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dgorsett

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I want to share a simple diagram I made that illustrates the suspension bind myself and some others were talking about. Even if its not the root cause in this case, it is worth considering when looking into suspension components with compliant joints vs rigid joints. (on OEM suspension geometry)

This is not too scale, but representative of the side view (what matters here) of the Bronco rear suspension (as well as most OEM 5 link set ups).
1685025556170.png


The upper control arm and lower control arm are different lengths and not parallel. The angle between them is more relevant than the difference in length in this case. Because the arms are not parallel, (and to a lesser degree, different lengths), as the suspension moves up or down, the axle rotates forward and backward. The primary goal of this is to help counteract the forces that squat or jack the rear suspension during forward acceleration or braking. You can visualize this by imagining the torque induced at the axle by brake or driveline torque, and how it wants to lift or lower the suspension. For example, you step on the gas, the wheel torque is counter clockwise, the reaction torque at the axle is clockwise, which wants to pull the suspension down because of the angle of the links. This helps counteract the rear squat that naturally occurs as the vehicle accelerates forward and weight is transferred to the rear. The opposite is true for breaking. A secondary goal of this is to help the axle pinion angle stay more aligned to the transmission or carrier bearing throughout the suspension travel. And of course beyond both of these goals there are all kinds of packaging limitations, costs, weight, durability, and NVH to consider.

Now lets look at the suspension when one side is all the way up, and the other is all the way down. (again, not to scale)

1685026026154.png


You can see that if the joints both at the frame and axle have no compliance, the axle is forced to be at a different angle between the left and right side. Axles are very strong, but when you pit it against the frame, and very robust linkages/joints, and brackets, its going to slip. If you make the axle stronger, one of those other things will give out or flex (flex may be fine but could eventually lead to fatigue failure). From the OEM perspective, the bushings themselves give. This not only helps NVH, and long term durability of the joint, it allows the axle to behave and handle well on flat surfaces as well as give the compliance needed to articulate reasonably well.

If you want to run rigid links, you either need to adjust the suspension geometry (parallel links, or triangulated) or you need to remove one of the control arms. When you remove one control arm, only the suspension arms at one side of the axle will dictate the angle of the axle (thus no binding). Meaning the torque/braking loads will be counteracted by only one side of the suspension. The side with both links. How well this could function depends on a lot of factors and probably wouldn't work well in an otherwise OEM set up. Triangulated is widely regarded as the best solution (deletes the track bar) but is also the hardest to pull off in an otherwise OEM set up. Aftermarket may offer solutions to run longer and more parallel arms (requires different frame/axle mounts) as a good solution and alternative to triangulating links or deleting a link.

Disclaimer that this is not professional advice, just take this as my observations. Much of this can be found and explained in engineering vehicle dynamics books.
Thanks, this is what I was try to say in my earlier post. Your thorough explanation and graphics make it clear.
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broncobase1

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It should go without saying when you make significant modifications you can't expect to get warrantee coverage for parts affected by the modifications.
 

mcinfantry

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It should go without saying when you make significant modifications you can't expect to get warrantee coverage for parts affected by the modifications.
But they did warranty it

also
He said
Magnussen MOSS 3 times in the SIDE VIEW see mirror and a lawyer genie appeared and the service manager started crying (seriously. Ask the Facebook experts on here that’s LITERALLY HOW IT WORKS)
 

Hey Buddy

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I just received news that it will be covered and replaced under warranty. Do not quote me on this but the response I received was that the Ford field rep has seen a number of these with the exact same issue and it is believed to be a bad batch of rear assemblies.
That is great news!!
I guess there will always be supplier issues, just like the MIC Hard Top problems?
It is good to know that Ford is going to stand behind this issue.
 

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0ne

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I just received news that it will be covered and replaced under warranty. Do not quote me on this but the response I received was that the Ford field rep has seen a number of these with the exact same issue and it is believed to be a bad batch of rear assemblies.
🍻 dealer says? 🤷‍♂️🤞
 

vrtical

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bet theres a TSB at some point.
 

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With all due respect you don't know a lot about mechanical design. Of course 37" tires are going to put more strain on components than 33, and what's with the new 33" nonsense? You can have an opinion that it shouldn't have failed and that's fine, but no manufacture is going to warrantee parts affected by this kind of modifications. Typically damage caused by hard-core off roading isn't going to be covered either. I know a Jeep owner who spent $3000 in repairs after off roading, and he said its not uncommon.
With all due respect you don't know me and your example is anecdotal. But hey, knowing a guy with a jeep who spent $3k on repairs so you clearly know stuff....
 

Neigh

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I am revising this post to clarify Ford is replacing the axle under warranty
Need a bit more clarification.

