see what Ford does.
The Tremor package with that engine is incredible.

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[JPNC]

Ford is only putting a V8 in the Gen3 raptor only to complete with the TRX.

BTW .. I owned a Gen1 and Gen2 Raptor and the GEN2 is way better. Are you speaking from experience or you just like to argue about your opinions?

what exactly is your argument based on? do you accept my bet? Let's put some money behind your theories.

Great color combo by the way!

 

[jaspercasidino]

right or you can just put a v8 engine in the car and have it out of reach from a tune.

Your comment in no way addresses the apples to oranges comparison of comparing factory to tuned performance which is what I was addressing.

 

[NCOBX]

Something about apples and oranges. Don't help me, I'll get there.



You're not.



That's not what "supplanting" means.

Also see: Ford GT.



This just in! Modified vehicle beats stock vehicle! More at 11!

Why does the Raptor exist? You could just throw some control arms and coilovers and a tune at an F-150. Ford is stupid for making a Raptor.

Why does the Hellcat exist? You can just throw a supercharger on a regular Charger. Dodge is stupid for making the Hellcat.

Why does McLaren exist? I could just build an autoclave in my garage and lay up a carbon fiber monocoque and use my Bridgeport to rough out a nice little 4.0 V8 to put in it and blah blah blah.

Automakers are making cars for people that buy new cars. Whether or not the end user could get more performance per dollar by modifying something else DOESN'T factor into that equation.

Something about apples and oranges. Don't help me, I'll get there.



You're not.



That's not what "supplanting" means.

Also see: Ford GT.



This just in! Modified vehicle beats stock vehicle! More at 11!

Why does the Raptor exist? You could just throw some control arms and coilovers and a tune at an F-150. Ford is stupid for making a Raptor.

Why does the Hellcat exist? You can just throw a supercharger on a regular Charger. Dodge is stupid for making the Hellcat.

Why does McLaren exist? I could just build an autoclave in my garage and lay up a carbon fiber monocoque and use my Bridgeport to rough out a nice little 4.0 V8 to put in it and blah blah blah.

Automakers are making cars for people that buy new cars. Whether or not the end user could get more performance per dollar by modifying something else DOESN'T factor into that equation.

There’s a big difference when there is a disparity in costs for what is essentially the same engine block - it’s not easy to justify an increased price for nearly identical hardware plus some tuning.

Those that are wise with their money will recognize this. The others probably think their 2.0L Audi is hot hsit and better than the 2.0L BMW next to it and the 2.0L Mercedes in front of it, and the 2.0L Malibu behind it.

 

[jaspercasidino]

How much more power are you going to get though? Aren’t the 2.7L and 3.0L the same block - basically you end up doing a bore and stroke and both blocks are going to max out at the same displacement making it a moot point in the end. Again why would someone pay $5-10-15K more for essentially the same engine with a different tune?

Why do I want to pay $60K to have an engine that is near no different than the engine in the tuned $38k Bronco that just dusted my ass with its Honda Civic exhaust note? There will always be someone more powerful but I don’t want to pay more and still be on the bottom of the totem pole.

Right now I’m heavily leaning towards a 7.3L Tremor with 4.30 gearing, and playing the waiting game on the Bronco to see what Ford does.
The Tremor package with that engine is incredible.

It is clearly not just a different engine that you get. Go take a look at that pictures on the Ranger forum in OP's post and it is clear as day something different is going on beyond a Wildtrak. I get that V8 sounds better, but twin turbo engines don't have to sound like shit. My M3 with its stock exhaust sounds amazing. Maybe only BMW has figured it out.

edit: Explorer ST has the 3.0L and it puts out 400hp and 415lb-ft. Not much torque difference but a lot of hp.

 

[jaspercasidino]

There is a 3.0L based on the same architecture as the 2.7L. Makes 400hp in base form. Almost 500hp in its hybrid version. It makes more sense from every perspective than trying to fit the 3.5L or Coyote V8. That's why it's widely rumored to be the Warthog motor. Not to mention the 2.7L/3.0L are built for boost from the ground up (they're almost designed like diesel blocks) unlike the 3.5L. They're Ford's newest design EcoBoost and bad little mfers.

Yeah, I know that the 3.0L and 3.5L engines exist. I'm not sure why people are saying the Warthog has a 3.0L and passing it on as fact and making that the basis for their arguments. When the engine specs are revealed, then we can be confident in what we are talking about.

Also, apparently gaining around 100hp from that little displacement increase isn't enough... 700hp or bust I guess...

 

[lobbs611]

There’s a big difference when there is a disparity in costs for what is essentially the same engine block - it’s not easy to justify an increased price for nearly identical hardware plus some tuning.

Lol wut? It's pretty much the same block used in a 300hp truck motor as is used in a 750hp sports car. Doesn't matter if you're talking about Ford, GM or Chrysler there. Oftentimes, they're similar or identical displacement. Power's made by moving as much air as possible, squeezing the hell out of it with some fuel and lighting a match. You can do it with a big naturally aspirated motor if the guts are designed to live. You can do it with a smaller motor and a ton of boost if the guts are designed to live. You're going to pay more for more power at any displacement because it costs more money to get those moving bits to survive.

