Not a misanthrope...why I don't like major offroad events.

[jasonkosi]

100% agree. Larger groups tend to ruin the fun with all the idling you do waiting for everyone else. Largest group run I went with had 40ish vehicles, we did split into 2 groups but that didn’t make much difference. Typically I head out on trails alone, although for more moderate/severe trails I prefer to go with other people so you have spotters and help in case something happens. I always prefer smaller groups of 5 or fewer vehicles over any bigger group.

Sponsored

 

[lakesinai]

I've been on this forum for a little bit. I've enjoyed chatting with many of you and met a few of you. i've enjoyed all of that. I have been in the offroad world for most of my 52 years in some form or fashion. I have picked up a few things from the smart folks out there. What i have learned is that major offroad events are a great social event. However I believe they are horrible for off highwaying.

I don't mean to offend, so I'd like to explain. I started realizing this in the early 90's when the NC side of Tellico still allowed off highway travel. There used to be an annual run up there called "The Dixie Run". Some of the older crowd may have heard of it. It was a great time. One year "Four Wheeler" magazine came and covered the run. The next year the campgrounds were beyond capacity. The people who'd paid for admission to the event were trying to find a spot to camp and were camping outside "organized" camp spots. The Forrest rangers spent all night trying to deal with people trying to pitch tents, park rigs, trailers and motor homes all over undesignated areas. We got through that part. The next day....and this is the real rub.... we waited 3 hours while 40 vehicles tried to cross the river. This was the first big coffin nail in them closing the tellico trails in my opinion.

I digress. So big events lead to sitting and waiting while people ceaselessly try obstacles over and over. I like uncrowded trails and courtesy in the off highway world, peace and tranquillity. Over the years i noticed crowded trails change me and change the others wheeling. I even try not to ride in a group much bigger than 7. At 8 vehicles I like to split it into two groups of four. The reason is you don't get the long photo line. I like pictures and videos of rides so I can remember the day and the warmth of the sun, or cold of the snow...whatever.

So as we head into the New year, as government tries to close our precious trails. Please take pause and realize a strong community with a strong voice is fantastic. 400 plus vehicles treading a trail back to back for hours is rough on terrain, and gives the "they cause erosion crowd" ammunition. I'm sure I'll be flamed for this and I am fine with that. But as you head to Jeepfest, the Great american crawl, or whatever your local area hosts take pause for a moment and weigh what I've said to see if any of it rings true for you.

Sincerely

,
Renegade

Same story for East Coast Beach access.

 

[Bullitt]

I concur. While many enjoy the group stuff (and good for them), I simply don't enjoy it.

I'd much rather jump in the Bronco solo or with my wife and enjoy remote areas high up in the mountains here in Colorado. I'm retired (and my wife isn't) so I'm solo most of the time. Exploring new trails is an adventure in and of itself. I usually find a trail to run and/or a place to fish. Makes for a pretty special day, indeed.

 

[DFR]

I have to agree.

With the death of manners in America, we see the destruction of our trail system by people who can just buy a well prepped off road rig and head up into the hills...all with ZERO training on how to use the equipment and no idea how to act once up there.

As I've aged, I find crowds to be a big nope for me but I think everyone should attend Easter Jeep Safari one time (I've been twice)...all Jeepers should attend Jeep Beach (I live in the area and have supported these guys for more than a decade) and the list goes on. In all of that, I truly hope that people will become members of Tread Lightly and related groups so we can increase education to reduce damage and keep trails open.

In Tennessee, the TWRA (Tennesee Wildlife Resource Agency) is considering some very tough new language and fees to deal with those that abuse the land and our access. I hope that they find balance and the bad guys take a hit and the good guys like us see an improvement.

I will be attending the KOH race in Johnson Valley in about a month...I'm considering just driving the Bronco out instead of trailering my Wide Open Design rock crawler...there'll likely be 150,000 people there and wheelin' will be difficult at best...I know it's a huge crowd but I haven't been since 2011 and need to see it again before I'm too old to bother with it.

As for Tellico...my first wheelin' trip was to Tellico in 1994...in a moderately prepped '89 Ford Ranger...from there I bought my first Jeep and, well, I've spent a large fortune on our hobby...it's a little insane but the smiles are too many to keep track of...