Did Ford make the call to replace it? Or did your Ford dealer make the call?

If Ford made the call to replace it then that's big news.

If your Ford dealer made the call to replace it then that could still be subject to a chargeback against the dealer if Ford disagrees.
 

Sewie

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BAUS67

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I want to share a simple diagram I made that illustrates the suspension bind myself and some others were talking about. Even if its not the root cause in this case, it is worth considering when looking into suspension components with compliant joints vs rigid joints. (on OEM suspension geometry)

This is not too scale, but representative of the side view (what matters here) of the Bronco rear suspension (as well as most OEM 5 link set ups).
1685025556170.png


The upper control arm and lower control arm are different lengths and not parallel. The angle between them is more relevant than the difference in length in this case. Because the arms are not parallel, (and to a lesser degree, different lengths), as the suspension moves up or down, the axle rotates forward and backward. The primary goal of this is to help counteract the forces that squat or jack the rear suspension during forward acceleration or braking. You can visualize this by imagining the torque induced at the axle by brake or driveline torque, and how it wants to lift or lower the suspension. For example, you step on the gas, the wheel torque is counter clockwise, the reaction torque at the axle is clockwise, which wants to pull the suspension down because of the angle of the links. This helps counteract the rear squat that naturally occurs as the vehicle accelerates forward and weight is transferred to the rear. The opposite is true for breaking. A secondary goal of this is to help the axle pinion angle stay more aligned to the transmission or carrier bearing throughout the suspension travel. And of course beyond both of these goals there are all kinds of packaging limitations, costs, weight, durability, and NVH to consider.

Now lets look at the suspension when one side is all the way up, and the other is all the way down. (again, not to scale)

1685026026154.png


You can see that if the joints both at the frame and axle have no compliance, the axle is forced to be at a different angle between the left and right side. Axles are very strong, but when you pit it against the frame, and very robust linkages/joints, and brackets, its going to slip. If you make the axle stronger, one of those other things will give out or flex (flex may be fine but could eventually lead to fatigue failure). From the OEM perspective, the bushings themselves give. This not only helps NVH, and long term durability of the joint, it allows the axle to behave and handle well on flat surfaces as well as give the compliance needed to articulate reasonably well.

If you want to run rigid links, you either need to adjust the suspension geometry (parallel links, or triangulated) or you need to remove one of the control arms. When you remove one control arm, only the suspension arms at one side of the axle will dictate the angle of the axle (thus no binding). Meaning the torque/braking loads will be counteracted by only one side of the suspension. The side with both links. How well this could function depends on a lot of factors and probably wouldn't work well in an otherwise OEM set up. Triangulated is widely regarded as the best solution (deletes the track bar) but is also the hardest to pull off in an otherwise OEM set up. Aftermarket may offer solutions to run longer and more parallel arms (requires different frame/axle mounts) as a good solution and alternative to triangulating links or deleting a link.

Disclaimer that this is not professional advice, just take this as my observations. Much of this can be found and explained in engineering vehicle dynamics books.

Very good explanation, in laymans terms, Teocali. Nice work. 😁 There is a shitton of stuff that goes into a proper link setup. I was dabbling into figuring it all out when I was going to long arm my TJ. Just when you think you got it figured out something else rears its ugly head that you need to work around. It gives me a headache just trying to figure it all out. 😆 3 links, 4 links, anti squat, anti dive, roll center, instant center, etc.
 
Last edited:

RedHotLava

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I just received news that it will be covered and replaced under warranty. Do not quote me on this but the response I received was that the Ford field rep has seen a number of these with the exact same issue and it is believed to be a bad batch of rear assemblies.
Congrats dude, that's awesome.
Also, ask him how can we tell if we're part of that batch?
I ask because mine was produced in February as well.
 
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kgolive

kgolive

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Congrats dude, that's awesome.
Also, ask him how can we tell if we're part of that batch?
I ask because mine was produced in February as well.
I’ll have to wait to get more details. My truck was built in November and I bought it in December.
 

akturbo

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So, I can't tell if my welds are leaking or if the diff cover is leaking. 2021 SAS on 35s. The plug welds are ugly and the drain plug looks odd as well. The passenger side is dry.

Ford Bronco Update: Rear Axle Tube  - 1200 Miles Warranty Covered IMG_8291

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Ford Bronco Update: Rear Axle Tube  - 1200 Miles Warranty Covered IMG_8289


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Ford Bronco Update: Rear Axle Tube  - 1200 Miles Warranty Covered IMG_8287


Ford Bronco Update: Rear Axle Tube  - 1200 Miles Warranty Covered IMG_8294
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