When will Bronco become a real threat to Jeep?

[kairo]

Problem with this is how people actually buy vehicles. The average person who's honestly cross shopping will go test drive a Wrangler around the block and then test drive a Bronco around the block and they'll all think the Bronco has better handling, better steering, better ride comfort, is quicker, etc, etc. The Jeeps sales guy can wax on all he wants about solid front axle, but most people aren't going to get into the weeds talking about suspension dynamics. All the Ford guy has to do is ask, "are you going to do any heavy duty rock crawling?" and the Jeep guy's argument is sunk.

Ford doesn't have to convert the hardest of hardcore Jeep fans and rock crawlers to outsell the Wrangler. They have to get more new buyers than Jeep and pick off some Jeep owners when they are ready to trade in or trade up for another.

FYI, When they say IFS is better at speed that doesn't mean ripping through the desert at 80mph. It means faster than practically-not-moving. Ford would really have to screw up the suspension tuning for the Bronco to not be more comfortable and confident than a Wrangler cruising down a rocky road at 20 mph.

I wouldn't say I'm a hardcore rockcrawler, but I have spent a lot of time around people who are. And honestly anybody who is a hardcore crawler guy is building their own rig anyways.

The wrangler rubi (in my opinion) is not a rockcrawler in any sense of the word of what actual rockcrawling is.

This is real rock crawling (this is in my backyard):

Nobody is doing that in a factory rubi or a bronco. But, apples to apples, the Bronco is going to do all the other stuff just as good if not better than a rubi, even with the IFS. It just makes no difference at the level both of those vehicles are capable of from the factory. Any factory vehicle with 33" or 35" tires is going to have a very tough time getting itself into enough trouble where the difference between IFS and SFA makes a realistic difference. Just my .02 having been around this world for years and years.

And just for fun, here's my '79 F150 at the same place as the video

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[Fosters]

From the offroading videos I've seen of the bronco so far, and that awesome 2-3 inches of flex, the bronco is that flop. Wait for the hype to wear off the bronco, when it'll be judged offroad, and the same thing will happen.

 

[BuckeyeinNV]

Those same people who don't give a damn about the suspension dynamics, would have zero clue about what the suspension looks like or handling differences between two 5000lb suv's. I like how people act as if wranglers go down the street like a pinball machine because omg, solid axle can't handle... but the fact of the matter is, you'll really have to push a vehicle to its handling limits to start noticing a difference... JKs and JLs are much more refined than leaf sprung YJs and CJs...

Like I said, I don't think people cross shop these enthusiast vehicles for their merit - let's be honest there are other vehicles that will be much more comfortable, handle way better, and have better fuel economy for the same money (aka every non enthusiast suv out there). They shop them for the image, which image gets set by those who mod the shit out of them and wheel them...

The FJ handled better and was more comfortable than the wrangler... and all the Toyota sales guy had to do is ask, "are you going to do any heavy duty rock crawling?". And yet the FJ sunk. Why? You can count the number of badass lifted FJs on 37s you've seen in your entire lifetime on the fingers of one hand.

I think you're grossly overestimating how much the average consumer cares about those guys who mod the shit out of their vehicles and do hard wheeling. People buy Wranglers because they're fun and look cool and are convertibles, and the Bronco will do all of that except better. Plenty will still prefer the Wrangler for looks or brand loyalty or other non-logical reasons, but if Jeep is counting on outselling the Bronco because more people are on team Jeep and they can get a 396 for $70,000, I think they're going to be in for a rude awakening.

And you can bet a year from now there will be a million youtube videos of people beating up Broncos in Moab. Ford did not Nerf the Bronco like Land Rover did to the Defender, they made it, at best, ever so slightly worse at rock crawling and better at so much more.

 

[BuckeyeinNV]

lol. Nice screenshot. I like this one better....

 

[EvlNvrDys]

I WHEEL MY SHIT! And I will sure as hell wheel my 2021! If it's junk I will mount 235/75/15 firestones on it and trade it in on a rubicon POST HASTE!

ps...DONT HAVE A NUMBER BUT MORE RUBICONS ROCK CRAWL THAN RAPTORS!

I'm only half way through this thread and about all I've seen is some pent up sexual frustration, I think the Dr. Ruth in me is wanting to suggest you go buy a Rubicon and jerk off in the back seat of it. Just a thought.

We really don't need anymore angry Jeep drivers to come over. Just stay where you were.

And Doug, you may now drop the hammer on me ?

 

[Axe]

I suddenly feel as if I am not a Real Man because I want a Bronco but have no intention of doing Real Offroading like Real Men do.

Will I still be allowed to purchase? It sounds like Jeep has strict criteria whereby only Real Men are allowed to purchase their vehicles. I hope Ford doesnt do the same.

But on the plus side, I should avoid the long term arthritic effects of repeated chest thumping.

 

[Bmadda]

I suddenly feel as if I am not a Real Man because I want a Bronco but have no intention of doing Real Offroading like Real Men do.

