Article: What Can the 2021 Ford Bronco Learn from the Toyota FJ Cruiser?

[Jake_zx2]

Long heavy doors, cramped back seat with driveshaft tunnel dividing it, long hood with poor visibility. They are even using torque thrust styled wheels on some editions

This describes pretty much ANY 4 seater coupe in the current market. NONE of this makes the car retro. The car has a retro-ish dash, and that's about it. Not a single other thing on the car is retro whatsoever.

ONE version of the car has "torque thrust style wheels", and that car is a desperate attempt to add some retro ques to an otherwise not retro car

What do you mean? All of those cars have retro inspired designs. Like I said, not like a duplicate but yes all are very inspired by their past. Otherwise they'ed just name them something totally different.

I think you miss read my last statement about the 04 Bronco concept. I don't think that's a good idea either and wouldn't sell. However, taking some styling from it like the concept on this site is a great idea and I have no problem with that.

No, they do not. They are all completely modern cars. They have MINOR design cues that harken back to the originals for the SOLE purpose of "keeping a Mustang a Mustang", per se, but they're not completely (or even partially) modeled after the classic cars, and are therefore not a retro design.

The S550 is no more "retro" than the SN95. The SN95 had tribar taillights, a pony logo, a long hood and short deck, etc. yet that car was IN NO WAY retro

Sponsored

 

[BroncoRevital]

No, they do not. They are all completely modern cars. They have MINOR design cues that harken back to the originals for the SOLE purpose of "keeping a Mustang a Mustang", per se, but they're not completely (or even partially) modeled after the classic cars, and are therefore not a retro design.

The S550 is no more "retro" than the SN95. The SN95 had tribar taillights, a pony logo, a long hood and short deck, etc. yet that car was IN NO WAY retro

Ok we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this as we are arguing slight semantics at this point. You're contradicting yourself as you admit there are minor cues and that the old ones were MORE retro then they are now. Meaning they're are still aspects of them being retro.

The thing is that retro is still a thing it's just not as prevalent as the retro wave peaked over 10 years ago. So again I get what your're saying. All the "retro" vehicles are becoming much more sleek and less retro. Even the first 05 mustang according to your logic wouldn't be very retro to you.

 

[Jake_zx2]

Ok we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this as we are arguing slight semantics at this point. You're contradicting yourself as you admit there are minor cues and that the old ones were MORE retro then they are now. Meaning they're are still aspects of them being retro.

The thing is that retro is still a thing it's just not as prevalent as the retro wave peaked over 10 years ago. So again I get what your're saying. All the "retro" vehicles are becoming much more sleek and less retro. Even the first 05 mustang according to your logic wouldn't be very retro to you.

No, retro styling is very much NOT in style. We aren't talking about little cues for a head nod to the classic, we're talking about A RETRO-BASED design, as in something that is completely made to look like an old car. The S197 was designed with the philosophy of making it look as much like the classic as possible. Same goes for the SSR, the HHR, the 04 Bronco Concept, the prowler, and last but CERTAINLY not least, the god damn PT cruiser.

These are all cars that were based off retro design language. The basis for how those cars should look was based off cars of old. This was absolutely NOT the philosophy with designing the S550. The goal was to make it look modern and somewhat European, while making sure not to make it a whole new car by keeping cues that were maintained throughout most of the life of the car (not JUST the classics) like the tribar taillights, the long-hood-short-deck, and the logo of the car.

 

[Jake_zx2]

Again, if you really think retro is still in style, try to find out how many people would buy the 04 Bronco if it were a 2020 car. That is a retro-styled car, and it's ugly as sin. It was cool when it first debuted (hint: Because that was when retro was in style), but as time has passed, people want modern, not retro. The modern Camaro and Mustang are essentially so by a name alone

 

[Stampede.Offroad]

...04 Bronco if it were a 2020 car. That is a retro-styled car, and it's ugly as sin. ...

I would call that thing futuristic more than retro. It had very sleek stylized lines. The kind of thing someone from the 90's would have called the SUV of the future.

But I'll agree with you that it was ugly.

