Warn Front Bumper, Could there be Intercooler Problems?

[swooshdave]

The real question if if the Harbor Freight winch will fit in the same place as the Warn...

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[Jabberwock]

Here’s some more detailed photos of the Warn Elite bumper along with a Zeon 10s. Having never had a vehicle with a mounted winch OR an intercooler, I didn’t foresee the possible issue with airflow. Unfortunately I already have this bumper sitting in my driveway awaiting the arrival of my bronco that has been shipped. The lowest opening on the front below the fairlead (not the hole directly below the fairlead) could be a possible place to mount a shroud or duct to direct air upwards towards the intercooler, but it’s hard to tell if the geometry would work without having one mounted to look at. The hole alone I don’t think would be adequate, as it sits at a sharply downward facing angle. A scoop of some sort would have to be created just outside this hole to gather and direct air upwards. I posted these photos in the winch section yesterday but haven’t had any replies to my question about intercooler air flow.

 

[North7]

Here’s some more detailed photos of the Warn Elite bumper along with a Zeon 10s. Having never had a vehicle with a mounted winch OR an intercooler, I didn’t foresee the possible issue with airflow. Unfortunately I already have this bumper sitting in my driveway awaiting the arrival of my bronco that has been shipped. The lowest opening on the front below the fairlead (not the hole directly below the fairlead) could be a possible place to mount a shroud or duct to direct air upwards towards the intercooler, but it’s hard to tell if the geometry would work without having one mounted to look at. The hole alone I don’t think would be adequate, as it sits at a sharply downward facing angle. A scoop of some sort would have to be created just outside this hole to gather and direct air upwards. I posted these photos in the winch section yesterday but haven’t had any replies to my question about intercooler air flow.

Great analysis, since you have already purchased the bumper, you may want to try the duct/diverter trick. I'm new to intercooler so I'm not sure where in the system the temperature can be measured but it would be worth it to find out and then measure three things:

1) with stock bumper
2) with Warn bumper
3) with Warn bumper and duct/diverter added

WHY, are bumper manufactures not addressing this, it is not rocket science to run tests to see the affects and design around them.

 

[johndeerefarmer]

Great analysis, since you have already purchased the bumper, you may want to try the duct/diverter trick. I'm new to intercooler so I'm not sure where in the system the temperature can be measured but it would be worth it to find out and then measure three things:

1) with stock bumper
2) with Warn bumper
3) with Warn bumper and duct/diverter added

WHY, are bumper manufactures not addressing this, it is not rocket science to run tests to see the affects and design around them.

What you want to measure and compare is ambient air vs IAT2 (intake air temperature 2). I have used the Banks idash, the nGuage and SCT to watch these parameters.

It's not that big of a deal though. As I posted in the other thread, if IAT2 temps get too high the pcm will pull timing. The early ecoboosts had a condensation issue that causes the engine to studder if you stomped on the gas. This was caused by the engine sucking in the moisture. Ford's answer was to put a plate across part of the intercooler to make it run hotter and therefore less moisture. Then they actually decreased the size for the next model year. Also on 2011 the front license plate was to the left to avoid blocking it, then they moved it back to the center.
Finally if you aren't towing heavy or racing- which a Bronco isn't for either one I doubt you would even know that the pcm is pulling timing. My 17 F150 was pulling timing when I was towing a 24' trailer with two rzr's through 110 degrees in west Texas. I installed a Wagner CAC to prevent this but for the average guy he doesn't need to do anything.

Someone asked in the other thread, what happens if you are wheeling in the mud and the intercooler gets full of mud? The same thing that blocking it off does, it pulls some timing.

I understand Warn developed the winch and attachment bracket for the Ford modular bumper, don't you think Ford engineer's approved it? If so then why would Warn build their own that didn't work?

 

[Jabberwock]

What you want to measure and compare is ambient air vs IAT2 (intake air temperature 2). I have used the Banks idash, the nGuage and SCT to watch these parameters.

It's not that big of a deal though. As I posted in the other thread, if IAT2 temps get too high the pcm will pull timing. The early ecoboosts had a condensation issue that causes the engine to studder if you stomped on the gas. This was caused by the engine sucking in the moisture. Ford's answer was to put a plate across part of the intercooler to make it run hotter and therefore less moisture. Then they actually decreased the size for the next model year. Also on 2011 the front license plate was to the left to avoid blocking it, then they moved it back to the center.
Finally if you aren't towing heavy or racing- which a Bronco isn't for either one I doubt you would even know that the pcm is pulling timing. My 17 F150 was pulling timing when I was towing a 24' trailer with two rzr's through 110 degrees in west Texas. I installed a Wagner CAC to prevent this but for the average guy he doesn't need to do anything.

