Resale value worth the sale?

[72roadster]

Capitalism is most effective and beneficial when profit motives are secondary to ethical considerations. A reasonable product/service for a reasonable price is the gold standard in any transaction, and willfully inserting yourself into the process without providing either is just grifting.

IMO capitalism should not be used to justify taking advantage of others, and anyone reserving a high demand, initially production limited vehicle to make a quick buck by gouging less scrupulous consumers is pretty shitty. It's a dangerous thing using supply and demand to rationalize bad behavior.

However, many may disagree and I respect that. The fact still stands that the average Joe is EXTREMELY unlikely to turn a profit on anything other than an FE due to TTL and the only guaranteed winner is the state getting a double dip of those sweet sweet taxes.

I actually agree with you for the most part. But this isn't milk and rice and toilet paper. No one HAS to have a bronco. For all intents and purposes this is a luxury item.

I keep reading phrases like "taking advantage of" but how exactly is the buyer taken advantage of?

You mention "gouging less scrupulous" buyers. but I don't think anyone here is implying they are trying to pull one over on someone. The proposed offer seems to be very clear. A buyer would be well aware that the wait for a bronco is now into the next model year. If Joe millionaire suddenly decides he wants a bronco, he isn't going to have a problem paying an extra $5k to get one now. What kind of less scrupulous buyer are you seeing here?

So I ask again, where is this ethically a problem? Who is getting taken advantage of?

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[Bestdayever]

I am just trying to understand the thoughts that the new Bronco is so desired that people will pay a premium in cash. The age demographics of the current potential buyer is seemingly young, 20-30-40 y.o. An older buyer would probably go retro and purchase 1st generation model years. Complete frame off rebuilds are sold for 55k-100k at auction on a fairly regular basis. The really nice ones are coyote powered. I fall into the older group and have a Wildtrak reserved.

 

[guernsej]

I actually agree with you for the most part. But this isn't milk and rice and toilet paper. No one HAS to have a bronco. For all intents and purposes this is a luxury item.

I keep reading phrases like "taking advantage of" but how exactly is the buyer taken advantage of?

You mention "gouging less scrupulous" buyers. but I don't think anyone here is implying they are trying to pull one over on someone. The proposed offer seems to be very clear. A buyer would be well aware that the wait for a bronco is now into the next model year. If Joe millionaire suddenly decides he wants a bronco, he isn't going to have a problem paying an extra $5k to get one now. What kind of less scrupulous buyer are you seeing here?

So I ask again, where is this ethically a problem? Who is getting taken advantage of?

True story on states winning by double dipping on taxes!

Good points - for me the ethics issue is that reservation systems are generally implemented to allow "fair access" to all consumers during product rollouts that might otherwise be dominated by wealthy individuals willing and able to pay high premiums for early access.
In this case deliveries are going to be production limited through 2022, so flippers will have a small but negative impact on the delivery timeline for other consumers that participated in the reservation system and are presumably excited to use and enjoy their Bronco as soon as possible.

TLDR, flipping harms most market participants by counteracting the intent of the reservation system to benefit wealthier consumers for an individual's personal gain.

FWIW, I think flipping an FE is somewhat more acceptable since its main draw is exclusivity/status and there's really no ethical imperative to protect people seeking those things.

 

[guernsej]

What kind of less scrupulous buyer are you seeing here?

Scrupulous maybe wasn't the best choice of words here - intended to convey buyers that don't mind using their wealth to get what they want, when they want it, at the expense of other consumers that might have a stronger use case for the product but lack the means or willingness to complete for it.

 

[72roadster]

Good points - for me the ethics issue is that reservation systems are generally implemented to allow "fair access" to all consumers during product rollouts that might otherwise be dominated by wealthy individuals willing and able to pay high premiums for early access.
In this case deliveries are going to be production limited through 2022, so flippers will have a small but negative impact on the delivery timeline for other consumers that participated in the reservation system and are presumably excited to use and enjoy their Bronco as soon as possible.

TLDR, flipping harms most market participants by counteracting the intent of the reservation system to benefit wealthier consumers for an individual's personal gain.

FWIW, I think flipping an FE is somewhat more acceptable since its main draw is exclusivity/status and there's really no ethical imperative to protect people seeking those things.

