Low CG, max articulation, and biggest tire size without interference?

[Tex]

I'd like to think that the Walker links might reduce or eliminate oscillations because they're first and foremost a damper, which is primarily what's needed in that type of event. Body roll will force one to go up and one to go down, and if they've designed them with even compression/rebound valving, they'll act as one to counter roll moments. I could care less about body roll, and I'm not really concerned with the instability either, but in the rare event that my wife or someone else needs to drive my Bronco, I don't want the wagging to be a problem for them. The ideal solution would be a similar to OEM anti-anti-swaybar setup (should it be called a swaybar in that case?), but short of that perhaps the walker links or a smaller swaybar. Adding a swaybar to the rear might help in my situation more than a front swaybar, as that's where I believe the origin of the instability lies, and the OEM rears are smaller than the front. Makes me wonder if I could get walker links to work on the rear instead.

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[kodiakisland]

So, when I get my Bronco into a situation where it will develop a sway oscillation, it happens in very specific circumstances (namely, above 50mph, under acceleration, then add lateral force from turning or a lane change). When that occurs, it's not even close to reaching 4" of movement in the suspension. It's about like standing next to it and rocking it back and forth by hand, it might be something like 1-2" of movement. My opinion in the matter is that the swaybar is able to resist the oscillation by only allowing a small amount of deflection, essentially if it can reduce body roll by 1-2", then it can eliminate the oscillation entirely by not allowing the conditions to occur. I don't actually know this to be fact, however, since I haven't driven with the swaybar since I installed all the heavy bumpers and tire carrier and gas cans etc. But, given how specific the conditions have to be for it to happen, and how easy it is to interrupt the oscillation by reducing power or changing lateral loading, I'm confident that it would only need a percentage of what the OEM swaybar provides.

More than anything, the swaybar is to keep body roll minimized, as keeping it upright increases both traction and stability. It's not really intended to prevent sway oscillations as that *should* be the job of the shocks alone (and overall weight distribution/stability of the vehicle)...however, when the sway bar is effective enough to virtually eliminate body roll, it also has the benefit of eliminating any oscillations that the shocks are otherwise incapable of handling. Ultimately, a lot of people aren't used to body roll in any capacity, and I believe that's the primary driving factor in why they took such a heavy handed approach with the swaybar. A vehicle that doesn't sway at all feels especially solid with good road manners, but it's not necessary to completely eliminate sway for traction and stability benefits, not even in a race car. Perhaps they were expecting people to add a lot of weight to the roof and they wanted to size the swaybar for the worst possible conditions, honestly I couldn't say.

I do intend to re-install the swaybar if I take my Bronco up to the midwest here in a week, so I might be able to add some more insights on that 1200 mile trip.

My sway bar sits on my garage floor. I regularly drive it on the interstate, but rarely over 75mph, and on all conditions of road. After about a week, I forgot it was even gone as it just feels normal. Certainly better than all the lifted 1st and 2nd gen Blazers I've driven for many years.

I've driven cross country with and without it, and am happy to leave it off. In fact, just got back from a trip down to San Angelo.

I'm not concerned with it gone, but I also realize it's not there, and drive with that knowledge. I'm a little hesitant to let my wife drive it on the interstate, because I know how much time she spends behind the wheel doing other stuff besides driving. Probably be a bit hesitant to loan it out to anyone while the bar is off. For me though, I'm convinced it's fine for the way I drive to go without.

 

[BAUS67]

My sway bar sits on my garage floor. I regularly drive it on the interstate, but rarely over 75mph, and on all conditions of road. After about a week, I forgot it was even gone as it just feels normal. Certainly better than all the lifted 1st and 2nd gen Blazers I've driven for many years.

I've driven cross country with and without it, and am happy to leave it off. In fact, just got back from a trip down to San Angelo.

I'm not concerned with it gone, but I also realize it's not there, and drive with that knowledge. I'm a little hesitant to let my wife drive it on the interstate, because I know how much time she spends behind the wheel doing other stuff besides driving. Probably be a bit hesitant to loan it out to anyone while the bar is off. For me though, I'm convinced it's fine for the way I drive to go without.

For many years I drove my Fox body with NO front sway bar. As you said I know it's not there and I drive accordingly. Do I race a Corvette across the state line and back???? NO. Do I clean that Vett's clock from one city block to the next??? YOU BETCHA' .

You mentioned about someone else driving your ride. In those old days friends would always ask if they could drive my Stang to that I would reply, "Yes, you think you can. First, you have to get it started. Second, just remember it does NOT have power steering." Those two kept most of them from driving.

They couldn't start it because I was a drag racer. I put the battery in the back for weight transfer. Then you need a battery disconnect switch. I hid mine next to the license plate. They couldn't find the switch. They would tell me my battery is dead.

If they did find the switch when they went to drive it and tried to turn the wheel, "it was too hard to steer" If you just "rock" the car back and forth with the clutch while turning the wheel it steers REAL easy. Kids.

Some would say that Mustang is more race car than street car. I would just say it is neither it is a car that will spank anything you got.

My Bronco is not made for the interstate it is made to kick ass and take names OFF the interstate, therefore my Bronc will be without a sway bar here very shortly.

 

[87-Z28]

I drive mine on the street way too much right now. Put my sway bar back on. Working to damn hard trying to retire early. Soon enough I will join you guys sway bar free.

You had to throw some shade at Chevy.

