Front Locker Upgrade?

[Lcubed]

So it sounds like you can't use a front locker if you are turning while off road? That doesn't make sense to me. The two front wheels need to spin at different rates in a turn (inside vs outside wheel) but so does the rear? Why is it ok for the rear but not the front?

In addition, I take it many folks think a rear locker + a locked transfer case + open front diff can be driven on say roads, say in rainy or snowy weather?

lockers are fun. with the center diff locked on slippery ground, there's typically enough slippage not to wind up the transfer case and steering is okay. locking the rear diff,
and you'll start to get some plowing, but usually steering still works. locking the front,
and even with the wheels cranked over, sometimes the vehicle will still go straight.

this can be really frustrating on a muddy uphill with a sharp turn halfway up

really wouldn't recommend locking the center diff and the rear locker on pavement unless you're on a boat ramp.

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[RedHotLava]

your'e really only going to be using lockers in super stuck, challenging, specific situations, where you need all 3 (rear locker) or 4 (front and rear lockers) to engage and move you along then unlock. You can turn, just limited turning radius.

I think some may have the idea they're going to be locking in rain on pavement or something. Not the case. You'll be in 4 wheel high usually anywhere you're wheeling until you get to specific challenging parts and super bumpy places, where you'll be in first gear regardless.

my 2 cents.

 

[Mattwings]

You can turn the wheels locked, but the changing of the steering angles , plus the position of the axle and the relatively lighter axle all adds up to more stress on the differential/axle and more resistance to turning (inside tire turning slower than outside tire)all exaggerated when locked. It will disconnect at 20mph or possibly slower. My rear locker currently automatically turns off at 20.

 

[kodiakisland]

Thats what the dropout looks like. Makes me wana puke every time I look at it...but that's what we are getting. I dunno about U but I dont ever wana have to F##k w/that thing!

If it's anything like Toyota's removable clamshell, it wont be that bad. You only remove one CV axle and one tube. Hard to tell if it's designed the same, but with the Toyota it's easy to get the clamshell out to install/replace gears/locker. For toyotas anyway, it makes swapping gears an easier do it yourself project as the rear has a removable carrier as well.

Edit to add the above is wrong as I do remember having to remove both axles last time I removed the clamshell, but still just one of the tubes. Was easy enough to do by myself, although help would have been welcome.

 

[Bmadda]

If it's anything like Toyota's removable clamshell, it wont be that bad. You only remove one CV axle and one tube. Hard to tell if it's designed the same, but with the Toyota it's easy to get the clamshell out to install/replace gears/locker. For toyotas anyway, it makes swapping gears an easier do it yourself project as the rear has a removable carrier as well.

Edit to add the above is wrong as I do remember having to remove both axles last time I removed the clamshell, but still just one of the tubes. Was easy enough to do by myself, although help would have been welcome.

I have my doubts that there will be much aftermarket support for it...at least not for a while. My advice would be if you think you want a frt locker at some point your best bet is to get one from the factory. If you think "aww i can always upgrade later" you most likely never will. You don't NEED one really at all, and you will NEVER use it on pavement even in snow. You will find out very quickly what it is for and what it isn't for if u get a chance to play around w/one. I have them on 3 vehicles and I have very specific parts of trails I use them on. The rear sometimes just for fun, but the front is just for serious business!

 

[kodiakisland]

I have my doubts that there will be much aftermarket support for it...at least not for a while. My advice would be if you think you want a frt locker at some point your best bet is to get one from the factory. If you think "aww i can always upgrade later" you most likely never will. You don't NEED one really at all, and you will NEVER use it on pavement even in snow. You will find out very quickly what it is for and what it isn't for if u get a chance to play around w/one. I have them on 3 vehicles and I have very specific parts of trails I use them on. The rear sometimes just for fun, but the front is just for serious business!

Yes, definitely on the locker. I just hope the e-lockers work better in Fords than they do in Toyotas. They have issues of not engaging and also not disengaging.
Was thinking more for ease of changing gears to get the clamshell out. Although a locker can be added at the same time.

 

[Bmadda]

Yes, definitely on the locker. I just hope the e-lockers work better in Fords than they do in Toyotas. They have issues of not engaging and also not disengaging.
Was thinking more for ease of changing gears to get the clamshell out. Although a locker can be added at the same time.

I have auburn "ecteds" in my yj. They are complete garbage. I do seriously hope they have come up with something MUCH better for a factory install that Ford will stand behind. The vids that have been posted from rubicon and moab clearly demonstrate they have tested them thoroughly, so that has eased my concern somewhat! I'm eager to find out! I do know some people w/ram power wagon...that had elockers (factory) and they never complained about them...so it can be done?

 

[da_jokker]

Ah... my xj right now does not have any lockers at all. So anything it starts to rain good or I go on dirt, I put it in 4H and off I go.

