Tailgate "Reinforcement"

[crenca]

There are two main load issues when you put weight on the tailgate. The first is direct shear that translates to the hinges wanting to bend them and/or their mounting points. The second is the buckling that can occur on the face of the tailgate itself. The tailgate skin can easily buckle when the weight of the spare tire flexes up and down and when it does, the ability of the panel to carry the shear loads to the hinges drops significantly. Plates like the rough country or hammer built primarily help or counteract the buckling which is important. The plate is 10+ lbs so the actual shear the hinges must carry is higher but they are steel and much stronger than the panel they are bolted too. It really is a 3D load problem, not just a 2D shear problem. Most of the bent tailgates you see are buckling failures.

The best solution is both a better hinge and a stiffener plate against buckling. Above that, is a separate bumper mounting solution.

Nice summary.

Just to verify, does anyone know fer sur if the FP reinforcement system:

https://www.bronco6g.com/forum/thre...or-broncos-here-at-lethal-performance.108707/

is an actual reinforcement plate? I ask because I can easily see some plates/systems really being for aesthetics, or additional mount points, etc. and not an actual reinforcement of the tailgate itself....maybe I'm too cynical about the aftermarket

EDIT: Will probably start with @Brian_B suggestion of tinkering with the alignment of the striker plate, but might reach for one of these reinforcement kit as well...

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[ssls6]

They are not all equal, that is for sure. As a general rule, you want thick, a full circle for the cone that the spare bolts too, a full panel to both hinges, and low weight (hard to meet).

When I replace my tires on the SAS, I'lll likely go with tires at least 10lbs heavier but will keep the stock spare. It won't go in rotation and after 10 years I'll replace it but it will always be an emergency tire. None of the "reinforcement" solutions so far give me warm and fuzzies. I'm not knocking them just I'll know a great solution when I see it.

My stock SAS spare causes squeaks along with my top which shows things are moving around a little already. That's just me but I live in CO.

 

[JL8jeff]

Has anyone seen the tailgate damaged on a truck with the Raptor upgraded components?

 

[lakesinai]

Curious as to what people think of these tailgate reinforcement kits that are being sold. Unless I'm misunderstanding them, most of the offerings just help distribute the weight more evenly? But all of the weight is still on the latch and hinges.

So if they're being installed to prevent tailgate issues in the future, wouldn't the hinge and whatever the hinge attaches to be what would need to be reinforced? If they're being installed for more cosmetic purposes, I can get that, and that's totally fine. But to add a metal plate (which adds weight) to my tailgate and not reinforce the hinges seems counterproductive as a reinforcement.

Am I crazy? I'm like a slight nudge away from purchasing a Hammerbuilt unit but it would be because it looks sweet and can attach a Rotopax to it.

I'm quite happy with my Hammerbuilt for 3 years. I have '33's and it's ready for 35's if I want. I mainly bought it for the added attachment points it provides. But it also cuts down wiggling and flex.

 

[Dantastic]

Has anyone seen the tailgate damaged on a truck with the Raptor upgraded components?

That’s my question too. Not that I doubt it happening; but rather, how much of this is the buying the extreme solution for a low risk problem.

My hinges warp … okay … new hinges and a better solution.

my tailgate warp, well that’s a lot bigger of an issue.

So something to keep the tailgate from warping (ie a reinforcement) seems to be sufficient.

If I had unlimited funds, sure … sign me up for a whole new mounting solution.

But for a site that is primarily run on complaints and issues people have had, I can’t recall seeing any posts about tailgates buckling to the point of unusability.

 

[swamp2]

I may seem dismissive (have dealt with many “engineers“) because you stated the plate creates more load/weight on the tailgate which it does not (at least to any great amount) and I didn’t want to get into it… but…it creates more weight on the hinges that I am not concerned with…the plate actually carries some tire/wheel weight to the hinges, removing weight from the tailgate…removing the load/weight removes “stress” from the tailgate…at least that is how I see it…and why I have a plate. But you can keep up the word play if ya want…

This isn't word games. It seems your lack of technical aptitude and/or training leads you to believe it is "play" but it just isn't.

