Ford QC gone down hill...

[DVULT57]

Along the lines of pushing things down the line and stamping them good.

Funny thing, one time I think it was back in 06 or 07 there was a customer with a Mustang complaining of what sounded like something rolling around when making turns. We all drove it, couldn't figure it out. Started taking apart the car. Found a marble with a note taped to it that said "you found me" behind the dash in the HVAC system. In my career we have found all sorts of things, door jams painted a different color (red) on a blue vehicle (Escape), wrong seat colors, missing window regulators, "Hey, the windows don't roll down"...incorrect badging, manual transmission vehicles on the sticker that come in automatic, mismatched tires, all sorts of goodies!

So at the end of the day we are all human and make mistakes, albeit some intentional and some that make you have that WTF look on your face. If you fired everyone who screwed up we would all be fired at some point.

"If you fired everyone who screwed up we would all be fired at some point."
Agreed.

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[voxel]

I think all manufacturers are poor on quality these days. I bought a brand new Honda side-by-side sight unseen because I thought, Honda, what could be better quality. My old plain Jane John Deere gator had so much better build quality than that Honda. It’s unbelievable. It’s sad.

I tell folks the same thing about new Toyotas assembled in the US. There's an ongoing joke on the Sequoia groups over the broken volume knobs and who has the most.

My first Bronco had some rattles but nothing like the new Sequoia I picked up after. I would not buy a new/used vehicle sight unseen without checking it out.

 

[BlueWaffle]

Ford still does better than Bentley..

Buy a car that costs as much as a house and there's a 97% chance you'll need warranty work done in the first year

 

[Poppavein]

Ford still does better than Bentley..

This is why I didn’t buy a Bentley.

 

[FloridaBurgBronco]

Ford has turned to greed above product thinking and is on the way to company failure imho

I agree, I was a 32 year Ford guy since I was a kid and even before I could drive, my experience with my just traded in Bronco has turned me to the 4Runner, never before would I have ever thought to buy a Toyota, wanted to get one before the redesign and it's made 100% in the same factory in Japan as other really good Toyotas. Can't say that about any Ford. When my Bronco was in the the transmission repair, they gave me a 2023 F-150 loaner, sticker said content was 23% US and Canadian made, NOT EVEN A QUARTER OF THE GOOD OLD AMERICAN PICK UP TRUCK WAS MADE IN AMERICA!!!! Geez, that's nuts. Having said that I did a lot of checking at the Toyota dealer and honestly it's similar, lots of Toyotas are made everywhere too. But I will say being a car guy forever, it's hard to deny Toyota's overall quality. It's a shame though, I really liked my Bronco, it was an awesome vehicle, super fun with the manual, that I will miss the most. But I will not miss the recalls, TSB's and things that need TSB's and recalls and which Ford simply denies. It was a shaky company going into the pandemic and now the company is nothing short of a five alarm dumpster fire. Three straight years the recall King and working on their fourth. I hate to see it, but they know there are problems and they just don't care enough to fix them, so screw them.

 

[Area51BS]

That's why Ford is #1 in recalls and spends a couple billion more in warranty expenses than the next closest manufacturer. The other thing that's true is throwing a ton more $$ at the line workers proves there's no more shits given about what they're building. This is true across all Ford and Lincoln models and the sad part is the Mexico and China built vehicles we've gotten appear to have better build quality than the domestic stuff.

With the nut not fully installed and excessive trash in the paint, it's possible it went through the line and wasn't caught but more than likely it had some defects and was repainted by their "body shop" at the plant. QC there is worse than the line from our experience but FFS, the dealer should've caught that if they did even a half assed PDI.

PDI. You mean the guy in the line of dropped vehicles in front of auto wash, putting the stubby antenna on, pulling stickers, applying dealer sticker and pulling it through wash. They don’t check crap. I watched a recent vehicle I bought from Ford go through it before they knew I was buying it right of the truck.

 

[DVULT57]

I am pretty sure this was repainted for whatever reason. Looking at the right side bolts, looks like the bolts were removed braking the paint bond then retightened and sprayed over the cracked paint below..
Could be wrong but that's a lot of buildup on the edge of the washer below the nut..

