deep dive by 74weld on portals

[5GENIDN]

First set should be shipping any day now... 74 Weld posted a video of bronco portal assembly!

and Sjortiz If you are already going +3.5 per side.... you are already at Brapter width...
I will be a Brapter width with portals and a positive 30 offset. Can not imagine going wider than that.... another 7 inches???

The trade off here is clearance or articulation..... Long arm gives you the articulation. Portals give you the clearance (as well as gearing - but that can easily be addressed with long arm). Sounds like you may have all ready addressed the gearing.

I am throwing on some Kings with these and some 345/85/17s.... so clearance should be in excess of 18 inches. I will stick to 3 wheeling and the close to stock articulation.

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[5GENIDN]

These are bolt on money pits.

Yes... they all are....

 

[5GENIDN]

Yes... they all are.... every modification is to some degree.

 

[userdude]

Everyone defines streetable modifications differently.

I put portals in the hardcore modification category. You drastically reduce your off the shelf parts availability and make it harder to do repairs. I wouldn't buy them unless you can install and fix them yourself. It's like hot rodding a car, you will spend more time making adjustments and tinkering.

Quin and BroncBozo sell portals as bolt on make your bronco better. Your adding additional suspension lash, weight and complexity. Like all things that are complicated they don't age well. Understand there is a trade off and nothing is technically free.

Don't be fooled into thinking you are not going to spend another $10k making the portals work(new offset wheels, welding rear axle tubes, gearing, steering). These are bolt on money pits.

I mean, the point is to go bigger on tires without deforming the suspension geometry. I've put the full cost with rims and tires and suspension upgrade at $35k. If someone is thinking about portals and not factoring that in, I don't know what they're actually doing getting them.

All things considered, are you saying given no cost to either you'd bypass the 74Weld portals on a new build and go suspension lift? Also, what is suspension lash?

 

[Snacktime]

@userdude any time you add gearing you ad lash or the thousandth of play between gears. Put a vehicle in park and push it back and forth. The rocking is the lash taking up. When you start adding doublers and portals you start getting more lash. Certain setups it becomes excessive. Suspension will also develop more lash/movement from increased leverage on rubber bushings.

If money wasn't an object I would skip portals as they limit you to factory running gear. I would want something that could handle rock bouncing if I was sinking endless money into the suspension.

 

[userdude]

If money wasn't an object I would skip portals as they limit you to factory running gear.

I've never heard this before, and it seems counterintuitive. Do you have any reference I can look at or can explain?

Would lash be equal to the amount of regear? Like 1.22 means it would have 22% more lash movement? I could see that causing more wear on some parts. I still don't see that as worse than a 3.5" suspension, especially since you don't get as much clearance (which should in a lot of ways prevent wear and tear since you just roll over more things).

 

[Snacktime]

@userdude Still looking for the epic video of Marlin Red Toyota crawling a block of wood on flat ground. Basically climbs up but then falls down the back of the block as there is 6-8" of travel before the gears hit on the opposite side of the drive teeth. While triple Toyota cases are on the extreme end, you can have various small clunks which some can live with and other freak out about.

Backlash occurs when two gears meet and there is play. Basic video below, this is why tolerance is so important but so is the small amount of play!

 

[userdude]

@userdude Still looking for the epic video of Marlin Red Toyota crawling a block of wood on flat ground. Basically climbs up but then falls down the back of the block as there is 6-8" of travel before the gears hit on the opposite side of the drive teeth. While triple Toyota cases are on the extreme end, you can have various small clunks which some can live with and other freak out about.

Backlash occurs when two gears meet and there is play. Basic video below, this is why tolerance is so important but so is the small amount of play!

The thing I remember was the video of the 392 out at Moab doing some stairs and it jumps in the air. What I always kinda thought was odd was how the whole wheel seemed to almost look loose on the axle; when they were free spinning, they looked like they wobbled.

I'm probably at least a year away from even having that kind of cash, and there's a lot that could happen. I'm not usually an early adopter but something about portals makes me want to throw that caution to the wind. I've thought lately they are removable, so they should have resale value. Not nearly as easy to do with suspension lifts. But I'd have to be willing to spend the money when the time comes, and we'll just have to see.

 

[Bored]

Overall, best option(if you can) is portals + steering rack + real mt tires + beadlock wheels + a decent mid travel suspension kit. go with that from the start and you'll be known as the jeep eater.

This was my mostly my philosophy.

 

[Sjortiz]

that's my current plan, get the 74weld steering rack and portals sometime in the next calendar year,
then evaluate my needs for armor, bumpers and winches

full set of skids is a a really nice add on

 

[Sjortiz]

First set should be shipping any day now... 74 Weld posted a video of bronco portal assembly!

and Sjortiz If you are already going +3.5 per side.... you are already at Brapter width...
I will be a Brapter width with portals and a positive 30 offset. Can not imagine going wider than that.... another 7 inches???

The trade off here is clearance or articulation..... Long arm gives you the articulation. Portals give you the clearance (as well as gearing - but that can easily be addressed with long arm). Sounds like you may have all ready addressed the gearing.

I am throwing on some Kings with these and some 345/85/17s.... so clearance should be in excess of 18 inches. I will stick to 3 wheeling and the close to stock articulation.

