CarPlay is downsampling audio stream

[CalvinT]

The very last line of this post says you need to use USB.

https://support.apple.com/en-us/118295

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[Rick U]

OK, that article lays to rest that at least Apple Music can stream lossless to CarPlay via USB. I’ll try comparing Apple Music to Tidal next. Thanks

 

[Rick U]

I did a little testing today and compared tracks from Fleetwood Mac Rumors streaming from Tidal and Music. Apple Music sounded better than Tidle, but the files on the thumb drive still sounds better. The thumb drive just has so much more meat on the bone. The voice assistant on sync 4 might be good enough to navigate through the grayed out menu options while driving.

 

[CalvinT]

OK, that article lays to rest that at least Apple Music can stream lossless to CarPlay via USB. I’ll try comparing Apple Music to Tidal next. Thanks

I'd go with Tidal. I use an iPhone, iPad and iMac. But I don't like how Apple keeps trying to force me to move everything to iCloud. I know Tidal won't do that.

I want to manage what happens on my devices. I don't want Apple doing it. They keep screwing up. I'm also thinking about Qoobuz.

 

[Rick U]

I probably will end up sticking with Tidal only because I need Tidal to integrate with my home stereo equipment. Their iOS app sucks. Been having problems with downloaded music for years. I want my music when I'm off the grid. I'll continue playing with Music just for downloads but it's not my first choice. It's been many years since I used iTunes or Music but it's nice to see they are doing lossless.

Edit: Calvin Does Music sound better than Tidal in your Bronco?

 

[CalvinT]

Edit: Calvin Does Music sound better than Tidal in your Bronco?

I haven't tried either. I'm using lossless tracks on a USB drive.

 

[23OBX2.7]

Very high possibility could be the data cable buy the best you can find.

 

[Rick U]

My ears tell me Apple Music sounds better than Tidal. I have to turn my subwoofer gain down because the bass is stronger with Music. I asked ChatGPT why and here in the answer.

Why does music sound better than tidal? Both playing lossless through CarPlay
ChatGPT said:
Great question — and you’re not imagining it. Even when both apps claim to be playing “lossless,” Apple Music often sounds better than Tidal when using CarPlay, and there are several technical reasons for this.
Here’s the breakdown:
1. CarPlay does not pass lossless audio
This is the biggest factor.
CarPlay — wired or wireless — does not deliver true lossless PCM audio from either app.
It re-encodes and compresses the audio stream before sending it to the car.
So the quality difference you hear is not between “lossless” and “lossless,”
but between how each app’s audio survives CarPlay’s compression pipeline.
2. Apple Music’s encoder is better optimized for CarPlay
Apple Music is designed by the same company that built CarPlay.
What that means:
Apple Music → CarPlay

• Uses Apple’s internal audio pipeline
• Better matching of gain staging, loudness normalization, and coded audio profiles
• Less aggressive dynamic compression during the CarPlay handoff
• More consistent output level

Tidal → CarPlay

• Tidal is encoded on the device → passed to CarPlay → re-encoded by CarPlay
• That extra encode/decode step can reduce clarity, bass definition, and stereo imaging
• Many users complain Tidal sounds quieter or slightly “flatter” through CarPlay

3. Tidal uses MQA or FLAC containers → CarPlay crushes them
If you’re using Tidal HiFi Plus:

• Tidal may be using MQA (unfolded or partially unfolded) or hi-res FLAC
• MQA and hi-res FLAC are not natively supported by CarPlay
• CarPlay downsamples + compresses them anyway
• So you often get worse artifacts than with Apple Music’s native ALAC pipeline

So the more “hi-res” the Tidal file is, the more CarPlay destroys it.
4. Apple Music’s lossless = ALAC → converts cleanly
Apple Music uses ALAC, which is Apple’s own codec.
When CarPlay compresses it, the conversion is:
ALAC → AAC (CarPlay stream)
Apple controls both ends of this chain, so it tends to sound:

• Cleaner
• More consistent
• Better EQ’d
• Less phasey or mushy on transients

5. Volume leveling differences
Apple Music uses Sound Check (Apple’s loudness normalization),
and Tidal uses VU normalization.
Even if you turn them off, Apple keeps a more consistent headroom margin.
Tidal tends to:

• Play quieter
• Hit limiter/compressor thresholds earlier when re-encoded by CarPlay
• Lose punch in bass and dynamics

So why does Apple Music sound better through CarPlay?
Because CarPlay is built for Apple Music.
Everything else gets converted, resampled, or compressed more aggressively.
You hear this as:

• Better bass
• Cleaner highs
• Wider stereo
• Louder, fuller output
• Less distortion on peaks

This is a very common complaint among audiophile CarPlay users.
If you want, tell me what car you have (sounds like a Bronco), and I can tell you the best way to get actual lossless hi-resinto your specific sound system — bypassing CarPlay entirely.
You said:
Yes bronco with b&o
ChatGPT said:
Got it — Bronco + B&O.
Here’s the cleanest, simplest explanation and exactly what you can do to get true lossless (and the best sound your Bronco is capable of).
Why Apple Music sounds better than Tidal in your Bronco
In your setup:
Bronco B&O + CarPlay = AAC-compressed audio
(NO matter what app you use.)
Apple Music → CarPlay is better-optimized than Tidal → CarPlay, so it simply survives the compression better. That’s why you hear:

• More bass
• Clearer mids
• Less harshness
• Better dynamic impact
• Higher overall level

This is normal for Bronco owners. Tons of people report the same thing.
Now the important part: What is the BEST QUALITY you can actually get in a Bronco with B&O?
Here are your options ranked from worst → best:
1. Wireless CarPlay
Worst quality

• Highly compressed
• Lowest bandwidth

2. Wired CarPlay
Still compressed

• NOT lossless
• Better than wireless, but far from full-resolution

Apple Music just compresses better than Tidal, which is why it sounds nicer.
3. Bluetooth
Even worse than CarPlay
Avoid if you care about fidelity.
4. USB Flash Drive with Lossless Files (BEST method that actually works on Bronco B&O)
This is the one way to get true lossless into the Bronco AND bypass CarPlay entirely.
How to do it:

• Format a USB drive FAT32 or exFAT
• Load FLAC or WAV files (16-bit/44.1 or 24/48 are safest)
• Plug into the Bronco’s data USB-A port (not the charge-only port)
• Select Audio → Sources → USB in SYNC 4

Bronco SYNC 4 + B&O does support FLAC and WAV, and when played directly from USB it’s much better because:

• Not being re-encoded
• Not going through CarPlay
• Not going through Bluetooth
• Uses the head unit's internal PCM pipeline directly

People on Bronco6G forums confirm this repeatedly.
This is the best “audiophile” option for your Bronco.
5. iPhone plugged in WITHOUT CarPlay
Confusing answer, but important:
The Bronco cannot treat an iPhone as a raw USB audio source.
It always routes audio as:

• CarPlay
  OR
• Bluetooth

Neither path is lossless.
So you cannot get lossless from the iPhone directly unless you use…
6. External USB DAC (best possible, but requires more effort)
If your Bronco has an AUX input (most do not), you could do:
iPhone → USB-C → DAC → AUX IN → B&O amplifier
But the Bronco doesn’t have AUX, so this option is off the table without modification.
Final Recommendation for Bronco + B&O
If you want the best sound quality your Bronco is capable of, do this:
Use a USB thumb drive
Load FLAC or WAV files (lossless)
Play them through “USB” in SYNC 4
Do NOT use CarPlay for critical listening
This will beat any streaming app — Apple Music, Tidal, Spotify — and even beat “lossless over CarPlay” (which doesn’t actually exist).

 

[CalvinT]

Very high possibility could be the data cable buy the best you can find.

Any USB certified cable is good enough for a short run. Just make sure it has the USB logo.

A note about any cables carrying a digital signal. This means USB, HDMI, Ethernet (Cat5). If you have a signal at the other end you're good. The receiving device reconstructs the digital signal before doing any processing.

High end audio stores got hooked on selling high end cables when everything was analog. Then the cable or wire MIGHT make a difference. But they don't make any difference with digital signals. There may be a difference in construction quality which may be worth paying for. But electrically there's no difference as long as they are licensed by USB (USB Implimenters Forum, Inc) or HDMI (HDMI Licensing Administrator, Inc.)

