Sasquatch HOSS 2.0 Coilover Tear-Down - Travel, Spring Length, Bump Stop Info

[Beach_Bum]

In for a penny, in for a pound. Any other requests?

Can you take a picture of the bump stop with a pineapple for scale? (IYKYK)

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[CitrusBronco]

That's a good idea, I can remove the coilover, reattach the UCL and cycle it. I'll take some pics.

This is a good post thanks for sharing.

If you plan to see where the limit of the cv is you should pull the boots down to observe. You maybe in a damage zone before full bind.
It’s my understanding that the cv articulation limits are different depending on the front axle, m110 vs m210 and that’s only observed with the boots out of the way. Not sure how deep a dive you want to get.

A note on the harbor freight spring compressors I used. They work great, they lockup tight, no slipping, no issuing handling the springs while compressed. The fear is overblown, I never felt a bit of appreciation using them.

 

[Beach_Bum]

This is a good post thanks for sharing.

If you plan to see where the limit of the cv is you should pull the boots down to observe. You maybe in a damage zone before full bind.
It’s my understanding that the cv articulation limits are different depending on the front axle, m110 vs m210 and that’s only observed with the boots out of the way. Not sure how deep a dive you want to get.

A note on the harbor freight spring compressors I used. They work great, they lockup tight, no slipping, no issuing handling the springs while compressed. The fear is overblown, I never felt a bit of appreciation using them.

Apprehension is the word you are looking for.

 

[timhood]

So, shouldn't there be at least 1.5” of up-travel that could be used if you could find a coilover with a shorter compressed length? As the Project Farm guy says, Let’s Find Out!

Removal of Coilover

You lost me at spring compression. I have neither the guts to use a cheap compression tool nor the money to justify an expensive one. You have one car fall on you, and you change your attitude about safety around vehicles!

My goal with something like this is, let the other people figure it out and then use what they've learned to have someone else professionally install [parts]. So, DIY would have to beat a formula something like this:

PI = Cost of Professional Installation
T = Cost of Tool
U = Realistic number of uses of tool
D = likelihood of death or dismemberment (0 - 1)

DIY >= PI - (T/U) * (1 + D/0.0001)

 

[Felix808]

Not to pour salt, but you can rent that tool with a refundable deposit at Autozone.
Go slow use caution & use hand tools only & you should be fine

 

[SoCalBronco77]

I pulled the coilover, reattached the UCL, and cycled the suspension a bit below SAS full droop.

I measured from the surface of the coilover mount to the surface of the LCA next to the mounting holes. Crappy pic of the aiming spot:

I drooped the suspension down to a measurement of 24.5". I confirmed that the wheel hub still spun by hand at full lock both directions. The CV boots don't look super happy, though.

The fender to axle distance was 29.52".

At that point, I had about 200 lbs of floor jack and kitty litter hanging off the UCL with a pretty janky ratchet strap, and decided that was as far as i wanted to go tonight while fighting the UCA and LCA bushings.

Here are pics of the CV joint:

Full Right Lock:

Full Left Lock:

Here are a couple of pics of the pin top without the top hat:

Top Hat thickness:

The pin top washer mounting surface is very close to parallel to the spring perch surface. I might be able to get a better measurement if anyone wants it, it's a couple mm, at most.

I'll do the same thing for uptravel tomorrow.

 

[telenerd]

Dont wanna side track converstation. Anyone have any luck using those spring compressors for changing clip height on the Bilstein 6112 shocks? WIthout removing shocks.

 

[BigMeatsBronco]

very cool write up.Thanks for all the effort. And it shows that trimming the bump stop, does in fact increase compression travel. As i've shown before. Where all the naysayers Now?

 

[itwelder]

I pulled the coilover, reattached the UCL, and cycled the suspension a bit below SAS full droop.

I measured from the surface of the coilover mount to the surface of the LCA next to the mounting holes. Crappy pic of the aiming spot:

I drooped the suspension down to a measurement of 24.5". I confirmed that the wheel hub still spun by hand at full lock both directions. The CV boots don't look super happy, though.

The fender to axle distance was 29.52".

At that point, I had about 200 lbs of floor jack and kitty litter hanging off the UCL with a pretty janky ratchet strap, and decided that was as far as i wanted to go tonight while fighting the UCA and LCA bushings.

Here are pics of the CV joint:

Full Right Lock:

Full Left Lock:

Here are a couple of pics of the pin top without the top hat:

Top Hat thickness:

The pin top washer mounting surface is very close to parallel to the spring perch surface. I might be able to get a better measurement if anyone wants it, it's a couple mm, at most.

I'll do the same thing for uptravel tomorrow.

I know it's messy, but if it were me, I would pull that inboard boot and inspect it at full droop and compression. At droop, the rollers are closer to the edge of the housing, increasing the risk of housing failure. At compression, the tripod can hit the back of the housing, plus the shaft can contact the open edge of the housing at a high angle.

 

[SoCalBronco77]

@itwelder Let's do it, what time can you stop by with some grease

 

[SoCalBronco77]

I jacked up the suspension and rotated the hub by hand. Again, I measured from the surface of the coilover mount to the surface of the LCA next to the mounting holes.

At 16.99" mount-to-LCA, the fender-to-axle distance was 16.43". Hub rotated normally.

At 16.85" mount-to-LCA, the fender-to-axle distance was 16.17". I thought I felt a slight increase in effort every 60 deg. or so at full lock, but it could have been my imagination.

