Sweet spot For the money - Black Diamond non-Squatch

[RBF 1401]

I hadn't considered the dust factor. Although I garage park, it is unavoidable. I just can't imagine how hot and uncomfortable they will be for 5 months/ year.....but they will be dusty 12 mos/year lol ?

My current daily driver here in AZ was from NC. Leather seats and no window tint. I tend to throw a lightweight Turkish beach towel on the seat (in addition to the mandatory windshield sunshade) if it's going to be parked in the sun for long.

I'm also debating with myself the dirt vs. heat dilemma.

Today, I'm leaning toward the vinyl because if it gets too hot I can get cloth covers that I can wash. I hate having to shampoo upholstery and I feel like you have to here to keep cloth clean.

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[Efthreeoh]

Well, you can think that if you like. I am fairly well
Informed and experienced, but I have been been wrong before. I had my first 4x4 in 1989 I think. Prior to that, I drove shop trucks, family vehicles and friends vehicles with 4WD. I have replaced transmissions, transfer cases, replaced hubs and driveshafts, front and rear and all together owned at least 15 4wd vehicles. It does vary by manufacturer and often by model (Jeep often offered 3 different systems in the same model at one time ). Some You could drive in 4WD with hubs unlocked, some transfer cases were “full time” and allowed for running in 4WD (using some form of mechanical differentiation in the transfer case) 4WD lock and 4 low lock. Most did not. Most 4wd (not AWD, different animal altogether) systems today, including the “standard” transfer case in the Bronco, do not offer 4WD “unlocked”. Here is an article that explains it.
https://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/how-to/a10288/when-do-i-engage-4wd-16634152/
The standard Bronco transfer case should not be operated on pavement or any surface that does not offer some “slip” between front and rear wheels.

I guess my issue is Ford makes it sound like the advanced transfer case is something new and unique. Based on the description of it I just re-read on the Ford site, their "Advanced" transfer case is nothing different than the system in my H3T, which is more than a decade old now. Basically the H3T has a constantly variable AWD system until you lock it in either 4H or 4L. This is why I had my doubts that the standard transfer case was a true locked 4x4 case or it was just open in 2WD with zero front power bias. But apparently that is what it is; a simple 2H, 4H (locked), and 4L (locked) that can be shifted from 2H to 4H on the fly. My build just went up by $750. Lol.

 

[DC9atnight]

This doesn't make sense about the standard transfer case. Ford would not build a vehicle that would bind the drivetrain because the 4x4 transfer case can't allow for speed deviation between the axles. No company does that. Anyone who would drive a Bronco off the Ford dealership lot, would bring it right back and say it's broken.

I agree with Mattwings, Ford did build it. I believe there to be three generic 4x4 systems. Tom Sheppard writes about this in Four-By-Four Driving.

Type 1: Selectable 4x4 This is the Bronco 4H and 4L. There is no center diff and produces a "locked center diff" effect with a transfer box (In the Bronco a two-speed transfer case for high and low). It is only for off road and must be disengaged on hard services. (Some people may indeed return their Bronco to the Ford dealership lot and say it's broken that don't understand this.)

Type 2: Auto Engaged 4x4 This is the Advanced 4x4 available on the Bronco. Also the standard on the "soft-road" class of vehicles. Mattwings describes this better than I but the Bronco uses a clutch based on demand system to control wheel spin. (Mattwings correct me if I screwed this up.)

Type 3: Permanent 4x4 This is the 4x4 system you are probably thinking about. There is a center differential that enables the 4x4 system to operate on hard surfaces and that center diff can be locked either manually or electronically when off road. This is probably the best system but is mostly in luxury 4x4s so the price is fairly steep. Think Range Rover or G-Wagon.

 

[Mattwings]

I'll not get in a pissing match over this, but I've had four (4) 4x4 trucks; two were Ford, one was Jeep, and my current, the H3T. I've driven over 1M miles total over 40 years and do all my own maintenance and repair, and my '06 BMW has 400,000 miles on it, so I'll say I can fix a car a well as anyone.

Now that the yardsticks are back in our pants, I stated on my first response that I'm not familiar with either of the two transfer cases used in the Bronco. The descriptions Ford provides is not very good. Based on the names of the 7 GOAT modes, it sounds to me that the standard transfer case offers 4x4 capability on surface streets. I don't see where "Eco" and "Sport" would be off road settings for trails. Ford states the Bronco Advanced transfer case is new, so that tells me it's first use is in the New Bronco. Until I find more information, I'll stick with what I think the standard transfer case does. If it is that antiquated, then Ford could have just put a 2H, 4H and 4L stick in it to match the manual transmission. Yet the GOAT modes indicate the standard transfer case is computer controlled.

