MadMan4BamaNATL

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I was dead set on Badlands non squatch 33" tires only. Seeing how the 35" tires climbed over things easier, it has me second guessing my decision.

What swayed you to go the opposite direction?
I know that articulation is greater with 33" tires unless you've got a 3-4 link long arm suspension, but this is an IFS, so that's not possible.

For IFS, it's smarter in my view to go with larger tires if you'll be dealing with rocks or tree logs and even deep mud to help increase your wade depth.

As you pointed out, 35s allow you to go OVER more obstacles easier and keep you from bottoming out on the skids and potentially banging your rear diff.

Big concern for me also are the control arms which hang a bit out back and may need an upgrade if you're going to regularly deal with larger rocks; not boulders, but large rocks.

All that said, if you want 33s and that's enough for you, get that size. The trade off is more on-road feel and better control and braking. Sure I went Squatch for my 2 Dr Badlands, but not because I felt 33s were inadequate, which is not true.
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Mustang Mike

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McLovin didn't handle that very well!

LOL

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Aaonter

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If the bone stock Wrangler could be repeatedly demonstrated by Jeep to exceed 800 on the RTI ramp, wouldn't they have paraded that out the moment Bronco published numbers? It would be crazy not to. I think the biggest issue with what you have pictured is that you are not on perfectly flat ground, maybe it is, maybe not (I do not remotely think you are trying to mislead in any way) but it can certainly be challenged from a marketing standpoint. It is very clear that it can flex like crazy but when all four tires and the ramp itself are pressing into compressible soil it is going to change, if ever so slightly, how far up the ramp you get before a tire leaves the surface.

As for Fords claim of wheel travel, as others have already pointed out, that is different from pure articulation and has its own merits off-road independently from pure articulation.
Sorry, I was a little high on my hand calc.s until the number came in. 807.29. The ramp was 23 degrees. I had to find a calculator to adjust down to a 20 degree ramp Bronco uses. There number for the 2dr 33" tire ( the one that travels more) was 700. Someone said the steeper ramp that was not with the guys measuring and said 30 degree but here is the proof. Keep in mind also was lower than it could because the ground was lower on the right side causing the ramp to want to tip. I was at 37 PSI. scored 706.65 on 23. Bunch of guys got near 1000. I would not say this is official other than compare it other rigs. Grass made it hard to see when the wheels were lifting too.

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Ig_bronco

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Ig_bronco

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Soooooo, let me start off my saying, that trail is considered a green level [Easiest] at the places I wheel and people do those without lockers. There were a couple of sections that may be considered a blue [slightly harder but still towards the easy side] in which a rear locker is recommended but not required and a little bump can help when needed.



That defender has no point being off road. When you can't crawl a rock as small as the one at the 9 minute mark, that vehicle should stick to the pavement. It also doesn't have tires with any sort of extra beef in the sidewalls, or lugs, so I am not surprised it had that puncture.

The Jeep guy took the first obstacle too fast. He would have gone over it exactly like the Bronco, had he driven it slower. It would have prevented it from kicking out. The difference there was driver, not vehicle. Tommy just drove it smarter, and the bigger tires will always help.
Also, I will point out, a 2 door, with a shorter wheel base would have better length for this trail. It was nice to hear the driver of the jeep state just that at the 17 minute mark.

Personally, I've never called a trail that is 60-70% dirt, 30-40% rocks, a rock garden.
18:15 mark was comical. Put the rear tire on the rock, and then you won't hit the suspension. :rolleyes:

Ford, I am sorry but your claim about more front articulation is proven to be untrue in this picture and 22:25 of the video. Significantly more air under the Bronco tire. Furthermore, the Bronco body is following the rear axle, [Typical when there is no sway bar at both ends] whereas the Jeep body is almost level
1627576765718.png
what about the size of tire affecting the articulation? Not only that during said "rock garden" the JL didnt take the same line as the bronco.
 

Ig_bronco

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The 4xe battery adds between 700 and 800 pounds to the Wrangler. It actually improves the road manners a bit as it's all low center of gravity so it helps it to feel more planted. I assume that's the comparison being made
Thanks for pointing this out on one of the downfalls of this vehicle. Its one of the first, but overall all that extra weight for an extra 3 miles (off road) or 27(37?) city driving? Its not worth the price tag. Maybe if you switched it for hard obstacles that would require instant torque you could extend that range and or a portable battery charger.
 

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Soooooo, let me start off my saying, that trail is considered a green level [Easiest] at the places I wheel and people do those without lockers. There were a couple of sections that may be considered a blue [slightly harder but still towards the easy side] in which a rear locker is recommended but not required and a little bump can help when needed.



