FORD Motor Company and me a loyal customer Day 909 today ————

[Snowdogyyz]

I count my blessings, I was able to switch my order to a Raptor. I had a great dealer and gave me MSRP.

That said this Bronco launch is the biggest shit show I have ever seen of any new vehicle. Yes some of it is supply chain. Most of it is Fords piss poor management of the roll out. Fords Piss poor management of Reservations. Ford over promising and under delivering.

I feel this is miss management is going to cost Ford customers and even some who waited 700 plus days will never be a repeat customer..

Haven’t you heard? None of it is Fords fault!
(As usual it’s many causes including Ford, supply shortages, labor, etc). But I love reading the excuses taking ford out of any blame.

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[Booback]

Not being able to build orders is eating their lunch.

Not if demand exceeds supply and those orders can be sold at current market prices, not at a discount.

 

[22OBX]

Not if demand exceeds supply and those orders can be sold at current market prices, not at a discount.

Agree 100%, but if you can’t find any to build due to constraints , you can’t sell them.

 

[hemiblas]

Agree 100%, but if you can’t find any to build due to constraints , you can’t sell them.

Is that why they started selling Bronco Raptors? In the middle of a parts shortage? With reservation holders still waiting 2 plus years.

 

[Booback]

Agree 100%, but if you can’t find any to build due to constraints , you can’t sell them.

They are still building, just less of some.

 

[22OBX]

They are still building, just less of some.

Yeah and will really come to a slow if they don’t get people to update their orders to buildable orders. Be interesting to see January build numbers once done. Otherwise they wouldn’t be giving up $2500 to entice folks to change.

 

[widnere12]

Thanking God my Raptor Showed up earlier than expected and feeling bad for others getting stuck with 2 bad options.

 

[BroncoMum]

Do you think Ford had that meeting and slide presentation knowing it would become public before they have their final all inclusive dealership meeting on Tuesday to flesh out consumer response? Maybe the official rollout of their plan will look different. Just hoping for all those who have been waiting.

 

[DocFuller]

So just my 2 cents on the topic of push backs and reservations and what not. Now full disclosure I didn’t have a reservation, I had been following the rumor mill of the Bronco return for years before it materialized. When they first dropped reservations I waited to put one in because I really wanted a raptor and that was still rumors, well lost my opportunity as they closed the order banks and never re opened them.

I followed the trials and tribulations of both Ford, and the people patiently awaiting orders. I think there is a lot of things Ford screwed up. I also think there’s a lot of things that are outside their control so it is what it is.

Rolling out a new vehicle takes years of planning, design, sourcing, and a whole bunch of ish that most of us have 0 idea about. This also comes at a huge upfront cost before you sell a single vehicle, so for those bemoaning a business from wanting to turn a profit on a multi year X dollar investment, why does a business exist if not to make money?

I think Ford had LOFTY goals for the Bronco, and of course they “promised” things that haven’t come to fruition but wanting something to happen and making it happen are two different things. Something as simple as the off-road maps through Ford performance, seems easy enough but again likely has way more going into it than they anticipated. They should have just paired up with a company like OnX and rolled with it, but we can armchair quarterback literally ANYTHING to death.

Ford took I think just shy of 200,000 reservations for a brand new vehicle that had no production numbers. This is likely higher than anticipated and should have been shut off much sooner. To date I think Ford has produced something like 130,000 Broncos leaving AT LEAST another 70,000 reservations unfulfilled meaning most likely a full year of production going to original reservation holders with no new orders. Now while it may not be a huge portion of it there’s also certain numbers that don’t factor into this like the off-roadeo broncos, dealer display, etc. I have no clue what those numbers would total to but there’s something like 3000 dealerships in the US alone so probably not an insignificant amount of vehicles shuffled off to the side.

Then we get to dealer stock. I’m not sure exactly the verbiage but I’m sure Ford HAS to provide vehicles to their dealers, there’s a crazy amount of rules, regs, and laws protecting dealers and making sure they “get a fair shake” and for the dealers not killing people with ADM, hats off to you and they should get a better shake of inventory. This is precisely why Ford is splitting into two divisions and moving their electric vehicles to a direct order system. Dealers have to buy in to the tune of a million something in order to even get EVs to sell, and the price is locked by ford.

There’s also a certain level of breakage on any produced product that eats away at final numbers, and the average is 2-4% so that’s roughly 4-8000 broncos dead off the line, do not pass go, do not get to the train.