I didn't jack it up any more because the UCL was a couple mm from touching the fender liner. It was tough to measure the CV angle, the error is probably +/- 3 deg. Here are a couple pics:

~24 deg. on the diff side.

~28 degrees on the wheel side.

 

[03SVTL]

13" of travel before binding is pretty amazing for a stock 4x4 truck. My 2000 2WD Ranger, at best, got 9.5 metal to metal.

Thanks for the work!

 

[SoCalBronco77]

I put everything back together and got an accurate weight at a local scale. Ford's published weight for a 2dr 2.7 Badlands Sasquatch is 2731 lbs front, 2,140 lbs rear, 4871 lbs total.

Weight at the truck stop with 1/2 tank of gas was 2,640 front, 2280 rear, total 4,920 lbs. Pretty close!

With this, I can calculate the OEM Sasquatch front spring rate.

2,640 front axle / 2 = 1,320 lbs. per corner.

Unsprung Weight:

24 lb wheel
55 lb tire
15 lbs Steering knuckle
24 lbs brake disc
10 lbs brake caliper

Total 128 lbs

1,320 lbs corner weight - 128 lbs unspring weight = 1,192 lbs sprung weight.

The spring free length is 16.75". The spring at ride height has a measured length of 11.1". 16.75-11.1= 5.65” total spring compression at ride height.

Going back to this diagram:

The downward torque applied by the spring on the LCA = the upward torque by the wheel on the LCA

Spring Force X d1 = Sprung Corner Weight X d2

Spring Force = Sprung Corner Weight X d2 / d1

Spring Force = Sprung Corner Weight X (1/Motion Ratio)

Using the measured Motion Ratio of .5855:

Spring Force = 1,192 lbs X 1/.5855 = 2,035.87 lbs

Spring Rate = 2,035.87 lbs / 5.65 ” spring compression at ride height= 360.33 lb/in

Correcting for the angle at ride height of 13 deg.:

Spring Rate = 360.33 lb-in / cos(13) = 369.8 lb/in.

Edit: I didn't take the gas pressure in the coilover into consideration. That sucks, I could have measured it when I had the coilover apart. I am going to estimate 70 lbs, based on how hard I had to push the coilover to make it compress by hand.

Revised calculation of spring rate:

Spring Force + Coilover Force = Sprung Corner Weight X (1/Motion Ratio)

Spring Force + Coilover Force = 1,192 lbs X 1/.5855 = 2,035.87 lbs

Spring Force = 2,035.87 lbs - 70 lbs Coilover Force = 1,965.87 lbs

Spring Rate = 1,965.87 lbs / 5.65 ” spring compression at ride height= 347.94 lb/in

Correcting for the angle at ride height of 13 deg.:

Spring Rate = 347.94 lb-in / cos(13) = 357.09 lb/in.

I think that's my final answer. . .

 

[BLW2000]

Amazing work, and at some risk to person and vehicle - we appreciate this!

 

[itwelder]

I put everything back together and got an accurate weight at a local scale. Ford's published weight for a 2dr 2.7 Badlands Sasquatch is 2731 lbs front, 2,140 lbs rear, 4871 lbs total.

Weight at the truck stop with 1/2 tank of gas was 2,640 front, 2280 rear, total 4,920 lbs. Pretty close!

With this, I can calculate the OEM Sasquatch front spring rate.

2,640 front axle / 2 = 1,320 lbs. per corner.

Unsprung Weight:

24 lb wheel
55 lb tire
15 lbs Steering knuckle
24 lbs brake disc
10 lbs brake caliper

Total 128 lbs

1,320 lbs corner weight - 128 lbs unspring weight = 1,192 lbs sprung weight.

The spring free length is 16.75". The spring at ride height has a measured length of 11.1". 16.75-11.1= 5.65” total spring compression at ride height.

Going back to this diagram:

The downward torque applied by the spring on the LCA = the upward torque by the wheel on the LCA

Spring Force X d1 = Sprung Corner Weight X d2

Spring Force = Sprung Corner Weight X d2 / d1

Spring Force = Sprung Corner Weight X (1/Motion Ratio)

Using the measured Motion Ratio of .5855:

Spring Force = 1,192 lbs X 1/.5855 = 2,035.87 lbs

Spring Rate = 2,035.87 lbs / 5.65 ” spring compression at ride height= 360.33 lb/in

Correcting for the angle at ride height of 13 deg.:

Spring Rate = 360.33 lb-in / cos(13) = 369.8 lb/in.

Edit: I didn't take the gas pressure in the coilover into consideration. That sucks, I could have measured it when I had the coilover apart. I am going to estimate 70 lbs, based on how hard I had to push the coilover to make it compress by hand.

Revised calculation of spring rate:

Spring Force + Coilover Force = Sprung Corner Weight X (1/Motion Ratio)

Spring Force + Coilover Force = 1,192 lbs X 1/.5855 = 2,035.87 lbs

Spring Force = 2,035.87 lbs - 70 lbs Coilover Force = 1,965.87 lbs

Spring Rate = 1,965.87 lbs / 5.65 ” spring compression at ride height= 347.94 lb/in

Correcting for the angle at ride height of 13 deg.:

Spring Rate = 347.94 lb-in / cos(13) = 357.09 lb/in.

I think that's my final answer. . .

Gas pressure in the shock has almost zero effect on spring rate and is just a static force, so can just be subtracted from sprung weight.

But aside from that, something doesn't sound right. You have 9.7" of up travel at the wheel (5.65 spring / MR)? That means the wheel rate is only ~115 lb/in which is really low.

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