NJ/NY/Delaware/Eastern Pa./MD/Ct Volume Buyers?

[NayNay]

Has it been confirmed that Ford will allow x plan? Was thinking about that yesterday. My current reservation dealer will take x plan, but if it's not available NaNa's 3% below msrp is a better deal.

Just remember to weigh out all your options. I can not see any logical reason for Ford to not have plan pricing. Again, this may be special to us buying one, but Ford has already said it is NOT a specialty vehicle. Every regular vehicle I have ever seen has had plan pricing. The Bronco Sport has it. What I do see is new vehicles not having special rates or rebates when they 1st hit. That being said those that get their Bronco 1st will probably see no rebates, while those further down the list will probably see rebates and/or special rates from Ford. I am speaking thru past experiences so I can not guarantee this but I have not seen it roll out any differently in the past.

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[EvlNvrDys]

"What we have here is.....failure to communicate."

You ain't kidding on that. Big time failure... on Ford's part.

All I've communicated with them is x-plan (if eligible), and $1,000 accessory credit. There is NO minimum required on reservations to get that.

Things I don't know, extra deposit? What accessories that goes towards? and whatever else anyone can think of.

 

[Kris87]

You ain't kidding on that. Big time failure... on Ford's part.

All I've communicated with them is x-plan (if eligible), and $1,000 accessory credit. There is NO minimum required on reservations to get that.

Things I don't know, extra deposit? What accessories that goes towards? and whatever else anyone can think of.

Keep in mind that any dealer accepting x-plan(if available) can't offer any type of $1000 accessory credit on that deal. I haven't kept up with every thread so forgive me if someone has already addressed that, but wanted to point out that it's a serious plan violation.

 

[Fly by Nite]

Keep in mind that any dealer accepting x-plan(if available) can't offer any type of $1000 accessory credit on that deal. I haven't kept up with every thread so forgive me if someone has already addressed that, but wanted to point out that it's a serious plan violation.

I had one dealer tell me something similar:
" With our X-Plan agreement with Ford we can't offer any additional offers that we dont offer everyone".

Maybe there's a loophole?
Such as If they offer an accessory credit deal on invoice price, it's ok? And give additional discount for plan members, but don't actually use the plan credentials (Like Granger's -$300).
One downside to invoice pricing is the potential for high Doc fees, such as the $899 one dealer charged for their $1000-off 'deal'.

 

[Sighlense]

Keep in mind that any dealer accepting x-plan(if available) can't offer any type of $1000 accessory credit on that deal. I haven't kept up with every thread so forgive me if someone has already addressed that, but wanted to point out that it's a serious plan violation.

Wrench thrown. This is why it would be VERY beneficial if they would just communicate YES or NO on x plan. Everything is fluid with them at this point, and my bet is that they haven't decided yet.

 

[EvlNvrDys]

Keep in mind that any dealer accepting x-plan(if available) can't offer any type of $1000 accessory credit on that deal. I haven't kept up with every thread so forgive me if someone has already addressed that, but wanted to point out that it's a serious plan violation.

I had one dealer tell me something similar:
" With our X-Plan agreement with Ford we can't offer any additional offers that we dont offer everyone".

Maybe there's a loophole?
Such as If they offer an accessory credit deal on invoice price, it's ok? And give additional discount for plan members, but don't actually use the plan credentials (Like Granger's -$300).
One downside to invoice pricing is the potential for high Doc fees, such as the $899 one dealer charged for their $1000-off 'deal'.

My guess is there are always ways to work around such a thing. Whether it be "more" money for your trade to hit a number below invoice while using x-plan. Or is it against plan rules to say, We are accepting x-plan, and since you are choosing us, we're giving you a $1,000 loyalty bonus straight from us, NOT Ford.

I just see many ways that a dealer could circumvent said x-plan rules. But good to know that in theory x-plan is just x-plan... nothing else. Gives us more questions to ask. Thanks.

Edit: I will add to this, why would Ford have so many rules? From what I understand, Ford STILL gets their invoice price. Minus the "commission" they pay the dealer for accepting x-plan. Therefore I'd think that the dealer would be the one on the hook for the extra discount, NOT Ford. Of course in return, said dealer could pick up 50 or more reservations they didn't have before, more profit to be had.

 

[Kris87]

I had one dealer tell me something similar:
" With our X-Plan agreement with Ford we can't offer any additional offers that we dont offer everyone".

Maybe there's a loophole?
Such as If they offer an accessory credit deal on invoice price, it's ok? And give additional discount for plan members, but don't actually use the plan credentials (Like Granger's -$300).
One downside to invoice pricing is the potential for high Doc fees, such as the $899 one dealer charged for their $1000-off 'deal'.

There's lots of things dealers can get in trouble doing in these types of scenarios. They can't give you anything in addition to any FOMOCO plan pricing. Even advertising it to plan members is a violation of Ford ad standards. Then there are serious legal ramifications for dealers when they charge customers different doc fees. The only caveat to that would be someone sold under actual plan pricing(actually locking in a pin) which states allow. But as a dealer, I can't tell one group of people I'm going to charge them a different doc fee than I'm charging another group. Attorneys would have a field day with that and dealers would lose 100% of the time.

 

[Bronc-OH]

Keep in mind that any dealer accepting x-plan(if available) can't offer any type of $1000 accessory credit on that deal. I haven't kept up with every thread so forgive me if someone has already addressed that, but wanted to point out that it's a serious plan violation.