So all of this before we even get to the supply and labor shortage that the pandemic and resulting years has cost. One spot I think ford should invest time and money into is getting back to the basics and bringing product manufacturing back under their roof. That’s what made Ford so successful, it wasn’t just the assembly line idea that Henry pioneered, it was also owning the means of production, making their own parts cut cost, cut down time, and kept things moving smoothly. Now almost nothing is in house outside of assembly (from my understanding). When this happens that means you’re at the mercy of dozens of suppliers and manufacturers to make not only the number of parts you need, but also the quality you’re hoping for which clearly has been a problem for them.

Shit they took away the digital dials not because they wanted to but because they had to (allegedly) but at least they’re back now. In the semi conductor chip world automotive gets probably the lowest allocation of chips. Technology, TVs and gaming and such get the lion share and priority. I think it’s still nearly impossible to get the new PlayStation 5 and Xbox X and they’ve also been “out” for years, unless you want to pay higher prices then you can have it now.

The labor shortage makes all of this worse and vehicles that are complete can’t get shipped out because there’s not enough trucks and trains running to keep up. It’s such a multi faceted issue and I don’t think as simple as saying “Fuck ford they suck” but to each their own.

I personally can not speak to what reservation holders have been going through as I was not one. That being said I found a “close enough” bronco at a local dealership, used, and could not be happier with the purchase. What I can say is that if I was a reservation holder I would likely have compromised something to take delivery and not wait 3 years. I compromised on things when I found the Bronco I have now, because I just wanted the damn thing.

I think Ford is being very pragmatic with trying to clear the backlog and some people will absolutely walk away from them for it, but if you know you can’t get these parts and those vehicles won’t be built for X months then they should let people know and offer some sort of a solution.

But also from a business perspective none of the reservation holders have much skin in the game outside of small, refundable deposits. I would understand the level of outrage had you paid for the vehicle upfront. But no one gave Ford $50,000 when they placed their reservation, you didn’t buy a vehicle, you didn’t even sign a promissory note as annotated by people walking away from the vehicle or not picking it up or whatever happens then. You literally raised your hand and said, “Yes please I would like a Bronco” that’s it.

I can’t think of many things that I’ve preordered that the cost of the item or a significant deposit wasn’t taken IN ADVANCE of the product being produced.

Again I think there are a lot of things Ford bungled with the release and roll out, and a lot of things I think they should have done differently, but I’m sure they also wish they had done things differently. Hindsight is always 20/20.

I will still be a fan of Ford, I still like the Bronco and want a better one already (wish they had ventilated seats and memory options for the leather seats ) and should they come out with another great whip I’ll pick it up.

 

[2fast4u]

Here is what makes me Mad

You have dealers with my Spec sitting on their lot with high ADMs !

Me here waiting today day 910 and you’re telling me if mine does not get built this year you’re going to cancel my order and price protection what the hell kind of company does something like that!


How about Ford be a good Company. Let me find my spec sitting on a dealership lot and you can work out the details with the dealership to get me my Bronco!

 

[Maximus3311]

So just my 2 cents on the topic of push backs and reservations and what not. Now full disclosure I didn’t have a reservation, I had been following the rumor mill of the Bronco return for years before it materialized. When they first dropped reservations I waited to put one in because I really wanted a raptor and that was still rumors, well lost my opportunity as they closed the order banks and never re opened them.

I followed the trials and tribulations of both Ford, and the people patiently awaiting orders. I think there is a lot of things Ford screwed up. I also think there’s a lot of things that are outside their control so it is what it is.

Rolling out a new vehicle takes years of planning, design, sourcing, and a whole bunch of ish that most of us have 0 idea about. This also comes at a huge upfront cost before you sell a single vehicle, so for those bemoaning a business from wanting to turn a profit on a multi year X dollar investment, why does a business exist if not to make money?

I think Ford had LOFTY goals for the Bronco, and of course they “promised” things that haven’t come to fruition but wanting something to happen and making it happen are two different things. Something as simple as the off-road maps through Ford performance, seems easy enough but again likely has way more going into it than they anticipated. They should have just paired up with a company like OnX and rolled with it, but we can armchair quarterback literally ANYTHING to death.

Ford took I think just shy of 200,000 reservations for a brand new vehicle that had no production numbers. This is likely higher than anticipated and should have been shut off much sooner. To date I think Ford has produced something like 130,000 Broncos leaving AT LEAST another 70,000 reservations unfulfilled meaning most likely a full year of production going to original reservation holders with no new orders. Now while it may not be a huge portion of it there’s also certain numbers that don’t factor into this like the off-roadeo broncos, dealer display, etc. I have no clue what those numbers would total to but there’s something like 3000 dealerships in the US alone so probably not an insignificant amount of vehicles shuffled off to the side.