It even seems like you want to go from smug to rude. I'm an Engineer and Physicist and damn proud of it. No need for quotes. It's been earned with thousands of hours of blood, sweat and tears and actually results in tremendously satisfying insights into the way things work and an ability to even predict how things will work.

You were 100% wrong prior and now you are both wrong and perhaps almost right. In short some of your concepts are loosely correct, but get entirely fouled up by your incorrect terms and language (it continues... and it continues to matter).

Again this prior is 100% FALSE, just own it.

the Hammer type plates do take some load off the aluminum tailgate

@ssls6 has it nailed above in his description. Adding to that:

The MASS of the plate as affected by gravity creates more WEIGHT on the gate, thus creating more LOAD and more STRESS. Yes, a very small amount but it does. Then, when DYNAMIC loads happen, the STIFFNESS (AND GEOMETRY AND attachment details) of the plate better distributes the loads among the attachment points, either including or excluding the hinges, depending on the design. Regardless, this results in less DEFLECTION and less STRESS and as @ssls6 pointed out, less chance for buckling (although that failure mode might simply be simple yielding rather than true buckling (which again is a very specific/technical type of concept/failure)).

-Structures don't carry weight to other places - they simply react to loads.
-Structures don't create more weight, they certainly can weigh more.
-Altered structures do not "remove weight" nor "remove stress", although many improved designs do lower stresses in critical locations.

red above - just false
green - true
purple - I think a mostly correct concept for the reinforcement kits that also tie in to the hinges, but mumbo-jumbo on any semblance of correct wording

I'll continue as long as you like and you can continue to tell everyone elsewhere how awful "engineers" are.

A related aside:

It's funny, you do realize why you have such a great vehicle to drive off road in harsh conditions and the reason it performs as well as it does? It is because of the thousands of Engineers and Scientists at Ford and decades centuries of their and others doing the same work across the supply chain who have advanced the state of the art of Automotive Engineering. They do this in part by clearly communicating internally and externally and by publishing their work in journals, often times peer reviewed, where once again, the communication and advancement is ONLY POSSIBLE because everyone agrees on the use of the language of the field, the basic jargon. OK, off my soap box.

 

[Oldhippie]

This isn't word games. It seems your lack of technical aptitude and/or training leads you to believe it is "play" but it just isn't.

It even seems like you want to go from smug to rude. I'm an Engineer and Physicist and damn proud of it. No need for quotes. It's been earned with thousands of hours of blood, sweat and tears and actually results in tremendously satisfying insights into the way things work and an ability to even predict how things will work.

You were 100% wrong prior and now you are both wrong and perhaps almost right. In short some of your concepts are loosely correct, but get entirely fouled up by your incorrect terms and language (it continues... and it continues to matter).

Again this prior is 100% FALSE, just own it.



@ssls6 has it nailed above in his description. Adding to that:

The MASS of the plate as affected by gravity creates more WEIGHT on the gate, thus creating more LOAD and more STRESS. Yes, a very small amount but it does. Then, when DYNAMIC loads happen, the STIFFNESS (AND GEOMETRY AND attachment details) of the plate better distributes the loads among the attachment points, either including or excluding the hinges, depending on the design. Regardless, this results in less DEFLECTION and less STRESS and as @ssls6 pointed out, less chance for buckling (although that failure mode might simply be simple yielding rather than true buckling (which again is a very specific/technical type of concept/failure)).

-Structures don't carry weight to other places - they simply react to loads.
-Structures don't create more weight, they certainly can weigh more.
-Altered structures do not "remove weight" nor "remove stress", although many improved designs do lower stresses in critical locations.

red above - just false
green - true
purple - I think a mostly correct concept for the reinforcement kits that also tie in to the hinges, but mumbo-jumbo on any semblance of correct wording

I'll continue as long as you like and you can continue to tell everyone elsewhere how awful "engineers" are.

