We're going on a ski trip in California this winter. Caltrans says I need to have tire chains on board. Can anyone suggest some?

[Summit981]

I’ve lived in Reno for 45 years and I’ve never heard of a chain requirement for 4WD vehicles in the Sierras. If you’ve got a 4WD vehicle with snow tires you’re good as long as the road is open. When it gets really bad the requirement is either chains mandatory for 2wd vehicles or 4WD with snow tires. The next step is closure. I don’t know of any all terrain tires that aren’t also rated as snow tires. They also don’t look at you hard is you’re in a 4WD vehicle.

Most, if it not all, A/T tires have the "M+S" (Mud and Snow) symbol. Unfortunately, the tire industry doesn't classify M+S as true snow tires. Only the tires that are branded on the sidewall with the 3-Peak mountain snowflake symbol are earn the title as dedicated winter/snow tires. (Tire Rack will allows anyone to screen for that symbol in their tire buying tool.) So, for example, the General Grabber A/TX has the snow service rating but the General Grabber X3 (A/T) does not.

Sponsored

 

[swooshdave]

" Most people in Colorado know how to drive in the snow and some choose not to, most have proper tires too."

Sorry but I had to laugh at this statement. About 15 years ago we were coming home after visiting family in Montana for Christmas. We had an Expedition with dedicated snow tires since we made winter trips up north and to the CA mountains. In southern Utah on I-15 between the I-15/I-70 junction and St. George Utah the roads were snow covered with ice. We saw dozens of vehicles off the road in the ditches. At least half of them had Colorado plates and most of the rest were Utah. That night at the hotel in St. George we were at the pool with the kids and there were people sitting near us and we could hear them saying they were from Colorado and they were complaining about how bad their fellow Coloradans were driving.

I don’t think he’s talking about the more recent imports from the West.

 

[Tilzbow]

Most, if it not all, A/T tires have the "M+S" (Mud and Snow) symbol. Unfortunately, the tire industry doesn't classify M+S as true snow tires. Only the tires that are branded on the sidewall with the 3-Peak mountain snowflake symbol are earn the title as dedicated winter/snow tires. (Tire Rack will allows anyone to screen for that symbol in their tire buying tool.) So, for example, the General Grabber A/TX has the snow service rating but the General Grabber X3 (A/T) does not.

What the tire industry defines as a snow tire makes no difference, it only matters what CA agencies classify as snow tires.

Caltrans classify snow tires as tires with M+S on the sidewall. A four wheel drive with M+S imprint tires will cover it for the R1 & R2 conditions which are the most common.

https://dot.ca.gov/-/media/dot-medi...ocuments/winter-driving-working-2019-a11y.pdf

 

[2dogcamp]

I’ve lived in Reno for 45 years and I’ve never heard of a chain requirement for 4WD vehicles in the Sierras. If you’ve got a 4WD vehicle with snow tires you’re good as long as the road is open. When it gets really bad the requirement is either chains mandatory for 2wd vehicles or 4WD with snow tires. The next step is closure. I don’t know of any all terrain tires that aren’t also rated as snow tires. They also don’t look at you hard is you’re in a 4WD vehicle.

Agree if you are skiing in the Tahoe area I have never had them check for chains. Southern Cal Big Bear area another story I went thru the Chain check and they want to see the chains- I had a tow chain in a canvas bag so I pulled out the bad gave it a shake and they said proceed got luck on that one.
Chain are sometimes need if you have a steep iced road or driveway.

 

[Summit981]

What the tire industry defines as a snow tire makes no difference, it only matters what CA agencies classify as snow tires.

Caltrans classify snow tires as tires with M+S on the sidewall. A four wheel drive with M+S imprint tires will cover it for the R1 & R2 conditions which are the most common.

https://dot.ca.gov/-/media/dot-medi...ocuments/winter-driving-working-2019-a11y.pdf

Fair enough, got to go with the state regs. Personally, I would exceed the standard and choose the higher performing severe snow rating.

 

[Tilzbow]

Fair enough, got to go with the state regs. Personally, I would exceed the standard and choose the higher performing severe snow rating.

I agree and run 3 Peak rated snow tires on my pickup year round and also carry chains in the winter. I carry chains mostly because I hunt and have gotten into gumbo mud a few times on the way out after driving in on a dry road in the AM but they’re also in the bed when I head into the mountain. Chains are cheap insurance and can get you out of slick situations.

I also won‘t be driving the Bronco on snow days but will instead drive the longer wheel base, heavier truck with the 3 Peak rated tires since that combo has proven to do really good in the snow. I’ve seen too many short wheel base Jeeps with off-road tires spin down the freeway like a top and bounce off the center divider over the years.

That said, my wife runs M+S tires on her Audi Q5, skis Tahoe resorts 15-20 days each year and hasn’t had any problems but she also picks her days since she’s retired.