I can see myself doing portals next year,
so it'd be like this

wicked LT kit +3.5
icon rebound pros positive 10 mm +1
portals +2 ?

so... ~6.5" per side, a whooping almost 14" wider, that's trophy truck width grounds

 

[5GENIDN]

I can see myself doing portals next year,
so it'd be like this

wicked LT kit +3.5
icon rebound pros positive 10 mm +1
portals +2 ?

so... ~6.5" per side, a whooping almost 14" wider, that's trophy truck width grounds

One of the big things about my choosing a positive offset for the portals is that the brake calipers have to mount low on the portal to clear the gear set... so the positive offset brings the wheel in over and protecting the caliper. It appears a +30 will completely cover and protect it.

I am going into this eyes wide open and I know that they are experimental on the recreational side of things. There may well be unforeseen issues. Do not know, but I am willing and able to take that chance when weighed against the potential benefit. Yes these are a gamble I am willing to take.

As far as being stuck with the existing factory running gear... Yes and no... You do become commited to running the Dana44s both front and rear. But you can upgrade everything within that limitation.... CV's Axle shafts, gearing etc. I will be welding my tubes and I am trying to find a suitable axle truss. BUT the 1.22 reduction outboard of that actually puts less stress on everything inboard. Yes there will be additional unsprung weight. Not a good thing at higher speeds. not that big of deal at lower speeds. It will take some getting used to and adjustments in driving style... Yes if you are planning to run quick speeds on trails or in the desert.... I probably would not go with the portals. I am an old man... I drive slow everywhere. Everybody passes me on the highway and I do not care, and yes I stay to the right.

 

[Sjortiz]

One of the big things about my choosing a positive offset for the portals is that the brake calipers have to mount low on the portal to clear the gear set... so the positive offset brings the wheel in over and protecting the caliper. It appears a +30 will completely cover and protect it.

I am going into this eyes wide open and I know that they are experimental on the recreational side of things. There may well be unforeseen issues. Do not know, but I am willing and able to take that chance when weighed against the potential benefit. Yes these are a gamble I am willing to take.

As far as being stuck with the existing factory running gear... Yes and no... You do become commited to running the Dana44s both front and rear. But you can upgrade everything within that limitation.... CV's Axle shafts, gearing etc. I will be welding my tubes and I am trying to find a suitable axle truss. BUT the 1.22 reduction outboard of that actually puts less stress on everything inboard. Yes there will be additional unsprung weight. Not a good thing at higher speeds. not that big of deal at lower speeds. It will take some getting used to and adjustments in driving style... Yes if you are planning to run quick speeds on trails or in the desert.... I probably would not go with the portals. I am an old man... I drive slow everywhere. Everybody passes me on the highway and I do not care, and yes I stay to the right.

I got some good news for you, you’ll be able to drive fast with these Quinn tested them on hes tacoma at highway speed, also you can add air lockers or swapp the diff to a e locker instead of welding

I think you can also swap to a Dana 60 because our Dana 40s are ford it’s mostly bolt on and then bolt on, I can ask Quinn about it too, but there isvirtually no limit.
If the gear limit you speak about is gear vs power ratio, well you can always go to a bigger tired to compensate haha. The only issue there is the truck becoming too high to fit underground garages but anyway there are Dana 60s 4.2s 3.9s etc

 

[5GENIDN]

I got some good news for you, you’ll be able to drive fast with these Quinn tested them on hes tacoma at highway speed, also you can add air lockers or swapp the diff to a e locker instead of welding

I think you can also swap to a Dana 60 because our Dana 40s are ford it’s mostly bolt on and then bolt on, I can ask Quinn about it too, but there isvirtually no limit.
If the gear limit you speak about is gear vs power ratio, well you can always go to a bigger tired to compensate haha. The only issue there is the truck becoming too high to fit underground garages but anyway there are Dana 60s 4.2s 3.9s etc

What about the bolt pattern at the end on the tube relative to the tapped holes in the portal. Kind of like fitting a 6x5.5 pattern on a 8x6 pattern.... They do not line up. Part of the portal Kit from 74 weld is replacement axle. It is a stronger better axle that will fit in the same housing. I am good with the 44. I do think I should weld the tubes so that I do not spin one. The leverage to spin a tube will be significantly increased. I really do not think I need a 60... If I put 40's on the drive line will still think it is turning 33s. That is what the 1.22 reduction will do. My issue with the speed is the unsprung weight. Momentum is a bitch. Mass x velocity. Hit a pot hole and the velocity is the same but with a greater Mass... much more difficult for the suspension to respond. Yes I can probably drive fast with them... but my suspension will have a much more difficult time responding to the greater momentum. Something for me to get used to.

I do not need a 60. In fact a 60 just makes things worse.

 

[Sjortiz]

What about the bolt pattern at the end on the tube relative to the tapped holes in the portal. Kind of like fitting a 6x5.5 pattern on a 8x6 pattern.... They do not line up. Part of the portal Kit from 74 weld is replacement axle. It is a stronger better axle that will fit in the same housing. I am good with the 44. I do think I should weld the tubes so that I do not spin one. The leverage to spin a tube will be significantly increased. I really do not think I need a 60... If I put 40's on the drive line will still think it is turning 33s. That is what the 1.22 reduction will do. My issue with the speed is the unsprung weight. Momentum is a bitch. Mass x velocity. Hit a pot hole and the velocity is the same but with a greater Mass... much more difficult for the suspension to respond. Yes I can probably drive fast with them... but my suspension will have a much more difficult time responding to the greater momentum. Something for me to get used to.

I do not need a 60. In fact a 60 just makes things worse.

I think you are right with most if not all the things you said, I’m waiting confirmation from @74Weld on the Dana’s 60s

when it to the suspension, that’s were I’d say you don’t really have to worry, you can always improve the shocks without affecting height much

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