 

[Tex]

Today I decided to bolt my swaybar back on, not because I'm taking it up north, but because my wife's ride needs new tires and I'm going to let her use it while I'm gone. For the same reasons you guys outlined, as well as the instability issue. Turns out it had nothing to do with the swaybar being off, but rather all that weight on the rear bumper and up high with the gas tanks and whatnot. The oscillations were still there when the steering was intentionally upset, but instead of a steady increase in intensity until stability control kicks in to valiantly save its meat lord, the oscillations slowly decreased in intensity until they stabilized. I'd say it took about 2-3 seconds to stabilize, which equates to maybe 8-10 oscillations. None of it existed as stock, and from what I remember, it didn't occur when I removed the swaybar either. It took both of those variables together to cause it, high mounted weight on the rear and no swaybar was enough to destabilize the Bronco under the right conditions. Driving without fuel in the cans helped the issue considerably, but didn't eliminate it. That bumper and tire carrier and hi-lift jack is heavy.

So, let that be a caveat for adding a lot of weight to the rear as well as mounting it high...if you go without a swaybar, be prepared for that with the knowledge of how to handle it, and also be aware that a swaybar won't completely stabilize it either. Get the weight forward if you can, lower if you can't. It's becoming more obvious to me that a rear swaybar in this configuration would be a better option to apply force where the instability originates from, as opposed to a heavy front swaybar. I just don't have anywhere else to put all this crap except on the tire carrier, and I'd rather not leave it all at home.

 

[kodiakisland]

Yeah, my thoughts have been on using a rear sway bar only. I'm really hoping RockJock will make one with off road in mind. I feel a rear bar would decrease body roll while still allowing or even making the front suspension work like it's supposed to.

Some progress on their website. They now at least have a picture of the sway bar even though there is no info.
Bronco (21-Up) (rockjock4x4.com)

 

[Tex]

Yeah, my thoughts have been on using a rear sway bar only. I'm really hoping RockJock will make one with off road in mind. I feel a rear bar would decrease body roll while still allowing or even making the front suspension work like it's supposed to.

Some progress on their website. They now at least have a picture of the sway bar even though there is no info.
Bronco (21-Up) (rockjock4x4.com)

Supposedly the newer OEM rear swaybars will bolt up to a 2021 2dr with minimal mods, though I don't know how effective it would be compared to what rockjock could come up with. They look pretty flimsy and a PITA to install or remove.

The good thing about putting a sway bar on the rear is that since it's a solid axle, you'll have more leverage to overcome that tension during flex than you would on IFS. As long as it's not made excessively stiff, it's possible to have no change at all in articulation. The existing rear suspension has more droop in it than the shocks will allow, and there's a LOT of tensile force on the drooping shock during max articulation, so theoretically you could get by with an effective swaybar and reduce that tensile force on the shock at the same time without altering flex at all. Just increase swaybar diameter until it gets to the point of limiting articulation, then back off just a bit from there.

 

[Snacktime]

@OddBall88 installed a Belltech rear sway bar and it doesn't seem to effect his rear flex. He would be able to add to the rear sway bar feel.

I am going to be adding more preload to my front 5100s and don't think I will need the sway bar after that. I think that extra couple of hundred pounds of preload really help with weight transfer side to side. My oscillations went away 5100s, my spacer lift was awful around curves with road imperfections. Only real difference was the lift, same wheels and tires.

 

[87-Z28]

The Belltech rear sway bar is very light, only 7/8” diameter and from pic it has >24” moment arm to apply leverage on main torsion section. I would not think it would limit articulation by much. It has 3 settings, essentially bolt locations for end links that will change effective moment arm. Shortest hole location will provide highest stiffness. I question whether such minor adjustments in already long moment arm do much. I am curious how this sway bar feels on the road. Especially with heavily loaded rig. Hopefully someone who has one will add some more context. Not cheap for a simple bar, almost $500.

 

[87-Z28]

So the rear sway bar was much greater moment arm, and unlike the front, the ends of the bar will bend and also provide some flexibility. Flexibility will increase as a function of moment arm to the third power. So it is possible that the three link locations will provide some different flexibilities.

Just example not actual numbers. if closest link hole produces 24” moment arm and farthest 26”, then flexibility will increase by (26/24)^3 or 27%. Probably enough to maybe feel the difference when loaded.

 

[mpeugeot]

My sway bar sits on my garage floor. I regularly drive it on the interstate, but rarely over 75mph, and on all conditions of road. After about a week, I forgot it was even gone as it just feels normal. Certainly better than all the lifted 1st and 2nd gen Blazers I've driven for many years.

I've driven cross country with and without it, and am happy to leave it off. In fact, just got back from a trip down to San Angelo.

I'm not concerned with it gone, but I also realize it's not there, and drive with that knowledge. I'm a little hesitant to let my wife drive it on the interstate, because I know how much time she spends behind the wheel doing other stuff besides driving. Probably be a bit hesitant to loan it out to anyone while the bar is off. For me though, I'm convinced it's fine for the way I drive to go without.

What could ever be a reason to drive to San Angelo? I didn't even notice that you had removed the sway bar. It's on my to do list now that I am done commuting weekly.

Hope you found a good breakfast spot to eat at before you drove back home.

 

[kodiakisland]

What could ever be a reason to drive to San Angelo? I didn't even notice that you had removed the sway bar. It's on my to do list now that I am done commuting weekly.

Hope you found a good breakfast spot to eat at before you drove back home.

Yeah, we ate at the Dun Bar. One of those old, motel restaurants where everyone is over the age of 65. Even the waitresses. Good, greasy food and plenty of coffee.

 

[Tex]

Yeah, we ate at the Dun Bar. One of those old, motel restaurants where everyone is over the age of 65. Even the waitresses. Good, greasy food and plenty of coffee.

I went there once, that was enough for me LOL

 

[mpeugeot]

Yeah, we ate at the Dun Bar. One of those old, motel restaurants where everyone is over the age of 65. Even the waitresses. Good, greasy food and plenty of coffee.

That's only a few blocks away from where my GF lives. Like Tex, I ate there ONCE.

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