 

[OX1]

Again, if you really think retro is still in style, try to find out how many people would buy the 04 Bronco if it were a 2020 car. That is a retro-styled car, and it's ugly as sin. It was cool when it first debuted (hint: Because that was when retro was in style), but as time has passed, people want modern, not retro. The modern Camaro and Mustang are essentially so by a name alone

You might be right overall, but there is a reason EB's are getting $150K and more for high end restorations.
Yes, the 04 is not what I would put out today, but it better have heavy styling cues from the EB's and certainly not look closer to "something else", vs an EB.

If not, Ford will have screwed the pooch not cashing in on this craze, at least initially.

https://www.hagerty.com/articles-vi.../02/25-hottest-collector-vehicles-spring-2019

 

[TeocaliMG]

I dont know what you guys are on about but the S550 Mustang is the embodiment of a modern take on a classic design. If you don't see retro in that then you probably cant be satisfied by anything.

 

[Jake_zx2]

You might be right overall, but there is a reason EB's are getting $150K and more for high end restorations.
Yes, the 04 is not what I would put out today, but it better have heavy styling cues from the EB's and certainly not look closer to "something else", vs an EB.

If not, Ford will have screwed the pooch not cashing in on this craze, at least initially.

https://www.hagerty.com/articles-vi.../02/25-hottest-collector-vehicles-spring-2019

People who want a classic car will buy a classic car and will pay for it. People who want a new car (or are waiting for a specific new car) don't want an old car, they want a new car.

I'd be pissed if I waited all this time for something that looks like a 68 Bronco, has power steering as an upgrade, has a 3 speed trans, and gets 6MPG

 

[BroncoRevital]

Again, if you really think retro is still in style, try to find out how many people would buy the 04 Bronco if it were a 2020 car. That is a retro-styled car, and it's ugly as sin. It was cool when it first debuted (hint: Because that was when retro was in style), but as time has passed, people want modern, not retro. The modern Camaro and Mustang are essentially so by a name alone

The 04 Bronco was a concept vehicle. Concept vehicles are basically to have fun with and experiment with. They aren't designed with intent to actually sell as they are. It did what it was intended to do.

The modern Camero is so retro and throw back its comical you could say otherwise. It's a modern take on the 69 Camero. If you can't see that you need better glasses or just don't understand what retro is.

People who want a classic car will buy a classic car and will pay for it. People who want a new car (or are waiting for a specific new car) don't want an old car, they want a new car.

I'd be pissed if I waited all this time for something that looks like a 68 Bronco, has power steering as an upgrade, has a 3 speed trans, and gets 6MPG

What!?

Judging by this statement, you do not know what retro is.

Do you not like the rendering on this site? That is retro. Would you rather it look like a Ranger front end with a camper top? It's fine if you do that is accentually what the FB was in relation to the F150. I'm sorry Im just having a really hard time understanding what it is you'd like to see the Bronco look like.

 

[Jake_zx2]

Personally I would be quite happy to buy a first gen Bronco brand new today. I might actually be able afford one again.

I'd be happy with an old bronco if I were in the market for one. However, I'm not... I'm in the market for something that I can comfortably drive daily, get decent gas mileage in, haul the kids in, and tow the car with

As far a the "retro" debate goes, I am not much of a fan of the modern so-called retro designs that came about in the 2000s. None of them look nearly as good or as genuine as the originals they are trying to emulate. They look like obese out of shape versions of their former selves.

Now on the other hand, I certainly appreciate classic design cues. I think it is important for new vehicles to be instantly recognizable as being a Mustang, Bronco, Camaro, Challenger, Wrangler, et al, but they shouldn't try too hard to look like something they are not and can't pull off anyways with modern aerodynamics, pedestrian safety requirements, etc.

Agree with ALL of this. I appreciate subtle head nods to the cars that preceded it, like the Mustang having tri-bar taillights (yet in no way a ripoff of a previous design). I DON'T like retro-based styling. There's a massive difference between the 2, and I think that's what a lot of people here aren't understanding. Having design cues as a head nod to previous generations does NOT make a car "retro"... otherwise, the BMW X7 would be considered "retro"

 

[Jake_zx2]

Do you not like the rendering on this site? That is retro.