That defender has no point being off road. When you can't crawl a rock as small as the one at the 9 minute mark, that vehicle should stick to the pavement. It also doesn't have tires with any sort of extra beef in the sidewalls, or lugs, so I am not surprised it had that puncture.

The Jeep guy took the first obstacle too fast. He would have gone over it exactly like the Bronco, had he driven it slower. It would have prevented it from kicking out. The difference there was driver, not vehicle. Tommy just drove it smarter, and the bigger tires will always help.
Also, I will point out, a 2 door, with a shorter wheel base would have better length for this trail. It was nice to hear the driver of the jeep state just that at the 17 minute mark.

Personally, I've never called a trail that is 60-70% dirt, 30-40% rocks, a rock garden.
18:15 mark was comical. Put the rear tire on the rock, and then you won't hit the suspension. :rolleyes:

Ford, I am sorry but your claim about more front articulation is proven to be untrue in this picture and 22:25 of the video. Significantly more air under the Bronco tire. Furthermore, the Bronco body is following the rear axle, [Typical when there is no sway bar at both ends] whereas the Jeep body is almost level
1627576765718.png
Well it's rated a 7/10 difficulty and this year it has been particularly gnarly, not bad for a factory vehicle. On the recovery I saw a kitted out Toyota take out a bed on an obstacle. Is it Holy Cross? No but for a factory rig it's a good test.
 

Ramble_Offroad

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I know that articulation is greater with 33" tires unless you've got a 3-4 link long arm suspension, but this is an IFS, so that's not possible.

For IFS, it's smarter in my view to go with larger tires if you'll be dealing with rocks or tree logs and even deep mud to help increase your wade depth.

As you pointed out, 35s allow you to go OVER more obstacles easier and keep you from bottoming out on the skids and potentially banging your rear diff.

Big concern for me also are the control arms which hang a bit out back and may need an upgrade if you're going to regularly deal with larger rocks; not boulders, but large rocks.

All that said, if you want 33s and that's enough for you, get that size. The trade off is more on-road feel and better control and braking. Sure I went Squatch for my 2 Dr Badlands, but not because I felt 33s were inadequate, which is not true.
I wouldn’t worry about the rear lower control arm. Hopefully the aftermarket “should” develop some drag link skids pretty quickly. As long as there is a way to bolt them on it’s an reasonably easy part to design / manufacture. 4Runners have a similar set up. Plus drivers will learn where their low points are and adjust their lines as able.
 

Zeebo390

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That wrangler 4xe burning 17 kWh in ~3 miles makes you wonder how quick the new GMC Hummer is going to suck down its 200 kWh of juice at a 9000 lb curb weight. If anyone tries to do real off-roading in that thing it better be less than 50-60 miles round trip from the nearest charger.
 

Ryuk

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Well it's rated a 7/10 difficulty and this year it has been particularly gnarly, not bad for a factory vehicle. On the recovery I saw a kitted out Toyota take out a bed on an obstacle. Is it Holy Cross? No but for a factory rig it's a good test.
Maybe, but 7 out of 10? Seriously? Who the heck made that rating? Does it get way more difficult in areas that you didn't film?
Is 1-4 pavement?
5 a gravel driveway
and 6 finally a dirt road?

That seems like a pretty high rating for such a simple trail.
 

Lazerus

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Well it's rated a 7/10 difficulty and this year it has been particularly gnarly, not bad for a factory vehicle. On the recovery I saw a kitted out Toyota take out a bed on an obstacle. Is it Holy Cross? No but for a factory rig it's a good test.
I learned long ago not get into a 'kibits' over trail ratings. It's the off road equivalent of 'You don't know tough, I walked 20 miles to school in the snow every day."
I checked several trail guide sites and they all rate this a 6-7 (difficult - severe) trail.
I guess we're just not tough enough to make it through all that snow...
 

Raptor911

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99% of the new hummer owners will never take it off-road so it should not be a problem. Because Who in the hell would take a 9000 pound ev off-road?

That wrangler 4xe burning 17 kWh in ~3 miles makes you wonder how quick the new GMC Hummer is going to suck down its 200 kWh of juice at a 9000 lb curb weight. If anyone tries to do real off-roading in that thing it better be less than 50-60 miles round trip from the nearest charger.
 

Bison

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Maybe, but 7 out of 10? Seriously? Who the heck made that rating? Does it get way more difficult in areas that you didn't film?
Is 1-4 pavement?
5 a gravel driveway
and 6 finally a dirt road?

That seems like a pretty high rating for such a simple trail.
It’s more of the death factor involved. Take a look at black bear pass in Ouray. I have seen an old vw van do that trail but it’s rated pretty high for all the roll overs and deaths.
 
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