 

[Summit981]

I agree and run 3 Peak rated snow tires on my pickup year round and also carry chains in the winter. I carry chains mostly because I hunt and have gotten into gumbo mud a few times on the way out after driving in on a dry road in the AM but they’re also in the bed when I head into the mountain. Chains are cheap insurance and can get you out of slick situations.

I also won‘t be driving the Bronco on snow days but will instead drive the longer wheel base, heavier truck with the 3 Peak rated tires since that combo has proven to do really good in the snow. I’ve seen too many short wheel base Jeeps with off-road tires spin down the freeway like a top and bounce off the center divider over the years.

That said, my wife runs M+S tires on her Audi Q5, skis Tahoe resorts 15-20 days each year and hasn’t had any problems but she also picks her days since she’s retired.

What chains would you recommend for the Bronco? (I read the manual and it says only rear tires and then specified the smaller base stock tires. )

 

[Tilzbow]

What chains would you recommend for the Bronco? (I read the manual and it says only rear tires and then specified the smaller base stock tires. )

Sorry I can’t help since I don’t carry chains in my Bronco. I do carry them in my truck which is what I drive when it snows and those are aggressive studded tire chains.

 

[Buddyglock]

If you have 4 wheel drive and A/T or snow tires. you are good to go. I live in the Bay Area and go to Tahoe all the time and I have never used chains in my life.

 

[WheelMe]

If you have 4 wheel drive and A/T or snow tires. you are good to go. I live in the Bay Area and go to Tahoe all the time and I have never used chains in my life.

Have you not ever run into a chain control area where you're supposed to stop and put on chains? I just read up on the CalTrans website, and that appears to be the law:

https://dot.ca.gov/travel/winter-driving-tips/chain-requirements

 

[GloNDark]

I live in the Sierra's and have been thru the chain controls numerous times last winter in Bronco. They never even stop me to ask if I have chains, just wave me thru. Never had an issue with an AWD or 4wd vehicle up here.

 

[Buddyglock]

Have you not ever run into a chain control area where you're supposed to stop and put on chains? I just read up on the CalTrans website, and that appears to be the law:

https://dot.ca.gov/travel/winter-driving-tips/chain-requirements

I have been when the police are stopping cars on the highway. They either just waive you through because they can see your tires, or they stop you and ask if you have 4 wheel drive/ m+s tires. Never had to put chains on. It depends on how bad it is out. I’ve gone around road closures before

 

[Arrowbear Rider]

All of you guys that posted about just rolling through the chain control with a 4WD and the right tires with no problems are 100% correct; if they checked every 4WD for chains too that line would take too long and you'd have a very long traffic backup and wait.

But, if in a situation where you had to have them and you had a problem and then didn't have the chains, you'll get a big ass ticket, I've seen it happen right in front of my home on hwy18 in Arrowbear.

Since the storms in NoCal are bigger, the road is either open or goes to closed very fast, but almost never R3, but in the lower half of the state R3 happens while your up there and in Big Bear it takes hours to clear the traffic when that happens and if you get stuck or are in an accident OR go through a CHP manned check point (not Caltrans manned) you'll get popped.

It's too easy to just buy used chains on Craigslist for cheap and have them as insurance just in case; I got mine for $40 brand new in the box.

 

[WonkyBronky]

All of you guys that posted about just rolling through the chain control with a 4WD and the right tires with no problems are 100% correct; if they checked every 4WD for chains too that line would take too long and you'd have a very long traffic backup and wait.

But, if in a situation where you had to have them and you had a problem and then didn't have the chains, you'll get a big ass ticket, I've seen it happen right in front of my home on hwy18 in Arrowbear.

Since the storms in NoCal are bigger, the road is either open or goes to closed very fast, but almost never R3, but in the lower half of the state R3 happens while your up there and in Big Bear it takes hours to clear the traffic when that happens and if you get stuck or are in an accident OR go through a CHP manned check point (not Caltrans manned) you'll get popped.

It's too easy to just buy used chains on Craigslist for cheap and have them as insurance just in case; I got mine for $40 brand new in the box.

R3 situations are rare, but they do happen. It's great to think they will just wave people through if they're in a spiffy new Bronco with 4WD and beefy tires, but CHP will literally check every single vehicle and turn them around if chains are not installed. If you have them in a box, you pull over on the side of the road with dozens of other vehicles to put them on and get back in line.

Last time we encountered R3 conditions going up to the lake house in Big Bear:

Only a couple inches of snow/ice actually on the road thanks to the plows, but big snow banks to get through.

 

[Arrowbear Rider]

Thanks for the photo and response. I've left work at BBMR with it like in your photo, but Rim of the World and 13 curves were a mess because of all of the flatlanders stuck on the road; some in 4WD/all wheel drive too. Hell, that grade by the slides going into Boulder Bay gets bad too, accidents & stuck cars, and then more accidents.

Sponsored