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Solid Front Axle Conversion?

Bmadda

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I mean why is anyone surprised that it isnt SFA? The bronco hasnt been SFA since 1979....
The TTB wasnt a SFA...
RIP TTB...not something any sane person ever wants to see produced again! Of course if u remember those years ALL the trucks were ttb. Then Ford went IFS on f150 and SFA on super duty. That strategy i think worked well! Would be cool if in a couple model years we had an IFS light duty, and a SFA super duty Bronco/Ranger platform! Only not complete different bodystyles...same truck different suspension! Makes so much sense that there's no way Ford will ever do it tho!
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The main reason for this discussion is based on Fordā€™s marketing that the Bronco would be a Wrangler killer. Which, technically speaking, isnā€™t true....because of the IFS setup. Remember, we are talking about 4x4ā€™s and not sports cars. Ford did the same thing years ago with the ā€œVenom kills Demonsā€ remark, that wasnā€™t at all the case.

I still like the new Bronco regardless, I think they nailed it on the overall design. Mechanically speaking though, it missed a few things. Personally (and im sure many orhers) I would like to see SFA, manual lever transfercase, and a bigger displacement motor in front of a manual gearbox. That would be a dream Bronco!
 

IfIHMadeA2021Scout

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The original guys from pirate now run a site called Irate4x4.com after pirate was bought out. Yeah, lots of info and experts, but shenanigans a plenty...

For what its worth, I think IfIHMadeA2021Scout nailed it on the head in his last post. Itā€™s only a matter of time, and not very much time at that.
Speaking of time...

Go over to Pirate and Irate, read up a lot on link calculators, chassis design, anti-squat, anti-dive, roll center, spring rates, valving and frequency, blah blah blah and you might be ready to ask a question that does not get you in trouble by about the time you get your Bronco.

There is a wealth of knowledge there. Just wear a flack jacket and have thick skin. If you want to ask, "What do I need to put a straight axle under my 2021 Bronco?", ask it in the General 4x4 sections and do it on a Tuesday. You'll find out why. Enjoy!
 

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The main reason for this discussion is based on Fordā€™s marketing that the Bronco would be a Wrangler killer. Which, technically speaking, isnā€™t true....because of the IFS setup. Remember, we are talking about 4x4ā€™s and not sports cars. Ford did the same thing years ago with the ā€œVenom kills Demonsā€ remark, that wasnā€™t at all the case.

I still like the new Bronco regardless, I think they nailed it on the overall design. Mechanically speaking though, it missed a few things. Personally (and im sure many orhers) I would like to see SFA, manual lever transfercase, and a bigger displacement motor in front of a manual gearbox. That would be a dream Bronco!
I agree, a dream for sure. But you and I and many others who feel that way still constitute the minority of the general public. Ford will sell more Broncos with how they designed it currently, so I donā€™t blame them. But we can still dream.
 

lobbs611

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I know why IFS is preferred....it is a much more compliant setup. Especially for the majority. I have had several 4Runners and they all ride much much better than my SFA FJ40. However, if Toyota made a SFA 4Runner tomorrow, I would be the first to put a deposit on one. There is a reason Wranglers sell really really well in the off-road / 4x4 category....there is still a demand for SFA rigs.
Jeeps sell really, really well on their image of ruggedness. 90+% of their buyers wouldn't know a SFA from IFS.
 

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Jeeps sell really, really well on their image of ruggedness. 90+% of their buyers wouldn't know a SFA from IFS.
I donā€™t disagree, however, every Jeep Wrangler owner I know (and I know alot) know quite a bit about their vehicles. SFA being one of those important things.
 

Bmadda

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I agree, a dream for sure. But you and I and many others who feel that way still constitute the minority of the general public. Ford will sell more Broncos with how they designed it currently, so I donā€™t blame them. But we can still dream.
You can dream if u want...I'm ready to build!
 

Bmadda

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Jeeps sell really, really well on their image of ruggedness. 90+% of their buyers wouldn't know a SFA from IFS.
I have to disagree with that statement 100%. I've worked in the auto industry all my adult life. Nearly all Jeep customers are cultlike...sort of like the Harley crowd. Most fully understand what makes their vehicle unique in today's market and understand and accept the shortcomings that come with it.
 

Bmadda

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Speaking of time...

Go over to Pirate and Irate, read up a lot on link calculators, chassis design, anti-squat, anti-dive, roll center, spring rates, valving and frequency, blah blah blah and you might be ready to ask a question that does not get you in trouble by about the time you get your Bronco.

There is a wealth of knowledge there. Just wear a flack jacket and have thick skin. If you want to ask, "What do I need to put a straight axle under my 2021 Bronco?", ask it in the General 4x4 sections and do it on a Tuesday. You'll find out why. Enjoy!
The nuts and bolts of putting it under there I feel I have the technical knowledge for. Not too worried about making the angle of the dangle=the heat of the meat. As far as will there be a junkyard donor that's an easy swap in? I'm not counting on that, and this truck is worth spending the money to go full custom. My fab skills aren't great...but they have improved alot over the years as I've gotten older I've developed better patience. The stumbling block for me is the electric rack...I just can't see any way around putting a worm/sector gear on the thing like every SFA ever built. If there is a provision for a p/s pump on the motor (like GM did w/their EPS where the pump just isn't there, but the spot to put one is), then I suppose it will be simple enough. Then it's just a matter of keeping the computers happy. From what I can glean from Ranger shop manual, the steering angle sensor is integrated in the rack. Not a big deal to mount it elsewhere, but the ABS/VDM/GOAT computer or whatever they are going to call it now is going to want to see that data...and the EPS module has to report on the CAN that it exists. That's a software problem that's kinda outside my skill set!
 

