10R60 (not 10R80) 10-speed automatic transmission for 2021 Bronco [update: confirmed in Ford parts system]

[Mattwings]

I've driven the Terminator, current Mustang GT, Mustang GT350, and current Mustang Mach 1. I didn't have an issue driving the Terminator. It's not difficult to drive. The Viper actively tries to kill you though.
[/QUOTE]
Vipers do actively try and kill you. When I worked in insurance claims Vipers were inordinately represented in body shops. Many that weren't in for repair showed prior damage from crashes. Maybe only the early 911 Turbos were crashed more per vehicle sold Sorry to take away from the transmission hysteria.

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[vrtical]

yeah true test of driving skills drive a Viper lol.

 

[jdub.csu]

Thanks. So it looks like the 60. All the videos from Moab looked like it shifted well. My neighbor has a new Explorer and the thing shifts like *hit. They hate it so much they are going to trade it in. Hopefully they have done something different with the transmission?

Tell them to get the updates done to the vehicle. It probably has programming updates

 

[wjfawb0 [hacked account]]

Isn't the current Mustang GT faster than the Terminator? That being said, you can throw way more power (reliably) on the Terminator block and Tremec than you can on the 5.0L and MT82.

I've driven the Terminator, current Mustang GT, Mustang GT350, and current Mustang Mach 1. I didn't have an issue driving the Terminator. It's not difficult to drive. The Viper actively tries to kill you though.

There were several folks on the mustang boards who had the roush supercharger kits on their 2015+ GTs who couldn't stand the softening of the car (torque management). It could be tuned away to some extent, but it's also probably why some MT82s last as long as they do. I daily drove a 2003 Cobra for three years and then a 2015 GT mustang for 3.5 years. the old cable clutch and throttle made it a very different animal, and I could see how some would miss that. The traction control didn't work for crap, though. All it could do is pull fuel and spark which made for some "oh shit" moments when it would cause the car to almost stall when making a left turn trying to avoid traffic.

For me, I daily drive either a wrangler or an STI today. Most people complain about the bouncy or harsh ride when they're passengers, but I prefer it. I guess it depends on what you want out of a grocery getter.

 

[Laminar]

Please explain what you know and provide sources. What does "it" mean? What is the true rating of the 10R60 transmission?

Here's the trick - The transmission's rating as a single torque input figure as it's being thrown around here literally cannot exist.

The exact same engine and the exact same transmission put in a 2500lb vehicle on 225 all seasons will live a very different life than one in a 5000lb vehicle on 35" M/T tires.

Take a transmission "rated" for 500ft-lb coupled to an engine making 400ft-lb. Now have it motivate three tons of steel and 400 pounds of wheels and tires, which leads to excessive heat and premature wear and eventual failure. But put the same engine and trans in a small, lightweight vehicle with 150lbs of rotating wheel/tire mass and the thing will live forever. It doesn't matter that there's some kind of theoretical 100 ft-lb overhead in both cases, that's not how any of this works. A single numerical "torque rating" can't exist.

It's just something that got passed down from car guy to car guy by urban legend and word of mouth and now people accept it as gospel and are predicting the apocalypse based on a bunch of false prophecies.

And even then we'll never know the "true" rating. Ford would never ever publicly release info letting its customers and competitors know their proprietary safety margins. Not to mention that things like drivetrain inertia, tire grip, vehicle weight, and intended use matter just as much (or maybe even more) to transmission longevity than engine torque.

Transmission torque conspiracy theorists: Tremec rates the TR-3160 at 410ft-lb of input torque given the gearset with the 3.25:1 first gear. Coincidentally, this is the gearset it gets in the GT350 Mustang.

https://www.tremec.com/anexos/File/TREMEC_TR-3160.pdf

The GT350 makes 429ft-lb.

OMG FORD MADE A HUGE MISTAKE! HOW DID THEY MISS THIS ONE?? THOSE TRANSMISSIONS MUST BE SHREDDING THEMSELVES LEFT AND RIGHT!!

No, they're actually just fine. Stop putting so much weight into marketing numbers and car guy heresy.

I remember when 2015 mustang GT owners were selling their cars and going back to terminators. They said the new cars just don't feel fast.

Which is ironic, because the 2015-up cars absolutely massacre everything older, like it's not even funny how much faster they are. The SN95 cars feel fast because deep down they're still shitbox rattletrap Fox bodies with the chassis stiffness of a pool noodle.