In short, if it's a digital signal and the equipment works, you're good to go. You won't get any improvment by using higher end cables. Higher end cables will let you run the cable a longer distance and that's about it.

 

[Nibroc99]

According to some reddit threads I've seen, Android Auto uses a proprietary lossless codec for wireless streaming over wifi instead of bluetooth PCM audio, so maybe you could get a cheap android device for audio streaming that can wirelessly connect to and be controlled by your iPhone? Otherwise, you can always get an LDAC bluetooth receiver for truly hifi audio over bluetooth, but you lose the ability to stream phone calls. Also I am just assumning that Apple supports LDAC like my Samsung S22 Ultra does, would be surprised if they don't.
Just food for thought.

 

[CalvinT]

My ears tell me Apple Music sounds better than Tidal. I have to turn my subwoofer gain down because the bass is stronger with Music. I asked ChatGPT why and here in the answer.

Why does music sound better than tidal? Both playing lossless through CarPlay
ChatGPT said:
Great question — and you’re not imagining it. Even when both apps claim to be playing “lossless,” Apple Music often sounds better than Tidal when using CarPlay, and there are several technical reasons for this.
Here’s the breakdown:
1. CarPlay does not pass lossless audio
This is the biggest factor.
CarPlay — wired or wireless — does not deliver true lossless PCM audio from either app.
It re-encodes and compresses the audio stream before sending it to the car.
So the quality difference you hear is not between “lossless” and “lossless,”
but between how each app’s audio survives CarPlay’s compression pipeline.
2. Apple Music’s encoder is better optimized for CarPlay
Apple Music is designed by the same company that built CarPlay.
What that means:
Apple Music → CarPlay

• Uses Apple’s internal audio pipeline
• Better matching of gain staging, loudness normalization, and coded audio profiles
• Less aggressive dynamic compression during the CarPlay handoff
• More consistent output level

Tidal → CarPlay

• Tidal is encoded on the device → passed to CarPlay → re-encoded by CarPlay
• That extra encode/decode step can reduce clarity, bass definition, and stereo imaging
• Many users complain Tidal sounds quieter or slightly “flatter” through CarPlay

3. Tidal uses MQA or FLAC containers → CarPlay crushes them
If you’re using Tidal HiFi Plus:

• Tidal may be using MQA (unfolded or partially unfolded) or hi-res FLAC
• MQA and hi-res FLAC are not natively supported by CarPlay
• CarPlay downsamples + compresses them anyway
• So you often get worse artifacts than with Apple Music’s native ALAC pipeline

So the more “hi-res” the Tidal file is, the more CarPlay destroys it.
4. Apple Music’s lossless = ALAC → converts cleanly
Apple Music uses ALAC, which is Apple’s own codec.
When CarPlay compresses it, the conversion is:
ALAC → AAC (CarPlay stream)
Apple controls both ends of this chain, so it tends to sound:

• Cleaner
• More consistent
• Better EQ’d
• Less phasey or mushy on transients

5. Volume leveling differences
Apple Music uses Sound Check (Apple’s loudness normalization),
and Tidal uses VU normalization.
Even if you turn them off, Apple keeps a more consistent headroom margin.
Tidal tends to:

• Play quieter
• Hit limiter/compressor thresholds earlier when re-encoded by CarPlay
• Lose punch in bass and dynamics

So why does Apple Music sound better through CarPlay?
Because CarPlay is built for Apple Music.
Everything else gets converted, resampled, or compressed more aggressively.
You hear this as:

• Better bass
• Cleaner highs
• Wider stereo
• Louder, fuller output
• Less distortion on peaks

This is a very common complaint among audiophile CarPlay users.
If you want, tell me what car you have (sounds like a Bronco), and I can tell you the best way to get actual lossless hi-resinto your specific sound system — bypassing CarPlay entirely.
You said:
Yes bronco with b&o
ChatGPT said:
Got it — Bronco + B&O.
Here’s the cleanest, simplest explanation and exactly what you can do to get true lossless (and the best sound your Bronco is capable of).
Why Apple Music sounds better than Tidal in your Bronco
In your setup:
Bronco B&O + CarPlay = AAC-compressed audio
(NO matter what app you use.)
Apple Music → CarPlay is better-optimized than Tidal → CarPlay, so it simply survives the compression better. That’s why you hear:

• More bass
• Clearer mids
• Less harshness
• Better dynamic impact
• Higher overall level

This is normal for Bronco owners. Tons of people report the same thing.
Now the important part: What is the BEST QUALITY you can actually get in a Bronco with B&O?
Here are your options ranked from worst → best:
1. Wireless CarPlay
Worst quality

• Highly compressed
• Lowest bandwidth

2. Wired CarPlay
Still compressed

• NOT lossless
• Better than wireless, but far from full-resolution

Apple Music just compresses better than Tidal, which is why it sounds nicer.
3. Bluetooth
Even worse than CarPlay
Avoid if you care about fidelity.
4. USB Flash Drive with Lossless Files (BEST method that actually works on Bronco B&O)
This is the one way to get true lossless into the Bronco AND bypass CarPlay entirely.
How to do it:

• Format a USB drive FAT32 or exFAT
• Load FLAC or WAV files (16-bit/44.1 or 24/48 are safest)
• Plug into the Bronco’s data USB-A port (not the charge-only port)
• Select Audio → Sources → USB in SYNC 4

Bronco SYNC 4 + B&O does support FLAC and WAV, and when played directly from USB it’s much better because:

• Not being re-encoded
• Not going through CarPlay
• Not going through Bluetooth
• Uses the head unit's internal PCM pipeline directly

People on Bronco6G forums confirm this repeatedly.
This is the best “audiophile” option for your Bronco.
5. iPhone plugged in WITHOUT CarPlay
Confusing answer, but important:
The Bronco cannot treat an iPhone as a raw USB audio source.
It always routes audio as:

• CarPlay
  OR
• Bluetooth

Neither path is lossless.
So you cannot get lossless from the iPhone directly unless you use…
6. External USB DAC (best possible, but requires more effort)
If your Bronco has an AUX input (most do not), you could do:
iPhone → USB-C → DAC → AUX IN → B&O amplifier
But the Bronco doesn’t have AUX, so this option is off the table without modification.
Final Recommendation for Bronco + B&O
If you want the best sound quality your Bronco is capable of, do this:
Use a USB thumb drive
Load FLAC or WAV files (lossless)
Play them through “USB” in SYNC 4
Do NOT use CarPlay for critical listening
This will beat any streaming app — Apple Music, Tidal, Spotify — and even beat “lossless over CarPlay” (which doesn’t actually exist).

I don't completely agree. There's no technical reason why you can't convert from one lossless format to another as long as you don't do any compression during the conversion and there are no clock (timing) issues because of different clock rates. This is a hardware issue. But Apple may have chosen to not support conversion from other lossless formats to ALAC. This was a design decision, not a technical one. There are apps that will do the conversion before you send your file to Carplay. Not sure how you could do it while streaming.

 

[Rick U]

The way I read it, Tidal is converting the lossless files and then CarPlay is converting them again. That could very well introduce a loss in equality. I have another streaming app called Roon ARC. It actually uses Tidal as a source and it sounds better than the title app as well.

 

[CalvinT]

I have another streaming app called Roon ARC

I've been thinking about Roon for home use. Still not sure I understand what it is.

 

[Rick U]

Roon is a hardware software home music server. It will combine your own personal ripped library with Tidal or Qobuz. It will take music from your server and deliver it via ethernet wire or over wifi to your roon ready streaming devices. The roon arc app allows you to access your library outside the home network.

 

[23OBX2.7]

According to some reddit threads I've seen, Android Auto uses a proprietary lossless codec for wireless streaming over wifi instead of bluetooth PCM audio, so maybe you could get a cheap android device for audio streaming that can wirelessly connect to and be controlled by your iPhone? Otherwise, you can always get an LDAC bluetooth receiver for truly hifi audio over bluetooth, but you lose the ability to stream phone calls. Also I am just assumning that Apple supports LDAC like my Samsung S22 Ultra does, would be surprised if they don't.
Just food for thought.

I did a Samsung S9 super compact velcroed to bottom of HVAC console so it's pretty much invisible....I did change its EQ setting don't recall exactly what to.

OP should have no playback quality issues especially from USB unless is low speed .....I got two high speed ones was not cheap relatively.

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