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Clark

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The nuts and bolts of putting it under there I feel I have the technical knowledge for. Not too worried about making the angle of the dangle=the heat of the meat. As far as will there be a junkyard donor that's an easy swap in? I'm not counting on that, and this truck is worth spending the money to go full custom. My fab skills aren't great...but they have improved alot over the years as I've gotten older I've developed better patience. The stumbling block for me is the electric rack...I just can't see any way around putting a worm/sector gear on the thing like every SFA ever built. If there is a provision for a p/s pump on the motor (like GM did w/their EPS where the pump just isn't there, but the spot to put one is), then I suppose it will be simple enough. Then it's just a matter of keeping the computers happy. From what I can glean from Ranger shop manual, the steering angle sensor is integrated in the rack. Not a big deal to mount it elsewhere, but the ABS/VDM/GOAT computer or whatever they are going to call it now is going to want to see that data...and the EPS module has to report on the CAN that it exists. That's a software problem that's kinda outside my skill set!
Iā€™ll be stoked to see what you come up with. I piggy backed off of others before me and in the end, my swap was pretty routine. A solid axle Bronco will get dialed in over time and it will be a beautiful thing.
 

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If someone out there would just pile up a 2020 Super Duty 7.3 gasser you could use this D60 and the ABS sensor should be closer to jiving with the ECM. Does Ford use an E locker in the tremor? maybe same plug ??? I think Zilla would be a better fit than the wide coyote and better torque to turn the BIG axle BIG tire combo. Simpler engine design.

Back to the 60 ........ you could just narrow it to Bronco width and have axles made. Although I have not done this personally but I have seen/watched as, and know of others who have, done the narrowing themselves. It is attention to detail. DETAIL. DETAIL. measure 20 times, check it 50. But it can be done. Just need that donor truck. Make some calls and roll up the sleeves.



?
 

Bmadda

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If someone out there would just pile up a 2020 Super Duty 7.3 gasser you could use this D60 and the ABS sensor should be closer to jiving with the ECM. Does Ford use an E locker in the tremor? maybe same plug ??? I think Zilla would be a better fit than the wide coyote and better torque to turn the BIG axle BIG tire combo. Simpler engine design.

Back to the 60 ........ you could just narrow it to Bronco width and have axles made. Although I have not done this personally but I have seen/watched as, and know of others who have, done the narrowing themselves. It is attention to detail. DETAIL. DETAIL. measure 20 times, check it 50. But it can be done. Just need that donor truck. Make some calls and roll up the sleeves.



?
For that amount of work dynatrack will just build ya one any width U want. My working theory is...build a trans crossmember like the Jeep long arm setups use. start w/a clean housing w/no "c"s. setup my pinion angle. once that's done clock the "c"s to get my caster angle 7-9 deg. Get those 2 angles wrong and it will never be right...EVERY SAS rig I've seen built has problems w/those 2 angles. There's nothing you can do about it once it's set...but there's tons of bandaids to help. Then use jeep style OTA trackbar mount and trackbar bracket...may have to be fabbed, but one could possibly be adapted. There's no way a superduty hub bearing is something I wana get involved in, but I'm interested in my options w/the OE hub bearing...the pictures sure make it look like it would fit WJ knuckles and that would give me the crossover steering I want...just have to fab the drag/tie rod to the length I need...Oh wait I don't have a steering gear...see that's where I'm stumbling. I gotta get my hands on the thing to figure that part out! Might be way easier than I'm thinking, but I'm prepared for the worst!
 

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For that amount of work dynatrack will just build ya one any width U want. My working theory is...build a trans crossmember like the Jeep long arm setups use. start w/a clean housing w/no "c"s. setup my pinion angle. once that's done clock the "c"s to get my caster angle 7-9 deg. Get those 2 angles wrong and it will never be right...EVERY SAS rig I've seen built has problems w/those 2 angles. There's nothing you can do about it once it's set...but there's tons of bandaids to help. Then use jeep style OTA trackbar mount and trackbar bracket...may have to be fabbed, but one could possibly be adapted. There's no way a superduty hub bearing is something I wana get involved in, but I'm interested in my options w/the OE hub bearing...the pictures sure make it look like it would fit WJ knuckles and that would give me the crossover steering I want...just have to fab the drag/tie rod to the length I need...Oh wait I don't have a steering gear...see that's where I'm stumbling. I gotta get my hands on the thing to figure that part out! Might be way easier than I'm thinking, but I'm prepared for the worst!


UH ........ maybe this .................

https://www.pscmotorsports.com/moto...stems/2-5-trail-series-kits/psc-fhk100tc.html



..... or maybe this for mounting solutions for a D60.........


https://www.artecindustries.com/60-Trusses
 

Bmadda

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Ya believe it or not that's the 1st thing I thought of...not street legal in all states tho, at least that's what they tell me. My state is not one that has a problem w/it I think it is TN that does? Anyway that's the way off the reservation option for me. Crazy as it sounds I think U COULD slave a hydraulic steering setup to the original electric rack...now that's crazy talk! But it would solve all my CAN issues neat and clean!
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