Someone asked in the other thread, what happens if you are wheeling in the mud and the intercooler gets full of mud? The same thing that blocking it off does, it pulls some timing.

I understand Warn developed the winch and attachment bracket for the Ford modular bumper, don't you think Ford engineer's approved it? If so then why would Warn build their own that didn't work?

Thanks for the info- that makes me feel a bit better about things. I have zero experience with the ecoboost or any vehicle with an intercooler so I appreciate any and all info anyone can provide. I also plan on using Forscan but just learning about its capabilities. My original plan was to get an OBDLink EX or MX+ scanner but that’s new to me as well. From what I have read thus far, using an OBD reader could help diagnose any problems. I would get some data before the bumper and winch are installed, then again after and compare. Johndeere if you know of another way I could get some comparison data please do chime in.

I would hope that Warn involved Ford in the design approval process, I would just like to know officially.

 

[JohnnyBronco]

Here’s some more detailed photos of the Warn Elite bumper along with a Zeon 10s. Having never had a vehicle with a mounted winch OR an intercooler, I didn’t foresee the possible issue with airflow. Unfortunately I already have this bumper sitting in my driveway awaiting the arrival of my bronco that has been shipped. The lowest opening on the front below the fairlead (not the hole directly below the fairlead) could be a possible place to mount a shroud or duct to direct air upwards towards the intercooler, but it’s hard to tell if the geometry would work without having one mounted to look at. The hole alone I don’t think would be adequate, as it sits at a sharply downward facing angle. A scoop of some sort would have to be created just outside this hole to gather and direct air upwards. I posted these photos in the winch section yesterday but haven’t had any replies to my question about intercooler air flow.

Okay, you already found what I was going to highlight, the Ford danger zone diagram and to me it looks like your winch will block the red area completely

 

[Jabberwock]

I just received a response from Warn regarding testing they have done with the Elite bumper with a winch and intercooler air flow. Helps alleviate some concern for me, hopefully others as well.

 

[Cornbred]

There is a company (full race or something like that if I remember)that makes a intercooler relocation kit for the eco boost F150’s so you can run a winch/bumper etc. The kit they make comes with a new larger intercooler though so it’s not cheap, but I’d have to assume someone is working on this for the bronco.

I purchased a 2011 F150 with the eco boost and ran in to the problem of the intercooler being in the way, at that time nobody made anything because it was the first year for eco boost in F150, so it was the only truck I ever owned without a permanent winch mounted, had to get front hitch and run it that way. Sold it and got 2014 F150 V8 so I could run hidden winch.

Edit:
This will solve your problem...

https://www.roughcountry.com/hidden-winch-mount-51054c.html?find=2021-ford-bronco-4wd-784415

 

[VoltageDrop]

There is a company (full race or something like that if I remember)that makes a intercooler relocation kit for the eco boost F150’s so you can run a winch/bumper etc. The kit they make comes with a new larger intercooler though so it’s not cheap, but I’d have to assume someone is working on this for the bronco.

I purchased a 2011 F150 with the eco boost and ran in to the problem of the intercooler being in the way, at that time nobody made anything because it was the first year for eco boost in F150, so it was the only truck I ever owned without a permanent winch mounted, had to get front hitch and run it that way. Sold it and got 2014 F150 V8 so I could run hidden winch.

Edit:
This will solve your problem...

https://www.roughcountry.com/hidden-winch-mount-51054c.html?find=2021-ford-bronco-4wd-784415

It won't be cheap and it requires removing the grill shutters but Mishimoto is well on the way to moving the intercooler to the front of the upper radiator.
https://www.mishimoto.com/engineeri...rmance-intercooler-stock-review-design-plans/

 

[North7]

It won't be cheap and it requires removing the grill shutters but Mishimoto is well on the way to moving the intercooler to the front of the upper radiator.
https://www.mishimoto.com/engineeri...rmance-intercooler-stock-review-design-plans/

Great find, thank you.

 

[johndeerefarmer]

Problem with moving it and replacing it is the chance of warranty issues. Sure everyone quotes the Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act but if you take it in for engine problems and the dealer sees the aftermarket CAC they can deny you warranty. Sure you can get a lawyer, blah, blah blah but in the meantime you don't have a vehicle to drive.
I will not replace the stock CAC on my Bronco for that reason and for the fact that I won't be towing with it (or very little) and won't be in hot conditions. These are the main two conditions that raise IAT2.
I can run the Ford approved winch and if IAT2 goes up under certain conditions- BIG DEAL! So what if it pulls a couple degrees of timing? I seriously doubt you are gonna even know it since you will probably be in 4WD Low range and 1st gear

On my 17 F150 I added a Wagner CAC because I do tow heavy with it. I figured the added performance was worth the risk. Putting the stock CAC back in before service is way too much work..

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