Black Diamond axles same as Badlands and Sasquatch? How is 4.46 gears for Base + 35's ?

Garemlin

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Description for "Advanced 4x4 with Automatic On-Demand Engagement" on the Ford B&P


So are you telling me the 4A transfer case can only lock the front axle in 4A, but can't be controlled via hero switch?
The Advance 4x4 doesn't really lock anything. It sends power to the front wheels when it is needed in slick and slippery conditions.
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I think you will be fine. Keep in mind no one can definitively answer this until the Bronco's are out and wheeled for a couple of years to truly understand the limitations / weak points.

Gearing you are a little off what appears to be the "sweet spot" in the gearing ratio from stock and you will notice a little bit of less power but after a month of driving it will be the new normal. Basically same boat the guys going from stock 35" tires to 37's which would be better off with 5:13's if you follow the gearing tools.

Off-roading the M190 or Dana 35 is stronger then the non-Rubicon Jeep (D30 vs D44 on Rubi's) and there are thousands of those on the trails with 35" tires. Dana calls the new axle an AdvanTek and the model is the ring gear diameter in MM. As someone else posted what is your use case? Rock racing you are in trouble...overlanding, moderate rock crawling, etc. you will be fine if you manage the skinny pedal. Keep in mind your front axle is the same size as the base sport and sahara REAR axle! I wish this chart would include the common names also like D35 (M190) and D44 (M210), etc.

Spicer Dana Axle chart.png
 
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So are you telling me the 4A transfer case can only lock the front axle in 4A, but can't be controlled via hero switch?
It locks the front and rear axles together. It does not lock the left and right side of each axle together, that's what the "lockers" do.

The Advance 4x4 doesn't really lock anything. It sends power to the front wheels when it is needed in slick and slippery conditions.
In 4A mode the transfer case modulates a clutch to move power forward or backward where it's needed. In 4H mode, the clutch is just held at 100% clamping force, effectively locking the front and rear axles together. You wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the standard transfer case and the 4A transfer case when driving in 4H.

The Badlands, WT, and Squatch automatically get the 4A transfer case, so you can't argue that it's the less capable version.
 

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Does the black diamond with the 4A transfer case still have the 190 up front? thought all front lockers were 210s
No, Advanced 4x4 does NOT add the 210 front axel. You can only get this axel on Black Diamond with Sasquatch package.
 

kodiakisland

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Ford lets you have 37's with 4.10's on the Raptor F-150. You'll be fine.
Gears on one vehicle do not equate to proper gears on another vehicle, unless they use the same engine, transmission, weigh the same, etc.

Put the 2.3 in the Raptor and then see how much fun those 4.10s are in it.
 

noliveaxle

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Description for "Advanced 4x4 with Automatic On-Demand Engagement" on the Ford B&P


So are you telling me the 4A transfer case can only lock the front axle in 4A, but can't be controlled via hero switch?
Yes electronic control from the transfer case to both axles. It turns on and off front axle as needed for traction. It does not say lockers. That’s how I read and understand this. Btw, I’m more of a math guy and could be mistaken.
 

Spooled

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Gears on one vehicle do not equate to proper gears on another vehicle, unless they use the same engine, transmission, weigh the same, etc.

Put the 2.3 in the Raptor and then see how much fun those 4.10s are in it.
The point I was trying to make was that an OEM isn't going to give you an ineffective effective gear ratio from the factory.

Moving from the stock size tires on the Base to say some 315/70/17's with 4.46's gives you an effective gear ratio of 3.90

The Raptor with the 37 package gives you an effective ratio of 3.86

3.90
is fine for anything modern and the 2.3 will be fine.

Again, not apples to apples (not intended to be), but there are JL's running around just fine with 35's with factory 3.73's with the 2.0 turbo.
 

5280Bronco

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I think you will be fine. Keep in mind no one can definitively answer this until the Bronco's are out and wheeled for a couple of years to truly understand the limitations / weak points.

