Bronco recall math

[userdude]

I have the Mid Package.
That difference must be why I have no recall notices.

I hope you and your wife get your 2 door HE very soon. You will enjoy it. It's a very fun ride and it gets lots of compliments. A few people even thought I did a resto-mod and lift to a 1st Gen Bronco. When I tell them it's a 2024, they are shocked to see a new 2 door truck. Last month, a guy asked me why auto makers stopped selling 2 door vehicles and push the 4 doors so hard? -- he was especially missing 2 door pickup trucks. I had no answer for him, but told him my Old Gray Horse is a lot of fun and I'm glad I got one.

Good luck with your purchase.

If you have a non-Sas or a Sas made after mid-July(ish) 2024 (key here are the yellow Bilsteins), you wouldn't have the shock recall, since Ford fixed it on the assembly line around then. I think the rear camera issue is related to 360, which you wouldn't have with the mid package.

So in effect, Ford is being bit by the bling bling here. Simpler = more potential for sale. Hmm...

Sponsored

 

[Imaginary Friend]

Last month, a guy asked me why auto makers stopped selling 2 door vehicles and push the 4 doors so hard? -- he was especially missing 2 door pickup trucks.

It's sad, and all about profit. My '19 F150 RCSB 4X4 may be the last pickup I buy new. I refuse to buy a 4-door as I have no need for more than two seats or the additional size.

A 2-door Maverick the same overall length as current with a 6' bed and room behind the seats would be killer.

 

[Sparkie]

If you have a non-Sas or a Sas made after mid-July(ish) 2024 (key here are the yellow Bilsteins), you wouldn't have the shock recall, since Ford fixed it on the assembly line around then. I think the rear camera issue is related to 360, which you wouldn't have with the mid package.

Ah ha!
That explains why I don't have those recalls on my Bronco.
Thank you @userdude.

My build was late November 2024 with the Mid Package which does not have the 360 cameras.
Ironically, I wanted the 360 cameras. When ordering my build on the website, I tried to add the 360 cameras, but that forced an upgrade to the Lux Package and another $7k. It was NOT the $7k that killed the upgrade -- it was the Lux Package forcing me into an automatic tranny and THAT's what killed it.

 

[userdude]

Ah ha!
That explains why I don't have those recalls on my Bronco.
Thank you @userdude.

My build was late November 2024 with the Mid Package which does not have the 360 cameras.
Ironically, I wanted the 360 cameras. When ordering my build on the website, I tried to add the 360 cameras, but that forced an upgrade to the Lux Package and another $7k. It was NOT the $7k that killed the upgrade -- it was the Lux Package forcing me into an automatic tranny and THAT's what killed it.

Manual... saves the day! lol

 

[Sparkie]

It's sad, and all about profit. My '19 F150 RCSB 4X4 may be the last pickup I buy new. I refuse to buy a 4-door as I have no need for more than two seats or the additional size.

A 2-door Maverick the same overall length as current with a 6' bed and room behind the seats would be killer.

So true!!
A 2-door Maverick would be a competition killer for Ford.

Sadly, it seems everyone at FoMoCo has no memory of the very successful and popular Ford Ranger pickups from the 1990s or even its old school predecessor, the Ford Courier from the 1970s. Back then, Ford's profits were dropping and they needed to get help from Mazda to get profitable. I'm just waiting for history to repeat itself.

 

[Sparkie]

Manual... saves the day! lol

LOL
For a decade I told my friends and family that I would buy an EV before I buy an ICE with automatic tranny.
(To be honest, I already put my money on it earlier this month, but delivery is a few years away.)

 

[Roach]

How about...

Price=2024(recall(camera+shocks)-employee.pricing)/solution.est

Neater and more efficient.
[/QUOTE]

Concur!

Roach

 

[BroncoChallenger]

So true!!
A 2-door Maverick would be a competition killer for Ford.

Sadly, it seems everyone at FoMoCo has no memory of the very successful and popular Ford Ranger pickups from the 1990s or even its old school predecessor, the Ford Courier from the 1970s. Back then, Ford's profits were dropping and they needed to get help from Mazda to get profitable. I'm just waiting for history to repeat itself.