Then we get to dealer stock. I’m not sure exactly the verbiage but I’m sure Ford HAS to provide vehicles to their dealers, there’s a crazy amount of rules, regs, and laws protecting dealers and making sure they “get a fair shake” and for the dealers not killing people with ADM, hats off to you and they should get a better shake of inventory. This is precisely why Ford is splitting into two divisions and moving their electric vehicles to a direct order system. Dealers have to buy in to the tune of a million something in order to even get EVs to sell, and the price is locked by ford.

There’s also a certain level of breakage on any produced product that eats away at final numbers, and the average is 2-4% so that’s roughly 4-8000 broncos dead off the line, do not pass go, do not get to the train.

So all of this before we even get to the supply and labor shortage that the pandemic and resulting years has cost. One spot I think ford should invest time and money into is getting back to the basics and bringing product manufacturing back under their roof. That’s what made Ford so successful, it wasn’t just the assembly line idea that Henry pioneered, it was also owning the means of production, making their own parts cut cost, cut down time, and kept things moving smoothly. Now almost nothing is in house outside of assembly (from my understanding). When this happens that means you’re at the mercy of dozens of suppliers and manufacturers to make not only the number of parts you need, but also the quality you’re hoping for which clearly has been a problem for them.

Shit they took away the digital dials not because they wanted to but because they had to (allegedly) but at least they’re back now. In the semi conductor chip world automotive gets probably the lowest allocation of chips. Technology, TVs and gaming and such get the lion share and priority. I think it’s still nearly impossible to get the new PlayStation 5 and Xbox X and they’ve also been “out” for years, unless you want to pay higher prices then you can have it now.

The labor shortage makes all of this worse and vehicles that are complete can’t get shipped out because there’s not enough trucks and trains running to keep up. It’s such a multi faceted issue and I don’t think as simple as saying “Fuck ford they suck” but to each their own.

I personally can not speak to what reservation holders have been going through as I was not one. That being said I found a “close enough” bronco at a local dealership, used, and could not be happier with the purchase. What I can say is that if I was a reservation holder I would likely have compromised something to take delivery and not wait 3 years. I compromised on things when I found the Bronco I have now, because I just wanted the damn thing.

I think Ford is being very pragmatic with trying to clear the backlog and some people will absolutely walk away from them for it, but if you know you can’t get these parts and those vehicles won’t be built for X months then they should let people know and offer some sort of a solution.

But also from a business perspective none of the reservation holders have much skin in the game outside of small, refundable deposits. I would understand the level of outrage had you paid for the vehicle upfront. But no one gave Ford $50,000 when they placed their reservation, you didn’t buy a vehicle, you didn’t even sign a promissory note as annotated by people walking away from the vehicle or not picking it up or whatever happens then. You literally raised your hand and said, “Yes please I would like a Bronco” that’s it.

I can’t think of many things that I’ve preordered that the cost of the item or a significant deposit wasn’t taken IN ADVANCE of the product being produced.

Again I think there are a lot of things Ford bungled with the release and roll out, and a lot of things I think they should have done differently, but I’m sure they also wish they had done things differently. Hindsight is always 20/20.

I will still be a fan of Ford, I still like the Bronco and want a better one already (wish they had ventilated seats and memory options for the leather seats ) and should they come out with another great whip I’ll pick it up.

You make a lot of good points but I want to just throw in my two cents

We have plenty of skin in the game. It’s not just money - but *time*. I’m one of those people who has stuck with my original order because I was assured, time and time again, that it was coming. No set date and I understood that…but I patiently waited because I was told that would be rewarded. Some people were willing to take something they didn’t really want just have a bronco. “meh good enough” doesn’t work for me.

So a lot of us waited as the value of our current vehicles tanked on the used market while interest rates soared. And we waited because we were told our patience would be rewarded.

So “skin in the game” isn’t just $100 - it’s all the time we lost waiting for what we wanted and ordered (and we were told our patience would be rewarded).

As for the issues not being Ford’s fault - a couple thoughts on that. My grandfather owned a small business and he taught me some important rules he lived by. I think two of them are especially pertinent given what’s currently happening.

(1) Under promise and overdeliver.

(2)The mark of a good business isn’t just how it conducts itself when things are going smoothly. Rather, it’s how a business treats its customers when things go wrong. It’s easy to treat customers well if there aren’t any problems. But when the wheels are falling off - what will a company/business do to take care of their customers?