But with that said, I've tried to climb a few spots where the XJ couldn't get enough traction and like mentioned, the Moment one of the wheels come off the ground and that axle is done for.

So I'm getting Sasquatch, without a doubt... but sounds like either 4A in those cases, or only locking once I actually start slipping and not just because I'm on dirt.

But I guess that's why people like me need GOAT ?

 

[Bmadda]

Ah... my xj right now does not have any lockers at all. So anything it starts to rain good or I go on dirt, I put it in 4H and off I go.

But with that said, I've tried to climb a few spots where the XJ couldn't get enough traction and like mentioned, the Moment one of the wheels come off the ground and that axle is done for.

So I'm getting Sasquatch, without a doubt... but sounds like either 4A in those cases, or only locking once I actually start slipping and not just because I'm on dirt.

But I guess that's why people like me need GOAT ?

Its highly likely that it will only allow lockers to engage in 4lo...thats how power wagon was. Somebody came up w/a little wiring dongle that allowed locker engagement in any gear. There might be a clever fella who finds a hack for Bronco when it comes out also, but like I said you will figure out in short order what its for. My xj I did "lunchbox" locker in rear, and my Bronco doesn't have a rear yet (still on the shopping list) so it really is about the front. The rear you could weld solid and the truck would still be driveable...just makes tire chirps when u turn sharp in a parking lot. I know guys who have done that...they call it a "Lincoln locker" cause Lincoln sells alot of welders!

 

[Cheshire]

your'e really only going to be using lockers in super stuck, challenging, specific situations, where you need all 3 (rear locker) or 4 (front and rear lockers) to engage and move you along then unlock. You can turn, just limited turning radius.

I think some may have the idea they're going to be locking in rain on pavement or something. Not the case. You'll be in 4 wheel high usually anywhere you're wheeling until you get to specific challenging parts and super bumpy places, where you'll be in first gear regardless.

my 2 cents.

Agree, you definitely do NOT want to use lockers on pavement, period! You can hurt the vehicle if you do. When turning, your tires roll at different speeds, but with lockers engaged the wheels rotate at the same speed, so something must give. This adds big stress on the slower wheel which gets released by slippage or worse by breaking something. Only exception is maybe if there's 6 inches of fresh snow on the highway, but in that situation 4WH is plenty. I've had 2 LR Def 90's and 3 Wrangler Rubicons. Most people who buy a Bronco will never need to use lockers, front or rear.

 

[DrewBronc21]

Wouldn’t you need the upgraded front axle to run the front lockers? I Think this is going to be big $$ to add aftermarket.

 

[Mountain Goat]

I'm hoping I can upgrade to the Advanced 4WD transfer case (for the lower low range) and M210s on the BD with MT. I don't really care if I can get the front locker or not, it would be nice but I've lived without one on every off-road vehicle I've owned. I won't believe I can really get this setup until I've seen it myself on the B&P - I truly hope Ford is giving some flexibility for adding these off-road goodies to manual transmission rigs that don't have "Badlands" in their name.

If I can get all the features listed above, the BD will be more than enough for me as I can always upgrade to 33/34/35" tires later without concern for breaking ring gears on the trail.

What I would really like to see the aftermarket eventually offer is a front torsen, such as the Eaton TrueTrac. Between a rear E-locker, front torsen, off road traction control, and even the option for 4A on-road driving in winter time, that would be a "set it and forget it" option that I think would be very capable and enjoyable. I considered adding torsens in my old Discovery 1, and probably would have done so by now if I hadn't sold it many years ago when I moved to the East coast. Anyway, since it had no traction control my setup would have worked like the old Humvees - with some left foot braking required to simulate locking action.

 

[Bmadda]

I'm hoping I can upgrade to the Advanced 4WD transfer case (for the lower low range) and M210s on the BD with MT. I don't really care if I can get the front locker or not, it would be nice but I've lived without one on every off-road vehicle I've owned. I won't believe I can really get this setup until I've seen it myself on the B&P - I truly hope Ford is giving some flexibility for adding these off-road goodies to manual transmission rigs that don't have "Badlands" in their name.

If I can get all the features listed above, the BD will be more than enough for me as I can always upgrade to 33/34/35" tires later without concern for breaking ring gears on the trail.

What I would really like to see the aftermarket eventually offer is a front torsen, such as the Eaton TrueTrac. Between a rear E-locker, front torsen, off road traction control, and even the option for 4A on-road driving in winter time, that would be a "set it and forget it" option that I think would be very capable and enjoyable. I considered adding torsens in my old Discovery 1, and probably would have done so by now if I hadn't sold it many years ago when I moved to the East coast. Anyway, since it had no traction control my setup would have worked like the old Humvees - with some left foot braking required to simulate locking action.

Truetrac doesn't work off road at all. I have some experience w/those...worse than LSD. Might as well just leave it open if you were going to go that route.

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