Gearing you are a little off what appears to be the "sweet spot" in the gearing ratio from stock and you will notice a little bit of less power but after a month of driving it will be the new normal. Basically same boat the guys going from stock 35" tires to 37's which would be better off with 5:13's if you follow the gearing tools.

Off-roading the M190 or Dana 35 is stronger then the non-Rubicon Jeep (D30 vs D44 on Rubi's) and there are thousands of those on the trails with 35" tires. Dana calls the new axle an AdvanTek and the model is the ring gear diameter in MM. As someone else posted what is your use case? Rock racing you are in trouble...overlanding, moderate rock crawling, etc. you will be fine if you manage the skinny pedal. Keep in mind your front axle is the same size as the base sport and sahara REAR axle! I wish this chart would include the common names also like D35 (M190) and D44 (M210), etc.

Spicer Dana Axle chart.png
Great information! Thanks for sharing.
 

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with all that said in this thread, will Ford provide a different gear ratio for the manual transmission sasquatch's? or keep the same gearing?
 

Spooled

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with all that said in this thread, will Ford provide a different gear ratio for the manual transmission sasquatch's? or keep the same gearing?
They definitely can if they want to! They have other ratios ready to go..
Screenshot 2021-10-06 110735.jpg
 

kodiakisland

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The point I was trying to make was that an OEM isn't going to give you an ineffective effective gear ratio from the factory.

Moving from the stock size tires on the Base to say some 315/70/17's with 4.46's gives you an effective gear ratio of 3.90

The Raptor with the 37 package gives you an effective ratio of 3.86

3.90
is fine for anything modern and the 2.3 will be fine.

Again, not apples to apples (not intended to be), but there are JL's running around just fine with 35's with factory 3.73's with the 2.0 turbo.

Just fine is fairly subjective. Some people are content with slow vehicles that take forever to get going and are basically dogs. Others aren't. Final drive ratios aren't any more comparable across different vehicles than the actual gears. I've got engines that do amazing work at 1800rpm and others that are bogged down at anything under 2500rpm. Those engines need different ratios and are not comparable.

If you want to say the current ratio is fine based on the RPM of the engine, etc., I'm good with that. It just makes little sense to say it's fine because of what's in a completely different vehicle.
And as far as the Jeep people, just because they do it doesn't mean they should.

In the end though, the only one who has to be happy with the gears is the owner. Some will put 37s on a base and be completely happy with their performance.
 
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dgorsett

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Hero switches don't control 4x. They are for lockers, disco, tta and hazards. That description you posted poorly used the word locked when describing the four wheel drive system and reads like it was meant to describe 4L and 4H provide continuous "locked" power to both axles while 4A provides "as needed" power to the front.
This... and to clarify 4 wd (4A, 4H or 4L) in the quote locks power to both AXLES (when needed in 4A) but not both WHEELS on an axle. Lockers (HERO switches) do that and only Badlands and Sas get that in front.
 

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We're interchanging "axle" and "differential" a lot here. The M190 and M210s are "differentials". The "axles" on a Jeep would be the splined bars spinning within the axle tubes between the differential and the hubs. On the Bronco, being IFS and technically "half shafts", they're in open air and connected by joints at the differential and hubs. You get the upgraded M210 differential with the Badlands, Wildtrak and anything equipped with Sasquatch. The actual axles, may or may not different part numbers between the two differential options. I do believe I recall seeing heavy duty axles listed in the Ford accessories tho.
 
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If you look up the part numbers for the front 210 differentials, they require the upgraded half shafts and front driveshaft.

I'm looking to add 5.13 gears to my BD.
Nothing is available as of yet
 

TRMFAM

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If you look up the part numbers for the front 210 differentials, they require the upgraded half shafts and front driveshaft.

I'm looking to add 5.13 gears to my BD.
Nothing is available as of yet
You might check with a parts retailer about ordering Spicer gears for the 210. I remember seeing a part number on Spicer's site for the gears. Ford is just reselling the Spicer gears...
 
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