 

[flip]

PDI. You mean the guy in the line of dropped vehicles in front of auto wash, putting the stubby antenna on, pulling stickers, applying dealer sticker and pulling it through wash. They don’t check crap. I watched a recent vehicle I bought from Ford go through it before they knew I was buying it right of the truck.

Wash is part of it but it's supposed to go through a mechanical inspection by someone that's taken the PDI training. In our case it's a technician in a department that just does new and used then heads to cleanup. Ford reimburses the dealer about an hour of labor to do the inspection, install loose items, take out of transport mode, set tire pressures, fill out the PDI form, test drive and of course, the wash. Your experience, while way too common and unfortunate, seems to be one way dealers save a few bucks by not running it through the shop. If a problem is found, Ford will pay them to fix it but not doing a proper PDI is just rolling the dice hoping the factory did their jobs correctly.

Shorting this step doesn't do the customer any favors, likely adds to dissatisfaction and not giving Ford the inspection they're paying the dealer to do. Let's face it, shit leaves the factory messed up, stuff can happen sitting at the factory lot and during transport. We're supposed to be the last eyes on things before turning over to the customer. Obviously, we're all human and can and do miss things but if you're not even making an attempt to do a quality inspection, there's almost no chance of finding or correcting them. My people aren't perfect but we sure as hell give Ford the PDI they're paying for so I don't have a PO'd customer in my service department because we did a half-assed job. Really starts the relationship off on the wrong foot and plants the seed in customer's minds of what else is wrong.

 

[FootPain]

That's why Ford is #1 in recalls and spends a couple billion more in warranty expenses than the next closest manufacturer. The other thing that's true is throwing a ton more $$ at the line workers proves there's no more shits given about what they're building. This is true across all Ford and Lincoln models and the sad part is the Mexico and China built vehicles we've gotten appear to have better build quality than the domestic stuff.

With the nut not fully installed and excessive trash in the paint, it's possible it went through the line and wasn't caught but more than likely it had some defects and was repainted by their "body shop" at the plant. QC there is worse than the line from our experience but FFS, the dealer should've caught that if they did even a half assed PDI.

When management cares more about their numbers then quality it's an issue. I've personally seen not only managers but engineers say just push it through let the dealers handle it. We can only do so much as the workers.

 

[flip]

When management cares more about their numbers then quality it's an issue. I've personally seen not only managers but engineers say just push it through let the dealers handle it. We can only do so much as the workers.

Not bitter at all however I would expect the workmanship/assembly quality to increase with compensation. Why would anyone think it's a good deal to pay more and get nothing in return?

That wasn't directed at you specifically rather at the organization that represents the workers who aren't holding individuals to a higher standard. I get pushing stuff through and letting us fix it but the problems we're seeing are assembly issues, meaning someone not doing their jobs correctly or caring more than an engineering problem they can't do anything about.

One thing I would love, since FoMoCo loves surveys, is every time we get an obvious, no shits given on the line that day, we can report it, with pics and description and the person that f'd it up gets scored and called out. The other item, is if the factory knows something is going out the door with an issue, why the hell can't they put some type of note in the vehicle to let us know when the vehicle arrives? All I can say is the assembly quality in the last few years has gone down for whatever reason. Unless the people who are responsible for poor work aren't called out or retrained it makes the union complicit. The major misconception a lot of people in this company have is they work for Ford. We, meaning leadership, labor all the way down to my lube techs work for our MUTUAL customers. Without the understanding that they write ALL of our paychecks the focus is going to continue to be on the wrong thing.

 

[FootPain]

Not bitter at all however I would expect the workmanship/assembly quality to increase with compensation. Why would anyone think it's a good deal to pay more and get nothing in return?

That wasn't directed at you specifically rather at the organization that represents the workers who aren't holding individuals to a higher standard. I get pushing stuff through and letting us fix it but the problems we're seeing are assembly issues, meaning someone not doing their jobs correctly or caring more than an engineering problem they can't do anything about.