First, Thank you for setting a true example of ethics and morality by having a civil conversation and not immediately labeling someone that may disagree with you as an A-hole.

Second.
So it really does seem like the only real issue is about the other reservation holders being impacted, which is fair, but i still think the reservations system accounted for that.. flippers and in turn their buyers, had the same opportunities to reserve as any other normal buyer and vice versa. If someone waited a week to reserve they are late to get their bronco. if a flipper waited a week they are also losing out.

In the end I honestly don't really think its a good plan to flip especially given state of interiors, FE top delays. taxes etc etc. I just really couldn't understand the harsh reactions to it. "The how dare you" with really no example except . "You really must be some kinda a-hole."


Again thank your for a logical and well thought series of replies.

 

[spyderman01]

I actually agree with you for the most part. But this isn't milk and rice and toilet paper. No one HAS to have a bronco. For all intents and purposes this is a luxury item.

I keep reading phrases like "taking advantage of" but how exactly is the buyer taken advantage of?

You mention "gouging less scrupulous" buyers. but I don't think anyone here is implying they are trying to pull one over on someone. The proposed offer seems to be very clear. A buyer would be well aware that the wait for a bronco is now into the next model year. If Joe millionaire suddenly decides he wants a bronco, he isn't going to have a problem paying an extra $5k to get one now. What kind of less scrupulous buyer are you seeing here?

So I ask again, where is this ethically a problem? Who is getting taken advantage of?

True story on states winning by double dipping on taxes!

I'm not interested in buying or selling, but on the tax issue, you could always lease initially, pay the small fee, then you sell the lease. No need for title, you only pay taxes on part, and you're leveraging the finance companies dollars. Now some lease companies are easier to work with than others.

 

[colbert]

5K over MSRP would be fair if you just buy and list without using. I didn't read the thread much. The forum is for enthusiast so your position is unpopular for sure but another person will be happy to pay up and enjoy it so no harm and no foul.
I always buy a car with an exit strategy. What if...happens and I choose to or have to sell. I think the Bronco will do pretty well in the resale department so I don't think you could lose money.
Good luck and let us know what happens.

 

[colbert]

My dad’s friend was the one that bought it via a broker. Lifelong Ford guy and had the previous GT but wasn’t allocated the new one.

wanted to have it before he was too old to drive it. Had the money and offered Cena double what he paid ?

Barrett Jackson auction had a couple 2018 GT40s go for 1 million plus this weekend. They are past Fords 2 year resale stipulation at this point. An early offering FE or Wildtrax would be MSRP plus plus at Barrett.

 

[Dmk08]

First FE @ Granger... giving it to my dad free... wonder what I could have gotten.

 

[Pharm351]

No one's really answering your question so let me help - you're gonna want to get a 2 door base manual, 2.3l engine, skip sasquatch and all the functional upgrades but add ALL the aftermarket accessories like fridge, paint protection, wheel lock kit, all of it. Doesn't matter which color as long as it's white.

boom, money in the bank. I'll take a $500 consulting fee thank you bye bye.

This is exactly what I reserved/ordered (base white) and I’m contemplating flipping it.

 

[e90steve]

It's just like when Nissan released the Skyline GTR or when Chevy released the latest corvette. People pre-ordered, paid MSRP and then are able to jack up the price upwards of 20k for a few months while the car is still super rare. I'll bet there are a ton of guys on VinWiki attempting to do the same with the Bronco.

And if you can do it and are comfortable doing it why not. We live in a free country right. Don't bet for a second that dealers won't be doing it when someone cancels their Bronco order and now they have one ready and available on the lot.

 

[Ricepuddin]

I am not reading 5 pages of comments, but I bet if you put it on bring a trailer it would sell for something stupid. Just like everything on that site

 

[drbandkgb]

No one is going to pay over for a base lol.. Id say the other trims yes but look at the sales figures on each trim... Base is way down the list

 

[Heffe66413]

I made my reservation on July 14th, I think it was around 12 hours after you were able to make a reservation... Assuming I get mine rather quickly, I was curious on what everyone thought I could turn around and sell it for right off the bat? Price to build has what I was planning on getting around 40k... But if I could make around 5-10k by putting it right back on the market I would definitely think about it.

You have to clear your sales tax just to break even.

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