Technophobes: How Scared Is Too Scared?

[BroncoMike]

So deleting half the clutter should be beneficial, right? Make it like pairing a BT speaker: press this button, see the flashing blue light, enter this code on the BT screen on your phone, done. If you can't manage that, you'll still have to have someone else do it for you... no change in the status quo for those users. But there's no new interface to learn, it's the same one that's been on your phone since the inception of the OS flavor of your choice.

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[Jake_zx2]

Do Ford units not have wireless carplay yet? The kenwood aftermarket head units I've used have that already. That's definitely something I'd like to see Ford pick up then, yeah.

Wireless CarPlay is a fairly new prospect for the auto industry. BMW JUST started getting it in their newest-gen models. My Sync3 equipped Mustang doesn’t have wireless CarPlay. I think that feature will be reserved for Sync4

 

[OX1]

Electronic module appears about the same size,

Like I said, objective analysis. Overall point is, even an upgraded aftermarket radio with double DIN screen
is about the size (and weight) of the lower case with CD in it (in a Fusion), so there is extra weight by not intergating the screen and
the small wiring harness. By itself, minimal weight, but add all the sensors, wirings, and modules, for a lot of this stuff, it adds up.
My defention of tech is something that automates or enhances a feature that has been in cars a long time or some new electronic
feature. Just some of them........

Adaptive cruise
Blind spot with cross traffic
Auto high beam
Lane keeping
Pre collision emerg braking
Active park assist
Active steering headlights
Rear view (or 360) cameras
Rrain sensing wipers
Auto darkening rear/side view mirrors
Auto up/down windows
Remote features (everything from door locking to wacthing video of inside of car)
Electronic shifter
Flat screen clusters

etc.......

Some of it is really handy to me, like auto up/down windows, but most of it is at best uneeded.
Something like 17 modules in my fusion when I do a non OBDII scan. You can't tell me ALL of that
(the full systems) is not 30-40 lbs (you will of course, but you don't really have ANY idea).

I'm not by any means a technophile. I don't know the first thing about computers, programming, wiring is a real thinker for me, and so on. But extra stuff certainly CAN provide more capability and satisfaction. Hell, the digital dash in my Mustang is one of my favorite features of the car because it's so satisfying, yet it also has a shift light that I can set to any RPM, it'll track my lap times, it'll read out all sorts of mechanical parameters of the car, and so on. Adding all that to a completely analog car would not only be costly, but would add significantly more weight than a simple digital gauge cluster does. And I can tell you, that Mustang is far more capable, far more satisfying, and far less prone to failure than any of my other cars with manual door locks, crank windows, analog clusters, cable throttles, distributors, and so on

Hence why this conversation is hard to have with you, if you are someone who has not delved heavily into fixing or modyfying (heavily in many cases for me)
automotive electronics (or maybe sosmeone who has never had a seamingly unfixable electronic auto issues). Getting back to my Fusion. Not only am I still having
issues with electronic shifter (second dealer had car for 3 days, didn't even look at it, and I had to get car back to fit in parking garage of hospital, which my father is currently in),
but I had it up and shut off 3 times since I've owned it. Has not done it in almost a year now, but I'm not alone.

https://www.fusionsportforums.com/f...mp-mode-car-stalls-w-full-accessory-mode.html

And that mustang screen has already had isssues BTW..........

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/2018-mustang-gt-lcd-panel-issues-warning.100433/
https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/digital-instrument-cluster-go-blank.114264/#post-2657611
https://www.motorsafety.org/ford-re...vigator-vehicles-for-instrument-panel-issues/
https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/new-recall-for-the-ipc-2019.117300/page-2
https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/digital-instrument-cluster-go-blank.114264/#post-2410514

I'm certainly not anti-electronics. I just put in a 16 camera surveilance system in my house.
Heck, I bought an electroncially controlled, $500, mosquito trap that even has built in
diagnositcs.............

https://luxjo.supermotors.net/MOSQUITO TRAP/2019/20190422_172719.jpg

And it REALLY works

https://luxjo.supermotors.net/MOSQUITO TRAP/2019/20190422_172210.jpg

But just this summer a wire broke off the heating element (emulates body heat and hot breath of human)
and it stopped working right. You would have thought that open resistance (uses ribbon heating element like the old
rear window defroster aftermarket kits used to) would have thrown an error code, but no dice. I only noticed it as I
pull the whole unit apart at end of season to clean out all the scum from larger dead bugs, that get stuck in it all summer.