Will I still be allowed to purchase? It sounds like Jeep has strict criteria whereby only Real Men are allowed to purchase their vehicles. I hope Ford doesnt do the same.

But on the plus side, I should avoid the long term arthritic effects of repeated chest thumping.

Listen guys...I'm sorry if you guys got me wrong here. I just don't like the IFS and that's my opinion. My opinion is supported by hard facts...not reading the minds of some fictional consumers out there. My original question was who actually WANTED the IFS before it was a final decision. I AM a CURRENT Bronco owner, and a Jeep owner as well. I have waited patiently for this release, and have said I won't even consider buying a rubicon till I see the new Bronco. Throughout all the buildup Fords press releases were very strongly worded that this would be a competitive vehicle. This vehicle would be specifically for a customer like myself. I took those words to mean certain things and I was wrong. What I still want to know is who did want the IFS? Not who will defend the IFS now that it is here? Ford has some allergy to SFA? They seem to sell alot of superdutys...and I think they drive just fine...I have one! I didn't mean to start any kind of d##k measuring contest or the like. OK maybe the IFS will be so much better than Jeep that we will wonder how Jeep was so wrong for so many years...I really don't think that's the case, and I don't think anybody reading this believes that either.

 

[BuckeyeinNV]

Listen guys...I'm sorry if you guys got me wrong here. I just don't like the IFS and that's my opinion. My opinion is supported by hard facts...not reading the minds of some fictional consumers out there. My original question was who actually WANTED the IFS before it was a final decision. I AM a CURRENT Bronco owner, and a Jeep owner as well. I have waited patiently for this release, and have said I won't even consider buying a rubicon till I see the new Bronco. Throughout all the buildup Fords press releases were very strongly worded that this would be a competitive vehicle. This vehicle would be specifically for a customer like myself. I took those words to mean certain things and I was wrong. What I still want to know is who did want the IFS? Not who will defend the IFS now that it is here? Ford has some allergy to SFA? They seem to sell alot of superdutys...and I think they drive just fine...I have one! I didn't mean to start any kind of d##k measuring contest or the like. OK maybe the IFS will be so much better than Jeep that we will wonder how Jeep was so wrong for so many years...I really don't think that's the case, and I don't think anybody reading this believes that either.

I've spent more time in the dirt than probably 95% of people who own Jeeps and would not even be considering the Bronco if it wasn't IFS. And again, IFS is better off road almost all of the time. That's from my experience, not guessing.

We've known for a very long time the Bronco was being built on the Ranger platform, why would you even think SFA was in the cards? Spy shots confirmed it a long time ago as well.

 

[Fosters]

If you design a vehicle percentages of people who do xyz activity, you'd end up with a beige toyota corolla.

This is supposed to be an enthusiast vehicle that, according to you guys, its main claim to fame is great at being used in a non-enthusiastic manner.

Fantabulous.

 

[Gamecock]

Listen guys...I'm sorry if you guys got me wrong here. I just don't like the IFS and that's my opinion. My opinion is supported by hard facts...not reading the minds of some fictional consumers out there. My original question was who actually WANTED the IFS before it was a final decision. I AM a CURRENT Bronco owner, and a Jeep owner as well. I have waited patiently for this release, and have said I won't even consider buying a rubicon till I see the new Bronco. Throughout all the buildup Fords press releases were very strongly worded that this would be a competitive vehicle. This vehicle would be specifically for a customer like myself. I took those words to mean certain things and I was wrong. What I still want to know is who did want the IFS? Not who will defend the IFS now that it is here? Ford has some allergy to SFA? They seem to sell alot of superdutys...and I think they drive just fine...I have one! I didn't mean to start any kind of d##k measuring contest or the like. OK maybe the IFS will be so much better than Jeep that we will wonder how Jeep was so wrong for so many years...I really don't think that's the case, and I don't think anybody reading this believes that either.

Who wanted IFS? Me for one. My most recent truck was a moderately built FJ, and I liked the IFS off road. I preferred it over Jeeps on and off road for most situations. I think Ford went the right direction in doing it...and everyone who paid attention knew they were going that direction....thus no outcry about it at launch at all. It was a non issue because it was expected, and I think it will be embraced.

 

[PaBronco]

My take, Bronco could be a real threat to Jeep. I appreciate the technical analysis of the off road capability, BUT, most people are not going to do heavy off roading in their new Bronco.

The reason I think it will be a threat to the Jeep is because the Bronco will be a more suitable DD with the IFS. In my younger years I did not mind driving a Jeep as a DD, but as I get older, I do not want a stiff ride on the highway.
I have a JT in the garage, but as nice as it is, I would not want to use it as a DD. Bronco is the sweet spot for me, can use as a DD and can also go off road.

 

[Bmadda]

 

[Bmadda]

OOOO wait...NOT JUST JEEP OWNERS!

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