Locker failure question

[5GENIDN]

The stock frame horns bend so much with the slightest force. Reinforcement is definitely needed.

That is because the stock frame horns are part of the government mandated crush zone.... That would be why I mounted my winch behind those frame horns.

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[SierraBronco]

That is because the stock frame horns are part of the government mandated crush zone.... That would be why I mounted my winch behind those frame horns.

Easy there on the crush zones. People aren’t gonna misinterpret our relationship

 

[Q1svt]

The stock frame horns bend so much with the slightest force. Reinforcement is definitely needed.

… it’s more than that
These are DV8 people same as bumper. Their design removes the horse shoe backing that ford used to hold there basic bumpers. Then turned the bolts 180* through the horn flange, into six clip-on nuts…

I try not to post off topic, the OP did post the Matt’s recovery video… and

 

[Brian_B]

Speed nuts can

These are DV8 people same as bumper. Their design removes the horse shoe backing that ford used to hold there basic bumpers. Then turned the bolts 180* through the horn flange, into six clip-on nuts…

Wow, that is true. From DV8.
https://dv8offroad.com/cdn/shop/files/FBFR-01_Install_Guide_Final.pdf?v=7985255945467945863

They want you to run a winch using speed nuts to bolt it to the frame.

Now, that doesn't have anything to do with the frame horns really - other than they don't use any reinforcement on there, like most of the other aftermarket bumpers. But I've never seen one actually try to use speed nuts and then tell you you can winch from it. I guess it has a Red R on it so that makes it ok. Maybe they are using special high-strength speed nuts and not just something zinc-plated from the Ace Hardware bin... but I kinda doubt it.

 

[SierraBronco]

Speed nuts can

Wow, that is true. From DV8.
https://dv8offroad.com/cdn/shop/files/FBFR-01_Install_Guide_Final.pdf?v=7985255945467945863

They want you to run a winch using speed nuts to bolt it to the frame.

Now, that doesn't have anything to do with the frame horns really - other than they don't use any reinforcement on there, like most of the other aftermarket bumpers. But I've never seen one actually try to use speed nuts and then tell you you can winch from it. I guess it has a Red R on it so that makes it ok. Maybe they are using special high-strength speed nuts and not just something zinc-plated from the Ace Hardware bin... but I kinda doubt it.

As long as they use the right loctite the strength of the fasteners is irrelevant. Doing things the easy way is the right way, every of the way. All the way.

 

[crenca]

- other than they don't use any reinforcement on there, like most of the other aftermarket bumpers. But I've never seen one actually try to use speed nuts and then tell you you can winch from it. I guess it has a Red R on it so that makes it ok.

Check out:

https://dv8offroad.com/pages/about-us

This is the company. It is basically a small number of web/CAD/computer geeks who "design" off road "products" on a computer screen (which are then made in China, Mexico, etc. by the cheapest bidder I assume). There is no real engineering (either the university degreed kind nor the experienced fabrication shop then real world testing kind) at all - zero, zip, nada.

Buyer beware

 

[5GENIDN]

Check out:

https://dv8offroad.com/pages/about-us

This is the company. It is basically a small number of web/CAD/computer geeks who "design" off road "products" on a computer screen (which are then made in China, Mexico, etc. by the cheapest bidder I assume). There is no real engineering (either the university degreed kind nor the experienced fabrication shop then real world testing kind) at all - zero, zip, nada.

Buyer beware

You know it is a bit funny... I actually purchased and installed their diff skid and trailing arm/shock skids.... I used to teach mechanical design at the University here... I specifically chose their products because of the design. The diff skid (which is typically not that necessary in my opinion) did something no one else's design did.... It actually tied my axle tubes together with my pumpkin... My concern is that I have placed some additional torsion on those tubes and I did not want to spin one. This was the only product that I found at the time that helped me tie those together. I liked the idea of tying my lower control arm protection to the shock protection. Again, the only product that actually did that. The product was probably made in China of Mexico or someplace like that, and I do try to purchase American made... BUT these were well made, fit well, and the design is superior to anything else I could find to accomplish what I wanted accomplished.

I can not speak to their bumpers. I have not purchased one. Hell I have not even seen one in real life. What exactly is your experience with their product? I am trying to understand your point here. I get that you want "Made in America".... but beyond that.... Everything else you are stating seems to be assumptions on your part. Please tell me I am wrong and why....

 

[crenca]

Please tell me I am wrong and why....