The issue is economy of scale. The simple reality is that 4-door models in the US sell MUCH better than 2-door models, of any vehicle, but in particular when it comes to SUVs and trucks. I don't have the numbers, but just looking at vehicles on the road...most are Crew Cabs. Even work trucks are crew cabs, because the guys using them can put sensitive or expensive equipment in the cab and lock it up instead of in the box where it could be stolen or fall out.

Is part of it OEMs pushing people toward one combination over others? Oh sure, I have no doubt. Henry himself said 'you can have any color Model T you want as long as it's black.' It's about profit.

But it is also about people with families who want/need a truck that can haul at least a couple kids. You just can't do that in a regular cab. So the take rate on regular cab trucks of any size has dropped off considerably, to the point where OEMs, at least in the US, can't justify the cost of the tooling to stamp the bodies. A SIMPLE stamping tool can cost upwards of $1mil, and the more complex the more the cost goes up. You have to break that cost up over however many vehicles you make, and more vehicles means you pay it off faster (or your cost per vehicle is lower).

Look at it this way: If you make 100k trucks a year, and 90% are crew cab and 10% are regular cab (we will ignore extended cabs for this exercise), and your cab tooling for each cost $1mil, and you want to maximize your profits for each...that tool for a crew cab adds a little over $11/vehicle, while that regular cab tool adds $100/vehicle. So right off that regular cab is cutting WAY into your profit margin...OR you have to use up profit on your crew cabs to offset the costs on the regular cab. See where this is going? Why have a second tool you're barely using (comparatively), when you could save yourself $1mil right off the get go by just...not offering that option? So yes, OEMs are going to push people toward what makes them money. In this case, they make more off crew cabs.

Sorry, got a little rambly there. The point is, with economy of scale and families being the primary buyers of vehicles, 2 doors are a niche market that is only going to be catered to occasionally.

 

[userdude]

The issue is economy of scale. The simple reality is that 4-door models in the US sell MUCH better than 2-door models, of any vehicle, but in particular when it comes to SUVs and trucks. I don't have the numbers, but just looking at vehicles on the road...most are Crew Cabs. Even work trucks are crew cabs, because the guys using them can put sensitive or expensive equipment in the cab and lock it up instead of in the box where it could be stolen or fall out.

Is part of it OEMs pushing people toward one combination over others? Oh sure, I have no doubt. Henry himself said 'you can have any color Model T you want as long as it's black.' It's about profit.

But it is also about people with families who want/need a truck that can haul at least a couple kids. You just can't do that in a regular cab. So the take rate on regular cab trucks of any size has dropped off considerably, to the point where OEMs, at least in the US, can't justify the cost of the tooling to stamp the bodies. A SIMPLE stamping tool can cost upwards of $1mil, and the more complex the more the cost goes up. You have to break that cost up over however many vehicles you make, and more vehicles means you pay it off faster (or your cost per vehicle is lower).

Look at it this way: If you make 100k trucks a year, and 90% are crew cab and 10% are regular cab (we will ignore extended cabs for this exercise), and your cab tooling for each cost $1mil, and you want to maximize your profits for each...that tool for a crew cab adds a little over $11/vehicle, while that regular cab tool adds $100/vehicle. So right off that regular cab is cutting WAY into your profit margin...OR you have to use up profit on your crew cabs to offset the costs on the regular cab. See where this is going? Why have a second tool you're barely using (comparatively), when you could save yourself $1mil right off the get go by just...not offering that option? So yes, OEMs are going to push people toward what makes them money. In this case, they make more off crew cabs.

Sorry, got a little rambly there. The point is, with economy of scale and families being the primary buyers of vehicles, 2 doors are a niche market that is only going to be catered to occasionally.

The best selling chariots are single-standing cuz the internetz photo tab says that's true. Ipso facto, any other models are virtually extinct because aureusteses are limited and everyone knows you only need one standing person in a chariot. I mean, c'mon!

 

[BroncoChallenger]

The best selling chariots are single-standing cuz the internetz photo tab says that's true. Ipso facto, any other models are virtually extinct because aureusteses are limited and everyone knows you only need one standing person in a chariot. I mean, c'mon!

...I'm not sure what your point is? Everything I stated is pretty easily verifiable. Corporations are in business to make money, if they could do it without ever building anything, they would. Why do you think they drop models (or entire businesses) that don't make money?