Anyway, getting back to bronco. Are some of these sensors (heck, just an intercooler from ecoboosts) going to be unhappy jammed up with ice and snow? (like auto cruise or emerg braking sensors behind bumper). Because many love to go on snow runs, even if they don't do deep water or mud........... These are real concerns for those that want to push their newer rigs hard.............

 

[OX1]

I'm not certain that I see those two as functionally different. They're both a get-under-the-truck-and-manipulate-some-stuff scenarios. The manual transfer case issue I had (it's still there) is almost like an alternate shift pattern, the shifter doesn't move in the normal direction when you attempt to shift it, and doesn't engage anything. It also frequently pops out of 4-low, unless you hold the shifter forward. I'm sure it's a case of worn bushings, easily repairable at home, but on a trailside in 100* plus heat, I'm probably not going to be doing it unless there isn't another option.



I have no experience with center axle disconnects, but the 4x4s I've had with vacuum hubs have had a manual override. As I've made clear previously, such a critical system should have a manual backup or it isn't an "improvement". Either way, vacuum hub issues are easy to diagnose and repair (though not usually trailside) and failures are usually the result of deferred maintenance (as is likely the case with my transfer case shifter). Most of the hardcore wheelers I know replace their hubs with upgraded manuals units.

But the manual transfer case, can be typically overhauled and then it is good for another 100K (or at least months/a year in
super hard core wheeling). So it is something that you deal with once. Electronics can get intermediatte bugs that are really
hard to fix (or sometimes even duplicate). And thats new, it just gets worse when older, introducing minor corrosion in harnesses, etc....


I would prefer no locking hubs, man TC (fine with electronic actuated center diff that can be used for AWD, but ideally would like to see it
manually lockable, in case it effs up). I'd be OK with slightly less gas mileage due to draging front drivetrain a long constantly due to no
locking hubs.

 

[Carolina Jim]

My defention of tech is something that automates or enhances a feature that has been in cars a long time or some new electronic
feature. Just some of them........

Adaptive cruise
Blind spot with cross traffic
Auto high beam
Lane keeping
Pre collision emerg braking
Active park assist
Active steering headlights
Rear view (or 360) cameras
Rrain sensing wipers
Auto darkening rear/side view mirrors
Auto up/down windows
Remote features (everything from door locking to wacthing video of inside of car)
Electronic shifter
Flat screen clusters

My anecdotal sense of tech in vehicles is (A) something is invented, (B) it becomes an option that adds cost/margin to Some sales, and (C) "voila", its suddenly mandated to add cost/margin in All sales. At some point, this ever expanding cost trajectory is gonna hit a wall & auto makers are going to find themselves in a pickle.

 

[BroncoBuyer]

Like I said, objective analysis. Overall point is, even an upgraded aftermarket radio with double DIN screen
is about the size (and weight) of the lower case with CD in it (in a Fusion), so there is extra weight by not intergating the screen and
the small wiring harness. By itself, minimal weight, but add all the sensors, wirings, and modules, for a lot of this stuff, it adds up.
My defention of tech is something that automates or enhances a feature that has been in cars a long time or some new electronic
feature. Just some of them........

Adaptive cruise
Blind spot with cross traffic
Auto high beam
Lane keeping
Pre collision emerg braking
Active park assist
Active steering headlights
Rear view (or 360) cameras
Rrain sensing wipers
Auto darkening rear/side view mirrors
Auto up/down windows
Remote features (everything from door locking to wacthing video of inside of car)
Electronic shifter
Flat screen clusters

etc.......

Some of it is really handy to me, like auto up/down windows, but most of it is at best uneeded.
Something like 17 modules in my fusion when I do a non OBDII scan. You can't tell me ALL of that
(the full systems) is not 30-40 lbs (you will of course, but you don't really have ANY idea).



Hence why this conversation is hard to have with you, if you are someone who has not delved heavily into fixing or modyfying (heavily in many cases for me)
automotive electronics (or maybe sosmeone who has never had a seamingly unfixable electronic auto issues). Getting back to my Fusion. Not only am I still having
issues with electronic shifter (second dealer had car for 3 days, didn't even look at it, and I had to get car back to fit in parking garage of hospital, which my father is currently in),
but I had it up and shut off 3 times since I've owned it. Has not done it in almost a year now, but I'm not alone.

https://www.fusionsportforums.com/f...mp-mode-car-stalls-w-full-accessory-mode.html

And that mustang screen has already had isssues BTW..........