So what are they allowed to do then for xplan customers? Or are we better off chasing invoice deals without xplan ?

 

[EvlNvrDys]

One downside to invoice pricing is the potential for high Doc fees, such as the $899 one dealer charged for their $1000-off 'deal'.

So what are they allowed to do then for xplan customers? Or are we better off chasing invoice deals without xplan ?

That quote above is the problem with a flat out invoice deal. Some dealership (I believe in Md.) was offering $1,000 below invoice, but as @Fly by Nite eluded to, tacked on a $899 doc fee. So in essence below invoice, but you gotta wonder what else they throw in there... window etchings? Paint protection?

 

[Kris87]

My guess is there are always ways to work around such a thing. Whether it be "more" money for your trade to hit a number below invoice while using x-plan. Or is it against plan rules to say, We are accepting x-plan, and since you are choosing us, we're giving you a $1,000 loyalty bonus straight from us, NOT Ford.

I just see many ways that a dealer could circumvent said x-plan rules. But good to know that in theory x-plan is just x-plan... nothing else. Gives us more questions to ask. Thanks.

Edit: I will add to this, why would Ford have so many rules? From what I understand, Ford STILL gets their invoice price. Minus the "commission" they pay the dealer for accepting x-plan. Therefore I'd think that the dealer would be the one on the hook for the extra discount, NOT Ford. Of course in return, said dealer could pick up 50 or more reservations they didn't have before, more profit to be had.

"The" only way to circumvent plan pricing by manipulating the numbers is with the trade. You have a viable channel then to throw more money in the deal for the customer. The plan rules even address that scenario and it's allowed. Trust me, the plan rules are very clearly written, and a dealer cannot offer any plan customer anything more than a $50 nominal gift. They even spell out what that $50 can be. When they audit our plan deals, they actually look out our internal recap sheet and it's clear to know then if you were to setup fake down payments, gifts, charges to the deal, accessory credits, etc...they will know.

You can't even advertise to x-plan customers that you're giving them a "certain" deal. That is a violation, so a "loyalty bonus" would definitely be a violation.

All that said, the doc fee deal is a much bigger deal. In our state the Office of Consumer Affairs and Attorney General monitor those things. No way I'd roll the dice on something like that. That has class action lawsuit and millions of dollars written all over it considering the number of customers you sell and the actual higher fee you may charge. Yikes!

 

[Sighlense]

One downside to invoice pricing is the potential for high Doc fees, such as the $899 one dealer charged for their $1000-off 'deal'.

Van Bortel has stated invoice and a $75 doc fee. Other than Granger and Stephens, this looks like the best deal to me(where we stand right now). However, Leonardtown's x plan with 10-20% off accessories and free shipping within reason would be a pretty sweet deal.

 

[Kris87]

So what are they allowed to do then for xplan customers? Or are we better off chasing invoice deals without xplan ?

Bottom line, dealers cannot give x-plan participants anything more than a $50 nominal gift(oil change, parts credit), straight x-plan price off the invoice, and $100 doc fee. If anyone is promising anything other than those things, then they're in violation. Even if they advertise those things, but say "we're not going to actually lock in your pin #" then that is a violation as well since they can't advertise they're doing it for plan participants only.

Then if those dealers that said we're giving x-plan customers "this" deal, but didn't lock in their pin, and actually charged them a lower doc fee....then that's when it's really bad.

 

[Kris87]

Van Bortel has stated invoice and a $75 doc fee. Other than Granger and Stephens, this looks like the best deal to me(where we stand right now). However, Leonardtown's x plan with 10-20% off accessories and free shipping within reason would be a pretty sweet deal.

As long as a dealer is advertising a retail offer, they can offer whatever they like. If their doc fee isn't normally $75 for retail deals, then that would concern me(as a dealer).

I don't know Leonardtown's offer, but that offer would be a no-no as well. That said, doesn't matter to me what dealers are offering. There's already violations all over this forum from dealers.

 

[EvlNvrDys]

Then if those dealers that said we're giving x-plan customers "this" deal, but didn't lock in their pin, and actually charged them a lower doc fee....then that's when it's really bad.

That's one line I disagree with. Doc fees are supposed to be what the dealer charges the customer to push the paper work.. Some states (or maybe most) limit the amount a dealer can charge... but they don't set a price saying it must be this. So with that said....

Charging a lower doc fee... sure they can if they see fit. Why? Because if I go into a dealer and get a certain deal because I haggled, then @Bronc-OH comes in for the same exact vehicle, dealer feels he's a bit of a pain in the ass, so sticks it to him. How is it wrong if I get a lower doc fee? based on what I said above about what doc fees are?

And yet you wonder why we hate dealerships.

 

[Sighlense]

As long as a dealer is advertising a retail offer, they can offer whatever they like. If their doc fee isn't normally $75 for retail deals, then that would concern me(as a dealer).

I don't know Leonardtown's offer, but that offer would be a no-no as well. That said, doesn't matter to me what dealers are offering. There's already violations all over this forum from dealers.

Dealer violation police! I'll leave that up to said dealers, as i'm sure they know what they are doing. As far as Van Bortel goes, we have a member here that has purchased from them in the past, at invoice with a $75 doc fee.

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