Have a good evening.

I agree with Mattwings, Ford did build it. I believe there to be three generic 4x4 systems. Tom Sheppard writes about this in Four-By-Four Driving.

Type 1: Selectable 4x4 This is the Bronco 4H and 4L. There is no center diff and produces a "locked center diff" effect with a transfer box (In the Bronco a two-speed transfer case for high and low). It is only for off road and must be disengaged on hard services. (Some people may indeed return their Bronco to the Ford dealership lot and say it's broken that don't understand this.)

Type 2: Auto Engaged 4x4 This is the Advanced 4x4 available on the Bronco. Also the standard on the "soft-road" class of vehicles. Mattwings describes this better than I but the Bronco uses a clutch based on demand system to control wheel spin. (Mattwings correct me if I screwed this up.)

Type 3: Permanent 4x4 This is the 4x4 system you are probably thinking about. There is a center differential that enables the 4x4 system to operate on hard surfaces and that center diff can be locked either manually or electronically when off road. This is probably the best system but is mostly in luxury 4x4s so the price is fairly steep. Think Range Rover or G-Wagon.

I think we all have it sorted out and I meant no offense to anyone. It was more me just trying to think it through and make sure I understood. I didn’t want a new owner to go out and tear up their transfer case or order one thing expecting another. I was on the fence, but I am going with the advanced case either way now, based on my research of how it works in the Raptor.

 

[Efthreeoh]

I agree with Mattwings, Ford did build it. I believe there to be three generic 4x4 systems. Tom Sheppard writes about this in Four-By-Four Driving.

Type 1: Selectable 4x4 This is the Bronco 4H and 4L. There is no center diff and produces a "locked center diff" effect with a transfer box (In the Bronco a two-speed transfer case for high and low). It is only for off road and must be disengaged on hard services. (Some people may indeed return their Bronco to the Ford dealership lot and say it's broken that don't understand this.)

Type 2: Auto Engaged 4x4 This is the Advanced 4x4 available on the Bronco. Also the standard on the "soft-road" class of vehicles. Mattwings describes this better than I but the Bronco uses a clutch based on demand system to control wheel spin. (Mattwings correct me if I screwed this up.)

Type 3: Permanent 4x4 This is the 4x4 system you are probably thinking about. There is a center differential that enables the 4x4 system to operate on hard surfaces and that center diff can be locked either manually or electronically when off road. This is probably the best system but is mostly in luxury 4x4s so the price is fairly steep. Think Range Rover or G-Wagon.

Like I said above being it is the 2021 model year I assumed the base 4x4 transfer case was more sophisticated than a simple shift-on-the-fly system from the 1980's with auto locking hubs, but apparently that is what it is. "Advanced" to me means there is more capability in the transfer case than the Type 2 system you referenced above since most $40K SUVs have that type of system. Like I said my H3T has that system it and it is from mid- 2000's. I guess Ford considers advanced to mean the G.O.A.T system, which they don't explain anywhere, and I can only assume its just a torque limiting system combined with the antilock brake system (i.e. driveline clutches and brake system software).

 

[Khayze427]

Like I said above being it is the 2021 model year I assumed the base 4x4 transfer case was more sophisticated than a simple shift-on-the-fly system from the 1980's with auto locking hubs, but apparently that is what it is. "Advanced" to me means there is more capability in the transfer case than the Type 2 system you referenced above since most $40K SUVs have that type of system. Like I said my H3T has that system it and it is from mid- 2000's. I guess Ford considers advanced to mean the G.O.A.T system, which they don't explain anywhere, and I can only assume its just a torque limiting system combined with the antilock brake system (i.e. driveline clutches and brake system software).

I believe the Toyota Land Crusier is Type 3

 

[AzScorpion]

My current daily driver here in AZ was from NC. Leather seats and no window tint. I tend to throw a lightweight Turkish beach towel on the seat (in addition to the mandatory windshield sunshade) if it's going to be parked in the sun for long.

I'm also debating with myself the dirt vs. heat dilemma.

Today, I'm leaning toward the vinyl because if it gets too hot I can get cloth covers that I can wash. I hate having to shampoo upholstery and I feel like you have to here to keep cloth clean.