I don't know if there is a "right" or "wrong" here. My point is that based on the evidence - their employees and customer feedback here (this is not the only thread that has commented on the 'engineering' of their products), they appear to be heavy on the CAD knowledge, but lite in other areas. They don't appear to make their own stuff - they appear to be a design studio and web team. Do they test their own products (wherever they come from) in any way, and if so how? They don't say. Do they have a mech. engineer on staff, just not listed as such or some experience in fabrication that you find in a "typical" 4x4 shop and company? They don't claim this unless I have missed it on their website.

Now, maybe one or more of them have some real experience that shows up in a product - your example would seem to indicate that. However, this thread points in the other direction, a lack of experience or perhaps a willingness to "under-design" a product, or at least an some aspects of it.

My point is simply buyer beware as always. Beyond that, I notice how consumer driven forums help a buyer to be 'aware' in that we can discuss these things.

 

[userdude]

As long as they use the right loctite the strength of the fasteners is irrelevant. Doing things the easy way is the right way, every of the way. All the way.

More interesting video if they woulda tried to pull it in MORR. I mean, c'mon, these utes gotta get dem views, bruh.

 

[userdude]

I don't know if there is a "right" or "wrong" here. My point is that based on the evidence - their employees and customer feedback here (this is not the only thread that has commented on the 'engineering' of their products), they appear to be heavy on the CAD knowledge, but lite in other areas. They don't appear to make their own stuff - they appear to be a design studio and web team. Do they test their own products (wherever they come from) in any way, and if so how? They don't say. Do they have a mech. engineer on staff, just not listed as such or some experience in fabrication that you find in a "typical" 4x4 shop and company? They don't claim this unless I have missed it on their website.

Now, maybe one or more of them have some real experience that shows up in a product - your example would seem to indicate that. However, this thread points in the other direction, a lack of experience or perhaps a willingness to "under-design" a product, or at least an some aspects of it.

My point is simply buyer beware as always. Beyond that, I notice how consumer driven forums help a buyer to be 'aware' in that we can discuss these things.

Man, you are drawing a lot of suppositions from a website.

 

[5GENIDN]

I don't know if there is a "right" or "wrong" here. My point is that based on the evidence - their employees and customer feedback here (this is not the only thread that has commented on the 'engineering' of their products), they appear to be heavy on the CAD knowledge, but lite in other areas. They don't appear to make their own stuff - they appear to be a design studio and web team. Do they test their own products (wherever they come from) in any way, and if so how? They don't say. Do they have a mech. engineer on staff, just not listed as such or some experience in fabrication that you find in a "typical" 4x4 shop and company? They don't claim this unless I have missed it on their website.

Now, maybe one or more of them have some real experience that shows up in a product - your example would seem to indicate that. However, this thread points in the other direction, a lack of experience or perhaps a willingness to "under-design" a product, or at least an some aspects of it.

My point is simply buyer beware as always. Beyond that, I notice how consumer driven forums help a buyer to be 'aware' in that we can discuss these things.

Seems to me they have quite a few you tube videos of Broncos they own out on the trail..... I have banged their parts around pretty hard myself. I have been impressed so far. I agree that I wish it was American made and I think they have even had a thread on this forum lamenting the production overseas suggesting that to compete in the price market they felt they almost had to go overseas. I do not know about that and when offered a comparable product built in the US I tend to be willing to pay a bit more. Bumper design is a difficult balance. You try to make it as strong as possible but as light as you can. I tend to try and stick with the manufacturer bumpers because I want to maintain the original design aesthetic. Considering that bumpers are designed to take impact and NOT tension would definitely give me pause before trying to use it as a tow point. In fact I would not want to pull on anything forward of the crush zone on the frame rails. Just thoughts. We all have our priorities.

 

[SierraBronco]

@5GENIDN @crenca @userdude please don’t get me started on “Made in America” with in-house engineers…

 

[Brian_B]

I also prefer “made in China, engineered by our competitors”

the price is right

 

[userdude]

@5GENIDN @crenca @userdude please don’t get me started on “Made in America” with in-house engineers…

Lemme ask the AI chat daemen, one sec.

Oh yeah, what's the question??

 

[crenca]

I spent the evening doing vehicle safety/ min. equipment inspections at our local clubs annual "Chili Challenge".

A JK pulled up with lots of DV8 branding, but alas it was fenders, a top, and the like nothing load bearing or otherwise important to function...of course that top doing it's job is pretty important to the owner no doubt.

I just asked the owner what he thought of the website

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