Grumblings from the Land Rover "Defender" community, they want a Bronco

vintage

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Looks like Ford is the only one that got it right with the Bronco. If only LR could of only went back to the bàsics they would of had a winner. I owned a couple older D90's and to this day two of my favorite drivers. Same deal with the Chevy Blazer, it could of been a contender if they put the time and effort into making a true off road vehicle.
 

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Looks like Ford is the only one that got it right with the Bronco. If only LR could of only went back to the bàsics they would of had a winner. I owned a couple older D90's and to this day two of my favorite drivers. Same deal with the Chevy Blazer, it could of been a contender if they put the time and effort into making a true off road vehicle.
LR and the new Defender really shit the bed. This Grenadier looks really sharp. I'm looking more into this new brand as I write this.
 

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Grenadier says they want to be priced in like with Jeep 30-40K as a starting point with a 3.0L 6cyl AUTOMATIC only turbo and/or diesel engine to choose from.

I cringe when I hear BMW diesel

$30K seems like pipedream....But I wonder if they'll have packages that will be wanted, bumping it to $50/60K

made in the UK.

Don't know how much it would cost to bring to the USA......Can't rule out maybe even 5-10K

 

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That looks great.

But aren't those BMW engines complete dog doo?
Actually, the B58 (the gas-powered I6 from BMW) won Ward's Best Engine:

https://www.bmwblog.com/2019/12/10/bmw-b58-engine-wins-wards-auto-best-engine-award/

https://www.wardsauto.com/engines/highly-awarded-bmw-i-6-remains-close-perfection

BMW has a very long history making great inline six cylinder engines. The B58 is the updated version of the N55, which also won Ward's best engine award. The B58 is supposed to be more strongly built, more responsive, and more reliable than the N55. I wouldn't avoid a Grenadier because of the engine. But here is a description of the most common problems with the B58, just to be fair:

https://bmwtuning.co/the-4-most-common-bmw-b58-engine-problems/

While I wouldn't avoid the Grenadier because of the engine, I might avoid it because there isn't a network of dealers, so where do you get it serviced while its under warranty? How long will it take to get parts? A lot of the parts are European. The axles, for example, are made by Carraro, an Italian company. Not a lot of Carraro axles floating around here in the U.S. Its too bad Ineos can't make an American version of the Grenadier, with a 6.2 Chevy LS engine, a Tremec manual transmission (as an option), Dynatrac axles, and a bunch of other parts more common in the U.S. But that is a pipe-dream of epic proportion.
 

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Grenadier says they want to be priced in like with Jeep 30-40K as a starting point with a 3.0L 6cyl AUTOMATIC only turbo and/or diesel engine to choose from.
Yeah, it is a major bummer that the Grenadier will only be available with an automatic transmission. Its actually really surprising, given their stated goal of making a new "old-school" 4x4. The silver lining, is that the auto is the 8-speed ZF, which has already been successfully paired with both the B57 (BMW's diesel I6) and the B58 (BMW's gas I6) - the two engines available in the Grenadier. The 8-speed ZF is one of the best auto transmissions on the market today. You can find it in BMWs, Ram trucks, Jeeps, and a bunch of other vehicles. I'm not here to throw shade at Ford or Chevy, but the ZF has a better reputation than the 10-speed they co-developed. In their defense, I think Ford is fixing the rough-shifting that some people have with the 10-speed. Shifts with the ZF are so dam quick and precise, and the software used by Jeep keeps the transmission in the gear you actually want. Ford's software seems intent on getting you up to the highest gear possible to attain maximum fuel efficiency. Sport mode helps combat that, but the ZF is the first auto I've ever felt I could live with.
 

twobigstacksoflowsociety

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Actually, the B58 (the gas-powered I6 from BMW) won Ward's Best Engine:

https://www.bmwblog.com/2019/12/10/bmw-b58-engine-wins-wards-auto-best-engine-award/

https://www.wardsauto.com/engines/highly-awarded-bmw-i-6-remains-close-perfection

BMW has a very long history making great inline six cylinder engines. The B58 is the updated version of the N55, which also won Ward's best engine award. The B58 is supposed to be more strongly built, more responsive, and more reliable than the N55. I wouldn't avoid a Grenadier because of the engine. But here is a description of the most common problems with the B58, just to be fair:

https://bmwtuning.co/the-4-most-common-bmw-b58-engine-problems/

While I wouldn't avoid the Grenadier because of the engine, I might avoid it because there isn't a network of dealers, so where do you get it serviced while its under warranty? How long will it take to get parts? A lot of the parts are European. The axles, for example, are made by Carraro, an Italian company. Not a lot of Carraro axles floating around here in the U.S. Its too bad Ineos can't make an American version of the Grenadier, with a 6.2 Chevy LS engine, a Tremec manual transmission (as an option), Dynatrac axles, and a bunch of other parts more common in the U.S. But that is a pipe-dream of epic proportion.
Grenadier gives you 2 engine choices. A diesel or non diesel. Both made by BMW. Don't know if there's any price difference in picking one or another.
 

stickshifter

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Grenadier gives you 2 engine choices. A diesel or non diesel. Both made by BMW. Don't know if there's any price difference in picking one or another.
Yes, the B57 is BMW's diesel I6, and the B58 is their gas I6. The gas I6 has twin turbos, while the diesel I6 was available with anywhere from 1-4 turbos, but I believe they stopped making the quad-turbo B57. Most B57s now have twin turbos.

The difference between the BMW 430i (gas I6) and the 440i (diesel I6) is $5,000-6,000. That's similar to the price difference between gas and diesel across the American truck market (you find a smaller price increase for the smaller diesels, and a larger price increase for the larger diesels). I would guess that a diesel Grenadier would be about $5-6K more than the gas option. For my use, its gas all the way, but everyone has different needs.
 

Sunchaser99

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Love the old yellow defenders of the 90s. Looking to get into a cyber Orange bronco!
 

Xodric

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Really seems like LR thought they played a safe bet with the new Defender, same goes with GM and the Blazer. Ford really took a risk and dove deep into the concerns and expectations for an off-road modern vehicle.
 

twobigstacksoflowsociety

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Yes, the B57 is BMW's diesel I6, and the B58 is their gas I6. The gas I6 has twin turbos, while the diesel I6 was available with anywhere from 1-4 turbos, but I believe they stopped making the quad-turbo B57. Most B57s now have twin turbos.

The difference between the BMW 430i (gas I6) and the 440i (diesel I6) is $5,000-6,000. That's similar to the price difference between gas and diesel across the American truck market (you find a smaller price increase for the smaller diesels, and a larger price increase for the larger diesels). I would guess that a diesel Grenadier would be about $5-6K more than the gas option. For my use, its gas all the way, but everyone has different needs.
easy decision imo.

paying 6k more for less reliability is not in my future. I don't drive great distances or plan to put heavy miles on it, thus getting the better mileage and the performance/needed drive aspect from it to boot.
 

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