I do the same here for the summer months but it's a white beach towel folded on the drivers seat. My interior is black leather and honestly once it's up over 100 it really doesn't matter what you have it's hot. Plus if you have the remote start just fire it up 10-15 minutes before leaving and it'll be pre-cooled. ?

IDK what it's like down it Tucson but here in the valley it's like one big dust bowl so the MGV will be so much easier to keep clean. Especially when the doors and roof are off I can't imagine all that dirt and dust being trapped in the cloth seats and carpet floors.

 

[NVCowboy]

Think I found it.....
https://owner.ford.com/fordpass/fordpass-sync-connect.html

Start schedule? Sh!t. Who knew. Off to Fordpass.

 

[Mattwings]

Start schedule? Sh!t. Who knew. Off to Fordpass.

In winter, it's nice to start my truck from the plane when I land. By the time I get to the parking lot, the truck is warm and toasty. FOB remote can't duplicate that. it isn't as convenient and has some delay at times, so both is nice, along with the keypad so I can lock my keys in the car. Boy I am lazy and spoiled.

 

[NotAnonymous]

As an admitted 4x4 noob, and one who has read through many of these threads on the subject, it appears that the Advanced 4x4 is a good addition, even if my Bronco will largely be a DD, especially for the low cost. Is that an accurate statement (from you 4x4 vets)?

 

[NVCowboy]

In winter, it's nice to start my truck from the plane when I land. By the time I get to the parking lot, the truck is warm and toasty. FOB remote can't duplicate that. it isn't as convenient and has some delay at times, so both is nice, along with the keypad so I can lock my keys in the car. Boy I am lazy and spoiled.

Indeed. Graveyard worker, so I’m garaged in the day and outside overnight. Even in the extended fall (I hesitate to call it winter) we get in SONV, the heated goodies are nice. I startup from my desk. Never really used them when I worked normal people hours. Heated seats probably nice during hunting season too, but I’m usually bundled up enough to not really care.

 

[Mattwings]

As an admitted 4x4 noob, and one who has read through many of these threads on the subject, it appears that the Advanced 4x4 is a good addition, even if my Bronco will largely be a DD, especially for the low cost. Is that an accurate statement (from you 4x4 vets)?

It's just my opinion, but having the ability to use 4WD on "all surfaces" is a worthwhile spend, particularly if you are not familiar with the issues a "locked" transfer case represents. It should really be a benefit when going from one surface to another (think dry, to wet, to slush to snow transition that often occurs when traveling in cold climates or mountains) and should make for a pretty entertaining fire road set up, where automatically adjusting front to rear power bias can deliver handling that 4wd high (locked) cannot. Hard to describe, but in 4WD you generally get some additional understeer at higher speeds when turning. That should be reduced with the "advanced" transfer case.

 

[NotAnonymous]

It's just my opinion, but having the ability to use 4WD on "all surfaces" is a worthwhile spend, particularly if you are not familiar with the issues a "locked" transfer case represents. It should really be a benefit when going from one surface to another (think dry, to wet, to slush to snow transition that often occurs when traveling in cold climates or mountains) and should make for a pretty entertaining fire road set up, where automatically adjusting front to rear power bias can deliver handling that 4wd high (locked) cannot. Hard to describe, but in 4WD you generally get some additional understeer at higher speeds when turning. That should be reduced with the "advanced" transfer case.

Really appreciate that perspective. I'm familiar with understeer, so from that angle I definitely can see the value in the "advanced" transfer case. From my reading here, and given my projected use of the Bronco, that should absolutely suit my needs.

 

[Carolina Jim]

It should really be a benefit when going from one surface to another (think dry, to wet, to slush to snow transition that often occurs when traveling in cold climates or mountains)

Mattwings....is your predicate that you're in 4A?

 

[Mattwings]

Mattwings....is your predicate that you're in 4A?

Yes, In those situations, I would be in 4A. 4H for slower off road work and where I would want everything as locked as it gets. I use sort of a staged approach in my F150 now. If I am off road, I start in 2WD. If I get stuck, or slip, I go to 4H, slip more or get slowed down, lock the rear axle, then low range, depending on speed. I would use 4A either running fire roads or when traction was varied like slush, snow. Fire roads are pretty prevalent in MI and I more often run these roads than anything else. Sand and or snow is next, then some mud, usually in spring and fall.

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