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/2018-mustang-gt-lcd-panel-issues-warning.100433/
https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/digital-instrument-cluster-go-blank.114264/#post-2657611
https://www.motorsafety.org/ford-re...vigator-vehicles-for-instrument-panel-issues/
https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/new-recall-for-the-ipc-2019.117300/page-2
https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/digital-instrument-cluster-go-blank.114264/#post-2410514

I'm certainly not anti-electronics. I just put in a 16 camera surveilance system in my house.
Heck, I bought an electroncially controlled, $500, mosquito trap that even has built in
diagnositcs.............

https://luxjo.supermotors.net/MOSQUITO TRAP/2019/20190422_172719.jpg

And it REALLY works

https://luxjo.supermotors.net/MOSQUITO TRAP/2019/20190422_172210.jpg

But just this summer a wire broke off the heating element (emulates body heat and hot breath of human)
and it stopped working right. You would have thought that open resistance (uses ribbon heating element like the old
rear window defroster aftermarket kits used to) would have thrown an error code, but no dice. I only noticed it as I
pull the whole unit apart at end of season to clean out all the scum from larger dead bugs, that get stuck in it all summer.

Anyway, getting back to bronco. Are some of these sensors (heck, just an intercooler from ecoboosts) going to be unhappy jammed up with ice and snow? (like auto cruise or emerg braking sensors behind bumper). Because many love to go on snow runs, even if they don't do deep water or mud........... These are real concerns for those that want to push their newer rigs hard.............

But the manual transfer case, can be typically overhauled and then it is good for another 100K (or at least months/a year in
super hard core wheeling). So it is something that you deal with once. Electronics can get intermediatte bugs that are really
hard to fix (or sometimes even duplicate). And thats new, it just gets worse when older, introducing minor corrosion in harnesses, etc....


I would prefer no locking hubs, man TC (fine with electronic actuated center diff that can be used for AWD, but ideally would like to see it
manually lockable, in case it effs up). I'd be OK with slightly less gas mileage due to draging front drivetrain a long constantly due to no
locking hubs.

OX1- He posts more by 6AM than most people do all day...

The one thing I always thought was useless when it first came out was dual zone A/C.. It created so many problems with blend doors that would fail. Hated fixing A/C for something as useless as the dual zone failed.
Would get stuck Hot on passenger side while blowing cold on driver, or vise versa.. Too many moving parts..
My opinion of it today has not changed. Sure it’s way more reliable now, but I think it’s still dumb to put it in everything.

 

[Hack]

Which is why it is important to eliminate weight where possible, because that capacity can be allocated to useful components. That type of performance vehicle is no different than a track car trimming weight, but adding it back with more powerful brakes, ROPS, etc.

The very premise of this thread disgusts me. Nothing but a troll topic for the majority to **** on people with a different opinion. Which is why I didn't respond to it before.

Then you entirely missed the point of the thread, which is ultimately my fault.

You did title the thread using the word "technophobes".

I have to admit that when I read your post I immediately felt attacked and I wanted to defend myself.

I enjoy technology, but I don't want technology just for the sake of technology. If it does something for me, great. If it sucks, not so good.

Heated and cooled seats are awesome. I really like them. Same with phone and nav hookups. All that stuff is good. I also really like modern computerized traction aids - they can be very helpful in situations where it might be impossible to rescue yourself (I can't selectively dab the right rear brake to straighten a skid, for instance). Auto down/up windows, push button start, keyless entry - yes, yes, yes.

Typically it's the power train where I get heart burn. I don't hate 4 cylinder engines with turbos. I actually like the engine in my Fiesta ST. However, I don't want a 4 cylinder turbo in a Bronco. And I'd like a bigger engine in the Fiesta. I can forgive the Fiesta for having a tiny engine because it's a cheap car. But if a car is going to cost $40k or more and you can't even get a V8? I'm probably not interested. And I don't like electrics or hybrid power trains. I don't think they do what they are marketed as doing.

 

[Jake_zx2]

Adaptive cruise
Blind spot with cross traffic
Auto high beam
Lane keeping
Pre collision emerg braking
Active park assist
Active steering headlights
Rear view (or 360) cameras
Rrain sensing wipers
Auto darkening rear/side view mirrors
Auto up/down windows
Remote features (everything from door locking to wacthing video of inside of car)
Electronic shifter
Flat screen clusters


Some of it is really handy to me, like auto up/down windows, but most of it is at best uneeded.