I mean it's pretty straightforward, and maybe in the future it will change. But the trend has been for a long time that society is gravitating toward more doors in their vehicles, and that 2-doors are a niche market. Is it something I want to see? No, I love my old F-bodies and Mustangs and muscle cars, they're what got me into vehicles and engineering. I loved the old F150 Lightning, and wish the Chevy 454SS had been executed better. I think a high-horsepower, regular cab short box truck would be a BLAST to drive. But for the vast majority of people, they need a vehicle that will haul their family/more people/more stuff, and more doors is their answer. With that being the higher sellers, and tooling being expensive, there's got to be a pretty good business case to make a 2-door version of just about any vehicle.

Look at manual transmissions in full-size trucks - they're practically non-existant in the US, for several reasons. One, OEMs didn't want to spend money developing them to handle higher outputs (toward the end, engines were actually de-rated if coupled to a manual). Two, they were reaching the maximum number of gears they could put in them given the space constraints they had (again, with the development budget they had as well). Three, there has been a general push to make vehicles as user-friendly as possible, which has included things like power steering, power windows/locks, and automatic transmissions. These reasons and others combined to push the take rate for manuals in full-size trucks down to near zero, and once that happened they were discontinued. Frankly I'm surprised the Bronco was even offered with one. I wish one was available with the V6 because it would be even MORE fun to drive, but sadly it isn't.

This is what happens when car companies get taken over by finance people - the focus shifts to how to make more money off more people. The answer becomes 'make the vehicle as widely popular as possible,' which often pushes actual car enthusiasts to the side, with very few exceptions. Do I like it? Absolutely not. Is there much I can do about it? No, I really have to just take what bones are thrown to us, because it's just not feasible to start my own car company.

 

[ChrisB351]

2022 black diamond non sas here. Only recall Ive had was the windshield and that was handled same day it arrived at the dealer the day before I picked it up.

 

[Imaginary Friend]

...I'm not sure what your point is? Everything I stated is pretty easily verifiable. Corporations are in business to make money, if they could do it without ever building anything, they would. Why do you think they drop models (or entire businesses) that don't make money?

I mean it's pretty straightforward, and maybe in the future it will change. But the trend has been for a long time that society is gravitating toward more doors in their vehicles, and that 2-doors are a niche market. Is it something I want to see? No, I love my old F-bodies and Mustangs and muscle cars, they're what got me into vehicles and engineering. I loved the old F150 Lightning, and wish the Chevy 454SS had been executed better. I think a high-horsepower, regular cab short box truck would be a BLAST to drive. But for the vast majority of people, they need a vehicle that will haul their family/more people/more stuff, and more doors is their answer. With that being the higher sellers, and tooling being expensive, there's got to be a pretty good business case to make a 2-door version of just about any vehicle.

Look at manual transmissions in full-size trucks - they're practically non-existant in the US, for several reasons. One, OEMs didn't want to spend money developing them to handle higher outputs (toward the end, engines were actually de-rated if coupled to a manual). Two, they were reaching the maximum number of gears they could put in them given the space constraints they had (again, with the development budget they had as well). Three, there has been a general push to make vehicles as user-friendly as possible, which has included things like power steering, power windows/locks, and automatic transmissions. These reasons and others combined to push the take rate for manuals in full-size trucks down to near zero, and once that happened they were discontinued. Frankly I'm surprised the Bronco was even offered with one. I wish one was available with the V6 because it would be even MORE fun to drive, but sadly it isn't.

This is what happens when car companies get taken over by finance people - the focus shifts to how to make more money off more people. The answer becomes 'make the vehicle as widely popular as possible,' which often pushes actual car enthusiasts to the side, with very few exceptions. Do I like it? Absolutely not. Is there much I can do about it? No, I really have to just take what bones are thrown to us, because it's just not feasible to start my own car company.

Oh, I get it. Doesn't mean I'll accept it.

Unfortunately, guys like me will go elsewhere to buy their 2-door pickups. Looking at you, Japan. At least Ford is still building F150 SuperCabs (for now), but they're pushing it in size for me too. Ranger is 4-door or nothing now, so zero interest there.

I actually wanted to buy a Bronco to extend the service life of my current F150 RCSB as long as possible. But at the time (early '23) Ford still didn't have their shit together, so I ordered up my '23 2-door Rubi instead.

Anyway, back to recall math.

Sponsored