A related aside:

It's funny, you do realize why you have such a great vehicle to drive off road in harsh conditions and the reason it performs as well as it does? It is because of the thousands of Engineers and Scientists at Ford and decades centuries of their and others doing the same work across the supply chain who have advanced the state of the art of Automotive Engineering. They do this in part by clearly communicating internally and externally and by publishing their work in journals, often times peer reviewed, where once again, the communication and advancement is ONLY POSSIBLE because everyone agrees on the use of the language of the field, the basic jargon. OK, off my soap box.

I have nothing against engineers, they serve important functions, but they also think/speak different than most folks….making it hard to communicate and/or transfer their designs to the “real world” sometimes…I am not a science or technical guy (history major) but have worked in the transportation world most of my life..we can work together but have to agree to disagree at times…yes I will bad mouth you engineers when my lockers quit working because a wheel sensor confused a module out in the middle of nowhere…or steering rack programming tool does not work…I like real levers and switches…party on!

 

[Sherpa11]

I changed my hinges to the raptor hinges on my 2 door fe, but I changed them back when I sold it. it was night and day more sturdy and stable compared to the thin stock hinges. I still have them if anyones interested pm me. they would just need to painted which is super easy and cheap bc I had mine done in lightning blue to match my fe.

 

[Denis85]

I changed my hinges to the raptor hinges on my 2 door fe, but I changed them back when I sold it. it was night and day more sturdy and stable compared to the thin stock hinges. I still have them if anyones interested pm me. they would just need to painted which is super easy and cheap bc I had mine done in lightning blue to match my fe.

Shot you a PM

 

[Motovita]

Excellent Price.

https://www.oemfordpartsdirect.com/oem-parts/ford-hinge-assembly-rear-door-n2dz7826800a

https://www.oemfordpartsdirect.com/oem-parts/ford-hinge-assembly-rear-door-n2dz7842900a

I changed my hinges to the raptor hinges on my 2 door fe, but I changed them back when I sold it. it was night and day more sturdy and stable compared to the thin stock hinges. I still have them if anyones interested pm me. they would just need to painted which is super easy and cheap bc I had mine done in lightning blue to match my fe.

Did you order them as Raptor replacement part numbers or did you buy a kit?

 

[NORCALGXP]

Did you order them as Raptor replacement part numbers or did you buy a kit?

Orders just the Raptor hinges and the Hammer Built Bronco HD Tailgate Reinforcement System (Bronco Raptor Hinges Only)
Brand: Hammerbuilt SKU: HB-03-00020 availability: In stock

https://hpbuilt.shop/products/hamme...nforcement-system?_pos=2&_sid=a82e8e9f2&_ss=r

 

[Sherpa11]

Did you order them as Raptor replacement part numbers or did you buy a kit?

I bought them individually on their part numbers from a ford dealer online but cant remember which honestly bc alot of their sites have nearly the same name. I paid around that price plus tax and shipping so it was about 600ish I think

 

[IwannaGOfast]

Did you order them as Raptor replacement part numbers or did you buy a kit?

It’s cheaper to buy the ford performance kit and only use the hinges. If you buy the hinges individually you will pay more.

https://www.lethalperformance.com/f...rcement-kit-2021-2025-bronco-m-19007-brs.html

 

[87-Z28]

I am not terribly concerned about the reaction forces (loads) at the hinges or latch. Nor the strength of the hinges. Also not worried about the tailgate in the open configuration when all the static weight must be reacted by the hinges.

I am more concerned about the dynamic loads of a heavier wheel/tire and how those loads are distributed through the tailgate to the supports (hinges and latch). Adequate reinforcement helps to reduce displacement and local stress within the tailgate. This reduces the risk for plastic deformations within the tailgate, the primary failure mechanism. A true buckling stability concern (Euler buckling) is not likely.

Reducing displacements and stresses in the tailgate during dynamic loading with some reinforcement is wise. A permanently deformed tailgate would be a bummer.

 

[Denis85]

It’s cheaper to buy the ford performance kit and only use the hinges. If you buy the hinges individually you will pay more.

https://www.lethalperformance.com/f...rcement-kit-2021-2025-bronco-m-19007-brs.html

I have thought this very thing. Seems odd they have it priced the way that they do.

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