I think re: the first point you could *almost* somewhat absolve Ford. But the second part has been an utter disaster. To “thank” patient customers (who again *do* have skin in the game) they’ve said “remove the things you wanted that made this vehicle right for you. In exchange we’ll throw you enough money to (for instance) cover half the cost of a MIC top. Don’t like it? Well the *one* thing were doing to try and make this somewhat right (can’t restore time but can at least not penalize you financially for our unanticipated delays)? Yeah we’re going to make that go away.

Thanks for your patience and stay pumped!

That doesn’t work. I’m not compromising on a vehicle that, after taxes and registration is going to cost me in the ballpark of $70,000.

If they can’t build what I’ve been patiently waiting years for and have the decency to at least throw me the price protection bone for 2024 if they, yet again, can’t build my Bronco in 2023? I’ll buy something like the 2024 Tacoma TRD PRO or the GMC Canyon AT4X and I’ll never look at a Ford again.

Oh yeah my grandfather taught me another lesson - don’t ever reward a company for treating you like garbage.

I know Ford won’t miss me. I get it I’m just one person. But there are a lot of people who feel the same way and they’ll lose those customers and their families and a lot of friends (my family and friends have been watching this - and between me and my BIL and a buddy they’re losing 3 sales).

A vehicle like the Bronco is sold one vehicle at a time. Eventually one sale here and two sales there add up.

 

[Sgroll]

Exactly right I currently have 5 Ford in my family and one of those being my new Shelby GT500.

so if they care about skimping out, and saving $3000 on one car, they can kiss my a$$ going forward. I’ve been patient now for over 900 days.

I feel your pain. "Only" at 578 days waiting for a 2 door BD with mid package. Luckily for me it's a want more than a need. Hang in there!

 

[MellowYellow]

Here is what makes me Mad

You have dealers with my Spec sitting on their lot with high ADMs !

Me here waiting today day 910 and you’re telling me if mine does not get built this year you’re going to cancel my order and price protection what the hell kind of company does something like that!

How about Ford be a good Company. Let me find my spec sitting on a dealership lot and you can work out the details with the dealership to get me my Bronco!

it sucks, but at this point you have no one but yourself to blame. Pay the ADM, if you want it that badly. Negotiate, compromise. Or give up. And cry about it. I was a day one res holder like many. But rather than stick to my original day 1 dreams, I compromised here and there on my build, changed dealers, compromised again and now have a great truck. One I use every and enjoy on and Offroad. More than a year later most of the forum is still just stuck in the same place you are. Unable to budge. Unwilling to make their own path forward. These are not special vehicles that need to be caressed and worried about so much. Get what you can, go out there and start having fun. Or walk away. Stop putting so much of your negativity into the community.

You make a lot of good points but I want to just throw in my (short) two cents

We have plenty of skin in the game. It’s not just money - but *time*. I’m one of those people who has stuck with my original order because I was assured, time and time again, that it was coming. No set date and I understood that…but I patiently waited because I was told that would be rewarded. Some people were willing to take something they didn’t really want just have a bronco. “meh good enough” doesn’t work for me.

So a lot of us waited as the value of our current vehicles ranked on the used market while interest rates soared. And we waited because we were told our patience would be rewarded.

so “skin in the game” isn’t just $100 - it’s all the time we lost waiting for what we wanted and ordered (and we were told our patience would be rewarded).

As for the issues not being Ford’s fault - a couple thoughts on that. My grandfather owned a small business and he taught me some important rules he lived by. I think two of them are especially pertinent given what’s currently happening.

(1) Under promise and overdeliver.

(2)The mark of a good business isn’t just how it conducts itself when things are going smoothly. Rather, it’s how a business treats its customers when things go wrong. It’s easy to treat customers well if there aren’t any problems. But when the wheels are falling off - what will a company/business do to take care of their customers?

I think the first point you could *almost* somewhat absolve Ford. But the second part has been an utter disaster. To “thank” patient customers (who again *do* have skin in the game) they’ve said “remove the things you wanted that made this vehicle right for you. In exchange we’ll throw you enough moneyto (for instance) cover half the cost of a MIC top. Don’t like it? Well the *one* thing were doing to try and make this somewhat right (can’t restore time but can at least not penalize you financially for our unanticipated delays)? Yeah we’re going to make that go away.

Thanks for your patience and stay pumped!

That doesn’t work. I’m not compromising on a vehicle that, after taxes and registration is going to cost me in the ballpark of $70,000.