I wonder how a new driver today -- only experienced with driving a throttle by wire, ESC/traction control equipped vehicle -- would handle an old cable throttle car like a terminator or viper? Probably not very well.

I bet those dumb kids these days can't even adjust their own timing on the fly like REAL MEN DO.

https://www.real-classic.co.uk/2016/12/13/franks-famous-last-words-41/

Automatic timing advance is for sissies that don't want to feel connected with true driving.

 

[atonge40]

There were several folks on the mustang boards who had the roush supercharger kits on their 2015+ GTs who couldn't stand the softening of the car (torque management). It could be tuned away to some extent, but it's also probably why some MT82s last as long as they do. I daily drove a 2003 Cobra for three years and then a 2015 GT mustang for 3.5 years. the old cable clutch and throttle made it a very different animal, and I could see how some would miss that. The traction control didn't work for crap, though. All it could do is pull fuel and spark which made for some "oh shit" moments when it would cause the car to almost stall when making a left turn trying to avoid traffic.

For me, I daily drive either a wrangler or an STI today. Most people complain about the bouncy or harsh ride when they're passengers, but I prefer it. I guess it depends on what you want out of a grocery getter.

I'm so smitten with the GT350 that I'd rather throw cash at one of those and drive it for 10 years then try to build a GT up. I should have bought one last year. Prices have gone crazy. Terminator prices are nuts too. Heck, I'm seeing 4th Gen Mach 1s with low miles go for over $30k. Which is completely insane. There was a point last year where used GT350s were selling for under $40K. Now the floor is $45k.

 

[Panaran]

What are the chances Ford put the 60 in the pre-production vehicles and will use the 80 for the retail?

 

[timhood]

I'm so smitten with the GT350 that I'd rather throw cash at one of those and drive it for 10 years then try to build a GT up. I should have bought one last year. Prices have gone crazy. Terminator prices are nuts too. Heck, I'm seeing 4th Gen Mach 1s with low miles go for over $30k. Which is completely insane. There was a point last year where used GT350s were selling for under $40K. Now the floor is $45k.

Do not remind me. I passed on a GT350 because it had a couple of options different than what I wanted. I could have lived with it. Strong the regret is in this one.

 

[AcesandEights]

What are the chances Ford put the 60 in the pre-production vehicles and will use the 80 for the retail?

a number less than zero

 

[Panaran]

a number less than zero

 

[Jdc]

I remember when 2015 mustang GT owners were selling their cars and going back to terminators. They said the new cars just don't feel fast. All new throttle by wire cars are torque managed to prevent warranty issues. Manual transmissions make it a little more difficult, but they can add valves to the hydraulic clutches that slow clutch engagement to limit forces from side stepping clutches.

I wonder how a new driver today -- only experienced with driving a throttle by wire, ESC/traction control equipped vehicle -- would handle an old cable throttle car like a terminator or viper? Probably not very well.

Given how many videos there are of vipers crashing I'd say older drivers aren't doing much better

 

[atonge40]

Do not remind me. I passed on a GT350 because it had a couple of options different than what I wanted. I could have lived with it. Strong the regret is in this one.

I'm big mad about my poor choice. It really would have just cost me the monthly payment. I could have gotten my money back and then some whenever I felt like it. Still so mad at myself.

 

[2.3BigBend]

I have faith that the 2 speed transfer case and lower gear ratios will make these worries a moot point. I opted for the 2.3L so I obviously have room for HP/ Torque gains (not that I'll tune it), although I never felt the need for more power in my Ranger. My stock 2.7 F-150 was a rocket ship. I would definitely not feel the need to tune a 2.7 in this application, but that's just me and I get peoples disappointment with Ford making the ceiling so low in stock 2.7L ratings with this 10R60.

 

[Spooled]

I get peoples disappointment with Ford making the ceiling so low in stock 2.7L ratings with this 10R60.

It's quite strange because even the 2.3 mustang gets the 10R80. We know the Ranger and Bronco will go down the same assembly line so complicating things with adding another transmission seems strange. I doubt Ford will give the Ranger the 10R60 due to tow ratings.

 

[bytheway]

After stewing on this a couple days I think Explorer ST and Platinum owners have more of a gripe than Bronco owners. They’re stuck with this trans behind an even more powerful engine with the 3.0T.

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