 

[NCOBX]

It is clearly not just a different engine that you get. Go take a look at that pictures on the Ranger forum in OP's post and it is clear as day something different is going on beyond a Wildtrak. I get that V8 sounds better, but twin turbo engines don't have to sound like shit. My M3 with its stock exhaust sounds amazing. Maybe only BMW has figured it out.

edit: Explorer ST has the 3.0L and it puts out 400hp and 415lb-ft. Not much torque difference but a lot of hp.

Yes I get there are more upgrades than just the engine. I will contend that the Sas package with 37s will likely do everything the Warthog will without being an extra foot wider and $20k more expensive.

Regardless there’s a lot of marketing to make the Warthog an emotion-based purchase, my emotions aren’t exactly being worked up with a tiny displacement 6 cylinder that - again, has little difference from the 2.7L powering the high $30k trucks.

Also why pay more to still be Stuck in a V6? As I’ve hit on numerous times there’s a huge issue with charging customers $60k to stick them with a V6. That shtick might fly in the non-enthusiast Wall Street crowd but for the rest of America it’s damn near blasphemy.

 

[NCOBX]

Lol wut? It's pretty much the same block used in a 300hp truck motor as is used in a 750hp sports car. Doesn't matter if you're talking about Ford, GM or Chrysler there. Oftentimes, they're similar or identical displacement. Power's made by moving as much air as possible, squeezing the hell out of it with some fuel and lighting a match. You can do it with a big naturally aspirated motor if the guts are designed to live. You can do it with a smaller motor and a ton of boost if the guts are designed to live. You're going to pay more for more power at any displacement because it costs more money to get those moving bits to survive.

The 2.7 and related 3.0 do not share blocks with the 3.5L. It costs more to make a smaller displacement engine do what a larger displacement can do, the long term costs are higher to go small, and the benefits are no where to be found.

Im all for shared components if either A) I’m buying a beater that I want cheap part availability with, or B) I’m buying a badass prestigious engine that I’m proud to own and modify.

This falls into neither category, it’s not going to be cheaper than a N/A engine long term and it’s not desirable.

 

[jaspercasidino]

Yes I get there are more upgrades than just the engine. I will contend that the Sas package with 37s will likely do everything the Warthog will without being an extra foot wider and $20k more expensive.

Regardless there’s a lot of marketing to make the Warthog an emotion-based purchase, my emotions aren’t exactly being worked up with a tiny displacement 6 cylinder that - again, has little difference from the 2.7L powering the high $30k trucks.

Also why pay more to still be Stuck in a V6? As I’ve hit on numerous times there’s a huge issue with charging customers $60k to stick them with a V6. That shtick might fly in the non-enthusiast Wall Street crowd but for the rest of America it’s damn near blasphemy.

Yeah dude, we get it. It doesn’t have a V8. Only “terrible engine choices” as you see it and increasing the displacement and horsepower isn’t going to change your mind (even though we don’t know what those numbers actually are). You compare to the base BaseSquatch 2DR price point for a 4DR (no indication at this point of a 2DR) and mention (minor) aftermarket changes. Forget any suspension changes. Yeah, totally equally capable...

I must run in different circles, because a V8 is just another engine choice. It’s nowhere near blasphemy.

 

[The Pope]

Ok.... Some of you are Only thinking that the differences between the Bronco and Warthog is Just An Engine, Larger Tires and a Few Suspension Components.... I'll argue that it's Much More and that a Bronco would never be able to be Up-Fitted with all of the Warthog components.

Lets use the F150 vs. Raptor for comparison... (and I'm Not an expert on the differences and will ask those who are to please correct something that I mention and provide things that I didn't mention).....

-Engines are different
-Front A Arms are Longer
- Shocks & Struts

-----but here's where the main difference is and why you can't Up-Fit an F150 into a Raptor.....

-The Frame Is Different (meaning those Longer A Arms will not just Bolt Up and some of the other suspension will not Just Bolt Up as well....

So.... Just Arguing that it's Only 0.3L Larger Engine (when We Don't Even Know What Engine Is Even Going To Be In It.....), well... is just Small Minded, as you need to factor in ALL of the Different Components to determine if the Gestimated Price in the $70k range is out of bounds or not.

Ok.... done....stepping off of the soapbox...

 

[wvmtneer]

The 3.0 hybrid in the warthog(Sting) is going to destroy the 2.7(kid) hp an tq numbers, but be one heavy bitch.

 

[kodiakisland]

Jeez, how much difference was there between the 289 and 302? My buddy had the 289 so he thought it was better but I had the 302 and knew it was better. But, we were both running 351 heads, so who knows.

Then my worst Chevys had a 305 but the best were the 327s and then the run of the mill 350s. Not really that much difference in those either.

It wasn't the CI, but the application. What does it matter if Ford only goes up by 0.3L? It's what they do with the overall package that matters.

 

[Laminar]

There’s a big difference when there is a disparity in costs for what is essentially the same engine block - it’s not easy to justify an increased price for nearly identical hardware plus some tuning.

I guess maybe you don't understand how pricing works? Prices are set based on value offered, not cost of production. It doesn't matter if it costs Ford $0 extra to offer the 3.0, if that offering gives more value to the end users, they will charge for that difference in value.

Apparently a lot of people think things like cars and phones are priced like a simple commodity where it's just cost of raw materials + overhead + tiny profit margin. New cars aren't priced that way, cost of raw materials doesn't matter.

 

[Administrator]

First look at the LHD Ranger Raptor!

Video & pics @ Ranger6G.com https://www.ranger6g.com/forum/thre...tor-prototype-first-sighting-pics-video.6900/

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