One thing I would love, since FoMoCo loves surveys, is every time we get an obvious, no shits given on the line that day, we can report it, with pics and description and the person that f'd it up gets scored and called out. The other item, is if the factory knows something is going out the door with an issue, why the hell can't they put some type of note in the vehicle to let us know when the vehicle arrives? All I can say is the assembly quality in the last few years has gone down for whatever reason. Unless the people who are responsible for poor work aren't called out or retrained it makes the union complicit. The major misconception a lot of people in this company have is they work for Ford. We, meaning leadership, labor all the way down to my lube techs work for our MUTUAL customers. Without the understanding that they write ALL of our paychecks the focus is going to continue to be on the wrong thing.

They are well aware of when and where a problem happens on a line. Look how many QR codes are on parts. Are there people that don't care? Yes but I believe more care than not. You'll never get a note on what's wrong for two reasons. One they'd have to buy the paper for notes and two they'd have to pay someone to write the note. Ford is notorious for being cheap. I'm told almost everyday just get it running for today we can fix it later. Things are held together with bubblegum and paperclips because management doesn't want downtime. When I first got hired I was amazed at all the QC checks happening while product was going down the line. Those checks are gone because Ford has completely gone to scanners and computers verifying processes. When a human is involved and stops production to address the problem 5 levels of management show up and demand the line gets going and to push product through.

Is there a QC issue? Yes. Is it from just one source? No. Ford has a fundamental issue with being concerned about just pushing units and it's killing the company.

Sorry for the rant but it kills me when workers are blamed for things we can't control.

 

[Area51BS]

Boils down to today’s work ethic. Can’t rule out corporate metrics and getting those production numbers looking better. You would think by now it would tilt the other way towards quality job 1 until production numbers shift back down. It’s a constant cycle in many businesses.

 

[FootPain]

Boils down to today’s work ethic. Can’t rule out corporate metrics and getting those production numbers looking better. You would think by now it would tilt the other way towards quality job 1 until production numbers shift back down. It’s a constant cycle in many businesses.

Every generation bitches about the next generation's work ethic. Your grandfather probably said the same thing about your generation. It's like you said. Cyclical

 

[userdude]

Not bitter at all however I would expect the workmanship/assembly quality to increase with compensation. Why would anyone think it's a good deal to pay more and get nothing in return?

That wasn't directed at you specifically rather at the organization that represents the workers who aren't holding individuals to a higher standard. I get pushing stuff through and letting us fix it but the problems we're seeing are assembly issues, meaning someone not doing their jobs correctly or caring more than an engineering problem they can't do anything about.

One thing I would love, since FoMoCo loves surveys, is every time we get an obvious, no shits given on the line that day, we can report it, with pics and description and the person that f'd it up gets scored and called out. The other item, is if the factory knows something is going out the door with an issue, why the hell can't they put some type of note in the vehicle to let us know when the vehicle arrives? All I can say is the assembly quality in the last few years has gone down for whatever reason. Unless the people who are responsible for poor work aren't called out or retrained it makes the union complicit. The major misconception a lot of people in this company have is they work for Ford. We, meaning leadership, labor all the way down to my lube techs work for our MUTUAL customers. Without the understanding that they write ALL of our paychecks the focus is going to continue to be on the wrong thing.

You heard it here first, Flip for president!

Just kidding, I wouldn't do that to you. However, 100% correct. If they wanted to do better, Ford could.

 

[userdude]

They are well aware of when and where a problem happens on a line. Look how many QR codes are on parts. Are there people that don't care? Yes but I believe more care than not. You'll never get a note on what's wrong for two reasons. One they'd have to buy the paper for notes and two they'd have to pay someone to write the note. Ford is notorious for being cheap. I'm told almost everyday just get it running for today we can fix it later. Things are held together with bubblegum and paperclips because management doesn't want downtime. When I first got hired I was amazed at all the QC checks happening while product was going down the line. Those checks are gone because Ford has completely gone to scanners and computers verifying processes. When a human is involved and stops production to address the problem 5 levels of management show up and demand the line gets going and to push product through.

Is there a QC issue? Yes. Is it from just one source? No. Ford has a fundamental issue with being concerned about just pushing units and it's killing the company.

Sorry for the rant but it kills me when workers are blamed for things we can't control.

In the software business, this attitude is rampant... in the US. There's a euphemism for it: "Good for stockholder value." In other words, there's money to be made underdeveloping. Like Boeing is finding out, putting accountants and finance people in charge of production decisions is a race to the bottom.

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