If they can’t build what I’ve been patiently waiting years for and have the decency to at least throw me the price protection bone for 2024 if they, yet again, can’t build my Bronco in 2023? I’ll buy something like the 2024 Tacoma TRD PR9 or the GMC Canyon AT4X and I’ll never look at a Ford again.

Oh yeah my grandfather taught me another lesson - don’t ever reward a company for treating you like garbage.

I know Ford won’t miss me. I get it I’m just one person. But there are a lot of people who feel the same way and they’ll lose those customers and their families and a lot of friends (my family and friends have been watching this - and between me and my BIL and a buddy they’re losing 3 sales).

A vehicle like the Bronco is sold one vehicle at a time. Eventually one sale here and two sales there add up.

they won’t, and the forum will be better off with less of this constant complaining.

 

[Maximus3311]

it sucks, but at this point you have no one but yourself to blame. Pay the ADM, if you want it that badly. Negotiate, compromise. Or give up. And cry about it. I was a day one res holder like many. But rather than stick to my original day 1 dreams, I compromised here and there on my build, changed dealers, compromised again and now have a great truck. One I use every and enjoy on and Offroad. More than a year later most of the forum is still just stuck in the same place you are. Unable to budge. Unwilling to make their own path forward. These are not special vehicles that need to be caressed and worried about so much. Get what you can, go out there and start having fun. Or walk away. Stop putting so much of your negativity into the community.





they won’t, and the forum will be better off with less of this constant complaining.

Ok thanks for sharing your opinion.

 

[Maximus3311]

it sucks, but at this point you have no one but yourself to blame. Pay the ADM, if you want it that badly. Negotiate, compromise. Or give up. And cry about it. I was a day one res holder like many. But rather than stick to my original day 1 dreams, I compromised here and there on my build, changed dealers, compromised again and now have a great truck. One I use every and enjoy on and Offroad. More than a year later most of the forum is still just stuck in the same place you are. Unable to budge. Unwilling to make their own path forward. These are not special vehicles that need to be caressed and worried about so much. Get what you can, go out there and start having fun. Or walk away. Stop putting so much of your negativity into the community.





they won’t, and the forum will be better off with less of this constant complaining.

Actually one other thing you said - this stuck out to me: "it sucks, but at this point you have no one but yourself to blame. Pay the ADM, if you want it that badly. Negotiate, compromise. Or give up. And cry about it."

That's not really fair. In one sense you're correct - if a person is willing to take a spec they don't really want and pay too much for...well you're right. But here's the issue:

A lot of us were willing to wait to get exactly what we wanted (and not get taken to the cleaners buying dealer stock).

I was ok to wait. My plan was to keep this Bronco for a really long time (assuming it wasn't a POS) and eventually garage it in Anchorage. I'm looking for land up there to buy and put up a small fishing cabin as a vacation spot. So the Bronco is specced out appropriately for what I plan to eventually use it for. Why should we have to "negotiate/compromise" on an SUV that's going to be $70,000+ out the door? This isn't a customer going onto a used car lot and saying "I have terrible credit and $6,000...what can I get?"

The issue for a lot of us (at least for me) isn't how long it's taken. When I placed my official "order" in Feb 21 I knew it was going to be a long time. Hell when I had to reorder for MY2023 I had a long conversation with my dealer and sales manager about my order and how it looked. "A lot of constraints but your build looks great and from what we've been told by Ford you'll get it by the end of summer".

It would be one thing if Ford had been open from the beginning. But to drop news like we're apparently about to get i.e. Drop the things that most of the outstanding reservations want or else...that's just messed up.

For your part - telling someone "go cry about it" who's (IMO) rightfully pissed off because they feel like they've been led on for years only to have the rug yanked out from under them...not cool.

I'm disappointed because I doubt I get the Bronco I want - but if Ford can't get it to me I'll get something else.

I also don't know if I'd classify a lot of what goes on here as "whining". One of my buddies ordered the exactly same loaded Badlands that I did. He ordered his two week after I did and he's had his since last summer.

It's not "whining" to be annoyed that Ford fucked this rollout but kept dangling the carrot to keep people waiting. Sure - I get that it was maybe "good business" to them to keep people engaged so we didn't go out and buy something else...but it's not whining for a customer who feels like they've gotten the shaft to call it out.

Again - not really pissed with the wait time so much as garbage like telling us to change trims/drop constraints (oh and it appears we're going to have about 4-5 days to make those decisions).

If it bothers you to read posts where people are upset - it's a free country you're welcome to ignore those and stick to the "what did you do with/to your Bronco today?"

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