Hell, my and Jon Bundrant's (All Pro Offroad) kids are the last to attend a 4 Wheel and OffRoad Ultimate Adventure. For 2003, the rules were changed to allow 18 and up only. So the memories are many and the good vastly outweigh the bad...and I'll keep doin' it until I just can't.

Cheers to all! Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.

DFR

 

[HighVelocity]

I got into hunting, off-roading, backpacking, etc. to get AWAY from people. The more people I run into in the woods, the less interested I am in doing it.

All these big events just seem like a massive stress inducer.

 

[techdisaster]

I couldn’t agree more. Super Celebration West 2023 will be the last time I wheel with more than 10 rigs, and I will choose trails far away from anyone else. Too slow, and too much YouTuber nonsense made the weekend horribly frustrating.

I love my Cars & Coffee events, but as soon as the trail starts I want small groups of people who I know. Or at least small enough that I can remember your name for a few hours.

 

[DUSTYcazOREGON]

I've been on this forum for a little bit. I've enjoyed chatting with many of you and met a few of you. i've enjoyed all of that. I have been in the offroad world for most of my 52 years in some form or fashion. I have picked up a few things from the smart folks out there. What i have learned is that major offroad events are a great social event. However I believe they are horrible for off highwaying.

I don't mean to offend, so I'd like to explain. I started realizing this in the early 90's when the NC side of Tellico still allowed off highway travel. There used to be an annual run up there called "The Dixie Run". Some of the older crowd may have heard of it. It was a great time. One year "Four Wheeler" magazine came and covered the run. The next year the campgrounds were beyond capacity. The people who'd paid for admission to the event were trying to find a spot to camp and were camping outside "organized" camp spots. The Forrest rangers spent all night trying to deal with people trying to pitch tents, park rigs, trailers and motor homes all over undesignated areas. We got through that part. The next day....and this is the real rub.... we waited 3 hours while 40 vehicles tried to cross the river. This was the first big coffin nail in them closing the tellico trails in my opinion.

I digress. So big events lead to sitting and waiting while people ceaselessly try obstacles over and over. I like uncrowded trails and courtesy in the off highway world, peace and tranquillity. Over the years i noticed crowded trails change me and change the others wheeling. I even try not to ride in a group much bigger than 7. At 8 vehicles I like to split it into two groups of four. The reason is you don't get the long photo line. I like pictures and videos of rides so I can remember the day and the warmth of the sun, or cold of the snow...whatever.

So as we head into the New year, as government tries to close our precious trails. Please take pause and realize a strong community with a strong voice is fantastic. 400 plus vehicles treading a trail back to back for hours is rough on terrain, and gives the "they cause erosion crowd" ammunition. I'm sure I'll be flamed for this and I am fine with that. But as you head to Jeepfest, the Great american crawl, or whatever your local area hosts take pause for a moment and weigh what I've said to see if any of it rings true for you.

Sincerely

,
Renegade

It's the same...or I feel the same way about group motorcycle rides. One or two buddies is the best. The larger group rides or in this discussion, larger off-roading events... you have people from all walks of life with different quirks, different values, but also different skill levels. When those that are not experienced feel intimidated to do what more experienced people are...then things can go wrong and people can also get hurt. Bigger is not always better when it comes to these types of events.

 

[timhood]

I've been on this forum for a little bit. I've enjoyed chatting with many of you and met a few of you. i've enjoyed all of that. I have been in the offroad world for most of my 52 years in some form or fashion. I have picked up a few things from the smart folks out there. What i have learned is that major offroad events are a great social event. However I believe they are horrible for off highwaying.

I don't mean to offend, so I'd like to explain. I started realizing this in the early 90's when the NC side of Tellico still allowed off highway travel. There used to be an annual run up there called "The Dixie Run". Some of the older crowd may have heard of it. It was a great time. One year "Four Wheeler" magazine came and covered the run. The next year the campgrounds were beyond capacity. The people who'd paid for admission to the event were trying to find a spot to camp and were camping outside "organized" camp spots. The Forrest rangers spent all night trying to deal with people trying to pitch tents, park rigs, trailers and motor homes all over undesignated areas. We got through that part. The next day....and this is the real rub.... we waited 3 hours while 40 vehicles tried to cross the river. This was the first big coffin nail in them closing the tellico trails in my opinion.