Heated and cooled seats are awesome. I really like them. Same with phone and nav hookups. All that stuff is good. I also really like modern computerized traction aids - they can be very helpful in situations where it might be impossible to rescue yourself (I can't selectively dab the right rear brake to straighten a skid, for instance). Auto down/up windows, push button start, keyless entry - yes, yes, yes.

This is the root of the issue. Everyone has their own preferences of WHAT technology they’d like in their vehicle. But ultimately, there are certain people who write off technology as a whole simply because they don’t like certain features, and that’s where the assessment of “technophobe” comes from

personally, I hate ACC, auto headlights, rain sensing wipers, and if you consider it “technology”, automatic transmissions. But ultimately, I don’t go around saying “don’t give the Bronco too much tech” just because I don’t like those features and wouldn’t want them on my Bronco. Some people might like them, and that’s fine. And if I have to get them in order to keep the masses happy, that’s fine too because that’s what’s ultimately allowing me to get a Bronco in the first place

 

[Stampede.Offroad]

... ultimately, there are certain people who write off technology as a whole simply because they don’t like certain features, and that’s where the assessment of “technophobe” comes from.

If you're going to assign phobias based merely on disliking things, then I guess I'm an:

Uglyaphobe
Dumbaphobe
Expensiveaphobe
Lameaphobe
Boringaphobe
Pointlessaphobe

...and a bunch more "phobias" too by that definition.

 

[OX1]

If you're going to assign phobias based merely on disliking things, then I guess I'm an:

Uglyaphobe
Dumbaphobe
Expensiveaphobe
Lameaphobe
Boringaphobe
Pointlessaphobe

...and a bunch more "phobias" too by that definition.

I do have a stupidthreadaphobia and this one qualifies 110%.
My bad for getting suckered into it. Thread should be outright deleted or at
least moved to offtopic..............

 

[Stampede.Offroad]

Strangely enough I'm not a technophobe, even by this new definition. I just think there are some places it doesn't need to be.

Just like I'm not a Cakeaphobe because I think cake doesn't belong in my pants.

And I'm not an Arachnophobe because I don't want spiders in my hair.

And I'm not a Vegetableaphobe because I don't want vegetables in my drinking water.

 

[BroncoMike]

Not wanting/not using a feature is a far cry from irrational fear. It seems that few people here have an irrational fear of technology. I like it, if it has a point, makes something better or easier, as long as I can ignore it or better yet turn it off if I don't want it in a particular situation... or all the time for that matter. Most importantly, I don't want it to introduce an additional failure point, and preferably whatever it does can be manually controlled in case of failure so I don't have to park somewhere and walk.

There are people out there who are literally afraid of the computerized systems in cars to the point they won't consider purchasing one if it crosses a certain threshold of technological advancement (some will argue "advancement" is the wrong word here, but I can't think of anything else appropriate). Due to discussions in other threads, it appeared that there were a few anti-technology people on this forum, and I wanted to know where that threshold of trust lies among people with varying degrees of experience. Nobody has stated an opinion that to me qualifies as an irrational fear, but I have seen a range of viable concerns and examples of experiences in which tech has failed them.

I'm sorry if this thread offended anyone, but given the definition of "technophobe" and the responses thus far, I don't think anyone involved has cause to be offended. Perhaps an Internet forum - a place where people use computers to access the Internet - isn't the right place to find people who have an irrational fear of that very technology.

 

[Nickp]

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/de-modernizing-the-jl-jlu.41407/

Ask the Jeep guys

 

[BroncoMike]

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/de-modernizing-the-jl-jlu.41407/

Ask the Jeep guys

That was entertaining. Take a new JL and drop in a carbureted '70's engine, completely re-wire everything, because these new-fangled electronic-controlled widgets are too difficult to work on and I don't like sensors.

I'ma sign up over there and do a Mall Ninja thread on how I built my EMP-proof JL that is invisible to the NSA and automagically forwards robocalls to the IRS scammers.

Mall Ninja Thread (for those unfamiliar)

 

[Nickp]

Mall Ninja Thread (for those unfamiliar)

Link is broken but I assume you’re talking about my boy Gecko45?
https://lonelymachines.org/mall-ninjas/

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