It is indeed retro, and I've actually never been a fan of that rendering and would prefer that Ford take a different route with their design. I don't think that rendering looks good at all, I think it looks like it's trying too hard to be something it's not (retro design in a nutshell). I feel like maybe some more squared off headlights could help it look a bit better, but likely wouldn't be a pure fix to the ugly.

What they should be doing is what the Bronco was for the majority of it's life... a modern design based off what the current generation F150 looks like with a more squared off body and removable top.

It's funny to me that people are always stuck on having new cars look like the old ones... Yes, the cars of the 60s looked great, but they didn't get that way by pretending to look like a car from the 20s

 

[Nickp]

What they should be doing is what the Bronco was for the majority of it's life... a modern design based off what the current generation F150 looks like with a more squared off body and removable top.

Nobody wants this. At all. The F-150 Bronco based renders look ugly as fuck.

IMO I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again. The Bronco is going to be Fords take on a JL Wrangler with a few Ford touches, and bronco styling like the mustang. And it’s going to be perfect.

 

[BroncoMike]

Take the '66-'77 body style and frame, add a modern power/drivetrain and suspension, safety equipment, electronics and comforts. It could get 26+mpg, be quiet and comfy at 75 on the highway, and do very well off-road. There are companies doing this and making a fortune, and they can't integrate modern technology to the degree Ford could. It obviously isn't the right aesthetic for everyone, but after owning over a half-dozen early Broncos, I find it difficult to complain about the form or function of the original body style and have become quite fond of it.

If it DOES NOT have "retro styling" - or very heavy "vintage cues" (we can argue the semantics of the terminology all day long), there would be little reason to choose a new Bronco over the well-proven Wrangler platform, particularly if the Jeep holds an edge in off-road performance as is becoming increasingly suspect.

 

[OX1]

People who want a classic car will buy a classic car and will pay for it. People who want a new car (or are waiting for a specific new car) don't want an old car, they want a new car.

I'd be pissed if I waited all this time for something that looks like a 68 Bronco, has power steering as an upgrade, has a 3 speed trans, and gets 6MPG

And they will pay a lot more for one that has a certain look. And that TOP look right now is a classic bronco.

Bringing up all that other stuff has nothing to do with what I said, which was styling cues.

, particularly if the Jeep holds an edge in off-road performance as is becoming increasingly suspect.

Agree totally, and I will take it one step further. Jeep already holds a signifcant advantage
offroading with the way it's body is set up. Ford has to make the body configuration
as good as or better than an early bronco to have any inroads on the offroad image
(which sells a lot of rigs, even if you never offroad)

What they should be doing is what the Bronco was for the majority of it's life... a modern design based off what the current generation F150 looks like with a more squared off body and removable top.

If that idea was so great, they never would have stopped production. Didn't sell in 96, won't sell now either.

 

[BroncoRevital]

It is indeed retro, and I've actually never been a fan of that rendering and would prefer that Ford take a different route with their design. I don't think that rendering looks good at all, I think it looks like it's trying too hard to be something it's not (retro design in a nutshell). I feel like maybe some more squared off headlights could help it look a bit better, but likely wouldn't be a pure fix to the ugly.

What they should be doing is what the Bronco was for the majority of it's life... a modern design based off what the current generation F150 looks like with a more squared off body and removable top.

It's funny to me that people are always stuck on having new cars look like the old ones... Yes, the cars of the 60s looked great, but they didn't get that way by pretending to look like a car from the 20s

Ok I’m understanding you better. Though I can’t agree on the basing it off the F150 as a good idea. That look is decent with the F150 but wouldn’t look good to me transferring to a Bronco. It needs to be its own unique vehicle and I’d much rather have it more Jeepish if you will.
I wouldn’t mind a full size Raptor looking Bronco that was more made for trails. The front end of the Raptor now is very sexy. Or even that look transferring to a smaller mid size Bronco we know we are getting.

Sponsored