I digress. So big events lead to sitting and waiting while people ceaselessly try obstacles over and over. I like uncrowded trails and courtesy in the off highway world, peace and tranquillity. Over the years i noticed crowded trails change me and change the others wheeling. I even try not to ride in a group much bigger than 7. At 8 vehicles I like to split it into two groups of four. The reason is you don't get the long photo line. I like pictures and videos of rides so I can remember the day and the warmth of the sun, or cold of the snow...whatever.

So as we head into the New year, as government tries to close our precious trails. Please take pause and realize a strong community with a strong voice is fantastic. 400 plus vehicles treading a trail back to back for hours is rough on terrain, and gives the "they cause erosion crowd" ammunition. I'm sure I'll be flamed for this and I am fine with that. But as you head to Jeepfest, the Great american crawl, or whatever your local area hosts take pause for a moment and weigh what I've said to see if any of it rings true for you.

Sincerely

,
Renegade

I understand this viewpoint. Coincidentally, the only group event I’ve ever been in was the Bronco Off-Roadeo. In fact, 90% of the time, my son and I go solo. Yeah, I know we’re supposed to buddy, but it’s hard finding people who have the time and our day trips wouldn’t get us where we’d be unable to at least call for help.

The appeal of a group run sounds good on paper, but I think I’m with you and would prefer to keep it to a couple of friends.

 

[timhood]

I have to agree.

With the death of manners in America, we see the destruction of our trail system by people who can just buy a well prepped off road rig and head up into the hills...all with ZERO training on how to use the equipment and no idea how to act once up there.

I give @Ford props here for making the Off-Roadeo an automatic perk when buying a Bronco. The trainers make a point to teach and stress the importance of good off-road behavior as well as technique. If the other manufacturers would follow suit, that could go a long way to better educating the community.

 

[Hey Buddy]

This is it exactly! Just because someone can buy a boat/jet ski, does not mean they also understand 'The Rules of the Road' on open water. Ignorance is way more dangerous than ever these days. When they say, "Hey, watch this!" That is always my cue to immediately get at least 10 yards away!
Have fun out there, be safe & remember life is short, but Broncos are cool!

 

[MayhemMike]

As a Sigma male I naturally want nothing to do with most humans. Solitude is how I recharge. Sitting alone in the Arches National park, and seeing no one and hearing nothing is paradise.

 

[Lil Mul]

Agreed. I never got the allure of "getting away from things" with 50 other people...

 

[BAUS67]

For me personally I like AOAA. Have taken my son there to ride ATVs for the last 4/5 years and I can say even though the parking lot is full, once you get on the trails you hardly see a soul, unless you come across a big group. AOAA does not require a big group though. You only need a friend, 2 vehicles is the minimum. There are places there that say minimum recovery area, if you don't think you can make it out, then don't go in. Campsites on premises. Now if we can just get the state to open up the ATV trails (other mine reclamation areas) for some Broncos and Jeeps then we would have more places. 40 years ago there were no trails at all, ATV or vehicle, unless you broke the law. So we have made some progress.

 

[userdude]

When they say, "Hey, watch this!"

It's "Hold my beer" thank you very much. Some idiot one day shouted "Send it!" and then they said "Watch this!" and I said "Eat it!" and then we all said "that'll buff out". But it won't, we were just being nice. Grab me a beer, willya? I'm up next.

 

[BigFootie]

It's the same...or I feel the same way about group motorcycle rides. One or two buddies is the best. The larger group rides or in this discussion, larger off-roading events... you have people from all walks of life with different quirks, different values, but also different skill levels. When those that are not experienced feel intimidated to do what more experienced people are...then things can go wrong and people can also get hurt. Bigger is not always better when it comes to these types of events.

I was going to mention this as well. A few is fun, a festival full is not. It used to scare the crap out of me on the bikes. We have a run here in May and in October. Several thousand motorcycles decend on two little towns for a day. Nobody pays any attention to where they are going.

Sponsored